Hakeem Olajuwon might be the best player I've ever seen!

[TheGeneral99]

I'm not as familiar on the history but can someone give me more context why the Rockets lost in the 1st round from 1987-1990 and missed the playoffs in 1991?

Thanks.

[Onlytimewilltel]

Definitely top 10 GOAT

[dhsilv2]

I'm not as familiar on the history but can someone give me more context why the Rockets lost in the 1st round from 1987-1990 and missed the playoffs in 1991?

Thanks.

Mostly they couldn't score enough. Now the question is how much was on Hakeem's passing and decision making (he was clearly scoring like crazy) and how much was on teammates.

That was what lead Rudy T to create that whole wheel spoke offense to make passing and getting teammates involved better in 1993. So I guess you could argue it was his coaches too. Either way, Hakeem wasn't having the offensive impact his PPG might lead one to believe.

[tsherkin]

I was a massive Lakers fan then. '86 was heartbreaking, but '87 was the greatest finals ever.

Beating Boston was always sweet. xD Doing it while Magic absolutely savaged them was even more awesome (watching retrospectively) for me, because he's my favorite player

[bonita_the_frog]

Olajuwon's passing was breathtakingly brilliant in the 1994 and 1995 playoffs, pure perfection (i've watched A LOT of his playoff games recently).
That's probably the biggest reason why Houston became champs, given how much i've heard people say Olajuwon wasn't a good passer early on...

[dhsilv2]

Olajuwon's passing was breathtakingly brilliant in the 1994 and 1995 playoffs, pure perfection (i've watched A LOT of his playoff games recently).
That's probably the biggest reason why Houston became champs, given how much i've heard people say Olajuwon wasn't a good passer early on...

He was a decent passer in a system that was built to make the passes easy for him...he was still far from a great passer.

[MarcusBrody]

I've written posts multiple times on this forum, but my view is that Hakeem was an absolute all time great defender but just a all time good offensive player. His game was extremely pretty, but he wasn't amazingly efficient but took a ton of shots nor was he a good passer for most of his career. He did have real offensive value for sure by providing volume scoring on slightly above average efficiency, but when you look at any comparative metric of either individual points added (which looks at league average efficiency taking into the account of possessions used by the player) or team offense, Hakeem looks to be two levels below the true all time offensive great centers (and offensively at/below a lot of players we consider him better than).

So I have him in my top 10 and rocked a Rockets kangaroo pocket Starter jacket in the 90s because of him, but his offense isn't strong enough to be in the top tier GOAT conversation for me.

[70sFan]

Olajuwon's passing was breathtakingly brilliant in the 1994 and 1995 playoffs, pure perfection (i've watched A LOT of his playoff games recently).
That's probably the biggest reason why Houston became champs, given how much i've heard people say Olajuwon wasn't a good passer early on...

Now that's a massive exaggeration. Rudy created a system that helped Hakeem to find openings by making reads as easy as possible and creating a lot of spacing around him. Credit to Hakeem for quick adjustment and natural improvement, but calling his passing "breathtakingly brilliant" is way too much. He still missed a lot of reads that wasn't super-advanced, he rarely threw cross court passes and he still had a tunnel vision more times than not.

[Mirotic12]

Hakeem had the two greatest individual playoff runs in NBA history, doing it in back to back years, in '94 and '95.

At his peak, he was just an incredible player. It really is a shame that the Rockets didn't put a decent team around him for most of his career.

Hakeem got the Rockets to the finals in '86 and beat the showtime Lakers in the conference finals, before losing to a top 5 all time team in history ('86 Celtics) in the finals in 6 games.

Then the Rockets failed to give him a decent team for the next 6 seasons. They really wasted most of his prime with incompetent management.

[Cavsfansince84]

In terms of combining size, athleticism and fluidity there's never been anyone else like Hakeem. Which doesn't mean I'm saying he's the goat but I have him just below goat tier. Above both Magic and Bird.

