Kevin Garnett vs Kawhi Leonard

[durantbird]

Both are signed up to a draft in the beginning of their career. Who would you rather build around for today?

[tsherkin]

Early thought is Garnett.

While he's not the most ideal focal scorer, his defense is there and very much applicable to the modern game, and Kawhi didn't bring his full D when he turned into a scorer. KG's combination of defense and passing is extremely appealing, and he has enough scoring game to put all that together and earn his check, but can clearly play with another scorer without much issue. More than one, in fact.

I like Kawhi a lot, when he's healthy, but he doesn't solve as many pieces of the puzzle at once as KG.

[Ol Roy]

Without or without injuries, Garnett. I'd use him on the perimeter more, utilizing his great passing, and I'd have him shoot threes instead of long twos.

[DraymondGold]

Definitely Garnett.

KG likely has the better peak, unless you have an especially modernist view, or especially value 1a offensive guys, or are especially critical of KG's playoff performances and high on Kawhi's. KG has the inarguable and significant longevity advantage. Then the health concerns makes it pretty hard to take Kawhi. Which is no shame to Kawhi -- he was a fantastic MVP level player at his best, despite leaving so much on the table with the injuries.

I think the more interesting question is how much would Kawhi need to be boosted to take him over KG.

For example, let's say Kawhi was given progressively better upgrades...
a) guaranteed health
b) guaranteed health and ~2017 level defense throughout prime (i.e. a clear boost on defense as he's older, but not peak levels)
c) guaranteed health and ~2016 level defense throughout prime (i.e. near peak level defense throughout prime)
d) guaranteed health and ~2016 level defense and ~2021 level passing throughout prime (i.e a clear boost in passing when he was younger)
e) guaranteed health and ~2016 level defense and ~2021 level passing and ~2016 level three point shooting throughout prime (i.e. a clear boost in three point shooting throughout his career)
... at what point if any would you take Kawhi over KG?

Kawhi was one of those interesting guys who peaked on offense and defense at very different times, and never combined his best abilities. Some of that was driven by Kawhi's limitations to his motor. He didn't have the stamina or motor to maintain his peak defensive effort as his offensive load increased. And indeed, I think these motor/stamina issues are related to why he's seen as such a playoff improver -- he would take his foot off the gas a bit in the regular season, with coasting and missed games, so that he could save his motor for the playoffs, in addition to the load management for injury prevention. Some of the separate defensive and offensive peaks are also driven by his changing athleticism; he grew stronger as he got older, which helped him shoulder his large scoring load, but at the cost of the quickness that helped his perimeter man defense. Still, he peaked so high on offense and defense, that I think his overall peak would improve significantly if we combined his best on both ends.

[Jaivl]

I would not take *peak* Kawhi Leonard over Garnett, nevermind the massive avaliability and longevity differences.

[dygaction]

You have to add an imaginary all healthy Kawhi for this to be a reasonable comparison

[Cavsfansince84]

I think the only way to make this sort of a debate is to delve a bit too deep into hypothetical scenarios re Kawhi's long term health. I'm not that high on KG's leadership but Kawhi is one of guys I'm definitely even lower on. In some ways he's dependable in terms of on court production but in terms of mixing offense+defense over a 8-10 year prime and off the court stuff that's also either unknown or working against him. KG is intense and had issues getting along with others pre Boston but he's pretty much a known quantity.

[f4p]

Kawhi is perfectly healthy (or as healthy as KG)?

Then kawhi fairly comfortably. High efficiency, high volume iso scoring in the playoffs (or at least being an offensive hub like Magic) seems to be the most valuable skill in nba history since Russell hung them up.

MJ and Lebron being the obviously examples but then Hakeem or bird/magic, Shaqs unstoppableness, evens someone like 2003 Duncan or 2006 wade just taking over the finals and then Kobe making 3 straight alpha finals. And now Giannis and jokic or even sort of Shai.

Maybe history just played out weirdly that the best offensive hubs (and usually scorers) ended up on the best teams by chance, but they win a lot by being reliable in the biggest moments, which seems to be an unreplaceable skill.

And kawhi gives you that like basically nobody bit Lebron in this era and it proved itself out in 2019 and was doing so in 2017 and 2021 until injuries or even his 2 games a few years ago.

And he might not have KGs overall defensive impact but no one’s going at him and he guarded Giannis just fine while being having a huge offensive burden in 2019. Garnett is aesthetically pleasing in all the things he does, but I think kawhi specializes in the things that have lost reliably won rings.

[One_and_Done]

Peak is Kawhi, but given health you have to take KG for his career.