Bears 12.0

[panthermark]

I'm not big Herbert fan.
He is Swift-like, minus the pass blocking/catching.

[Dresden]

Spoiler:

Read on Twitter

For a team that often makes a point about character in their people (over strictly talent), they let problem people slip under the wire too often. They wasted a pick apparently. This is embarrassing. Credit to our staff though for figuring out why they **** this up.

Read on Twitter

“As we dug into it, tried to help him out, it revealed itself as something that happened before he got here,” Poles said. “So credit to our staff finding the root cause of what he was going through. He’ll be down for the year, but he’ll spend the time going to meetings, in the weight room and with the medical staff to prepare for next season to get ready to play. A bummer on the front end, but I think because of everyone’s hard work and care here we got him on the right path.”

I would reserve judgement about the nature of the issue he's dealing with until we know more facts.

[dougthonus]

Spoiler:

Read on Twitter

For a team that often makes a point about character in their people (over strictly talent), they let problem people slip under the wire too often. They wasted a pick apparently. This is embarrassing. Credit to our staff though for figuring out why they **** this up.

Read on Twitter

“As we dug into it, tried to help him out, it revealed itself as something that happened before he got here,” Poles said. “So credit to our staff finding the root cause of what he was going through. He’ll be down for the year, but he’ll spend the time going to meetings, in the weight room and with the medical staff to prepare for next season to get ready to play. A bummer on the front end, but I think because of everyone’s hard work and care here we got him on the right path.”

If I were to parse the words out carefully, I'd note these two things as key points:

Credit to our staff finding the root cause of what he was going through

with the medical staff to prepare for next season

These are things you say about someone who has a disease that requires treatment, and will allow him to be present but not allow him to be healthy enough to play football. "Root cause", "medical staff", and the expected timeline (already ruling him out for a year) tend to rule out things like mental illness, drug addiction, character problems, or family problems. Most of those would have more indeterminant timelines that you would assume would not take a full season or lack a root cause or not require a medical team to be involved. I'm sure there are many possibilities, but cancer is the only one that pops into my mind.

No real reason to jump to conclusions, wish the guy the best with whatever he's dealing with, but my guess is this statement Ben Johnson said was thoughtfully written given the circumstances and not just said off the cuff and that this is some type of pretty serious medical condition.

[fleet]

Spoiler:

Read on Twitter

For a team that often makes a point about character in their people (over strictly talent), they let problem people slip under the wire too often. They wasted a pick apparently. This is embarrassing. Credit to our staff though for figuring out why they **** this up.

Read on Twitter

“As we dug into it, tried to help him out, it revealed itself as something that happened before he got here,” Poles said. “So credit to our staff finding the root cause of what he was going through. He’ll be down for the year, but he’ll spend the time going to meetings, in the weight room and with the medical staff to prepare for next season to get ready to play. A bummer on the front end, but I think because of everyone’s hard work and care here we got him on the right path.”

If I were to parse the words out carefully, I'd note these two things as key points:

Credit to our staff finding the root cause of what he was going through

with the medical staff to prepare for next season

These are things you say about someone who has a disease that requires treatment, and will allow him to be present but not allow him to be healthy enough to play football. "Root cause", "medical staff", and the expected timeline (already ruling him out for a year) tend to rule out things like mental illness, drug addiction, character problems, or family problems. Most of those would have more indeterminant timelines that you would assume would not take a full season or lack a root cause or not require a medical team to be involved. I'm sure there are many possibilities, but cancer is the only one that pops into my mind.

No real reason to jump to conclusions, wish the guy the best with whatever he's dealing with, but my guess is this statement Ben Johnson said was thoughtfully written given the circumstances and not just said off the cuff and that this is some type of pretty serious medical condition.

If not a mental condition (which is often under the medical umbrella these days), it’s still hard to believe they didn’t suss this out pre draft. He may have gone higher if whatever this was wasn’t suspected or suspicious. The Bears had some obvious needs to take care of instead of red shirting a 25 year old guy by not getting a clear evaluation before they drafted him. This was a bad beat, avoidable perhaps with either better discipline, or investigation.