[tsherkin]

His game was extremely pretty, but he wasn't amazingly efficient but took a ton of shots

Worth noting that his playoff efficiency is about the same as Kobe Bryant's 10-year prime, regular-season efficiency, or about 3, 3.5% above league average. While that isn't tier-1 ATG, it's still pretty amazing at volume, and the more so because he was doing it in the playoffs and elevating up from his RS efficiency. And yeah, as I'd mentioned earlier, also a very strong offensive rebounder in his twenties.

[picc]

His defense was the greatest of all time IMO, and then he'd give you 30ppg on top of that. Not difficult to make his GOAT case even if i disagree.

[SkyHook]

I was a massive Lakers fan then. '86 was heartbreaking, but '87 was the greatest finals ever.

Beating Boston was always sweet. xD Doing it while Magic absolutely savaged them was even more awesome (watching retrospectively) for me, because he's my favorite player

Kareem for me.

[MarcusBrody]

His game was extremely pretty, but he wasn't amazingly efficient but took a ton of shots

Worth noting that his playoff efficiency is about the same as Kobe Bryant's 10-year prime, regular-season efficiency, or about 3, 3.5% above league average. While that isn't tier-1 ATG, it's still pretty amazing at volume, and the more so because he was doing it in the playoffs and elevating up from his RS efficiency. And yeah, as I'd mentioned earlier, also a very strong offensive rebounder in his twenties.

Good additions!

I just want to be clear that my "criticism" of Hakeem's offense is only when thinking about where he falls within the top 15 players ever, Being able to put up the numbers he did on slightly better than average efficiency (and as you say, raise it in the playoffs) puts him ahead of 97% of all players ever. It just comes into the discussion when talking about whether he might be the best player ever

[tsherkin]

Kareem for me.

He's up there for me. The skyhook is so sweet. I used to teach use it all the time, and then taught it when I coached. And Magic's little junior, junior skyhook, too xD

[tsherkin]

I just want to be clear that my "criticism" of Hakeem's offense is only when thinking about where he falls within the top 15 players ever, Being able to put up the numbers he did on slightly better than average efficiency (and as you say, raise it in the playoffs) puts him ahead of 97% of all players ever. It just comes into the discussion when talking about whether he might be the best player ever

Sure, relative to some other guys at the apex of the game, it's a little lighter, that's fair.

[DaPessimist]

He's on a lot of people's top 10 GOAT list for a reason. He just lacks the accolades to match up to the guys at the top of the list.

[JJ_PR]

I still think he was better than Shaq.

It's an interesting question. He was far better defensively, and his general availability was better than Shaq's. Rookie year through 97, he was about a 24/12/3 guy, and a killer on the O-boards (10.7% ORB). 104 TS+ in the RS, 107 in the playoffs. Shaq (cutting off 4 years younger because he stopped being a focal option far earlier due to Kobe reasons and joining Wade, etc) was about a 28/12/3 guy in his hey day, even more of a monster on the O-boards (12.1% ORB), shot almost 58% from the field (led the league in FG% 6 times in that span), was a 111 TS+ guy in the RS and 108 in the playoffs.

So, after that first pass, you can see some of the offensive value difference in the RS. More scoring on higher efficiency, better offensive-rebounding over the span (but we have 4 extra years of aging Hakeem, so if you use to the same age, it's basically identical; Shaq did just maintain better over time due to his size), obvious difference in foul pressure is also in there. He was a better passer, though it doesn't really show in pure APG (2.7 for Hakeem vs 2.8 apg for Shaq).

But that defense. It's a huge thing. And of course, Olajuwon was a better FT shooter with more range, too. And then their playoff scoring efficiency isn't very different at all.

There's a compelling argument to be made there.

Shaq was a freak physically; Hakeem was freakishly skilled. For me it's a toss-up on who is better between those two.

[SNPA]

He might be an ok bench player in today’s league.

-Usual PC board suspects

[Ol Roy]

I prefer young Hakeem to the consensus "peak" Hakeem.

A true high motor cheat code. As Jordan said, a small forward playing center.