[Dresden]

Spoiler:

For a team that often makes a point about character in their people (over strictly talent), they let problem people slip under the wire too often. They wasted a pick apparently. This is embarrassing. Credit to our staff though for figuring out why they **** this up.

Read on Twitter

“As we dug into it, tried to help him out, it revealed itself as something that happened before he got here,” Poles said. “So credit to our staff finding the root cause of what he was going through. He’ll be down for the year, but he’ll spend the time going to meetings, in the weight room and with the medical staff to prepare for next season to get ready to play. A bummer on the front end, but I think because of everyone’s hard work and care here we got him on the right path.”

If I were to parse the words out carefully, I'd note these two things as key points:

Credit to our staff finding the root cause of what he was going through

with the medical staff to prepare for next season

These are things you say about someone who has a disease that requires treatment, and will allow him to be present but not allow him to be healthy enough to play football. "Root cause", "medical staff", and the expected timeline (already ruling him out for a year) tend to rule out things like mental illness, drug addiction, character problems, or family problems. Most of those would have more indeterminant timelines that you would assume would not take a full season or lack a root cause or not require a medical team to be involved. I'm sure there are many possibilities, but cancer is the only one that pops into my mind.

No real reason to jump to conclusions, wish the guy the best with whatever he's dealing with, but my guess is this statement Ben Johnson said was thoughtfully written given the circumstances and not just said off the cuff and that this is some type of pretty serious medical condition.

If not a mental condition (which is often under the medical umbrella these days), it’s still hard to believe they didn’t suss this out pre draft. He may have gone higher if whatever this was wasn’t suspected or suspicious. The Bears had some obvious needs to take care of instead of red shirting a 25 year old guy by not getting a clear evaluation before they drafted him. This was a bad beat, avoidable perhaps with either better discipline, or investigation.

How exactly are they supposed to find out- maybe he didn't tell anyone about whatever it is? It's a 5th round draft pick- they aren't going to hire a private eye to follow the guy around to see if there's anything going on. And if it's something private, no one that's close to him is going to disclose it to a scout.

[nomorezorro]

i think it is generally healthy to accept "sometimes stuff just happens" as a possible explanation, rather than assuming everything that goes wrong is the result of an active failure

[dougthonus]

If not a mental condition (which is often under the medical umbrella these days), it’s still hard to believe they didn’t suss this out pre draft. He may have gone higher if whatever this was wasn’t suspected or suspicious. The Bears had some obvious needs to take care of instead of red shirting a 25 year old guy by not getting a clear evaluation before they drafted him. This was a bad beat, avoidable perhaps with either better discipline, or investigation.

Yeah, I'm not really stating an opinion on whether we could have/should have picked it up. Without even knowing what it is or how it presented or anything else, I think that's really tough to even guess about. Just was saying it didn't seem to be a character issue.

I would guess it isn't a mental condition, because you wouldn't rule someone out for the season before it begins and say they can still be around the team, but can't play. That doesn't make sense for someone dealing with anxiety or depression or bipolar or something like that. You also wouldn't likely say that you found the "root cause" of a mental condition and you're going to treat it over a year. That just isn't really an applicable approach for a mental condition.

That's why I said it sounds like cancer. Something that you know the treatment will leave him too weak to participate in football activities, but still allow him to be around the team. There are other things too perhaps like if he needed to be on dialysis or some types of blood clots and probably a host of other things, but all the things I can think of in this category are extremely serious.

[Fl_Flash]

If not a mental condition (which is often under the medical umbrella these days), it’s still hard to believe they didn’t suss this out pre draft. He may have gone higher if whatever this was wasn’t suspected or suspicious. The Bears had some obvious needs to take care of instead of red shirting a 25 year old guy by not getting a clear evaluation before they drafted him. This was a bad beat, avoidable perhaps with either better discipline, or investigation.

Yeah, I'm not really stating an opinion on whether we could have/should have picked it up. Without even knowing what it is or how it presented or anything else, I think that's really tough to even guess about. Just was saying it didn't seem to be a character issue.

I would guess it isn't a mental condition, because you wouldn't rule someone out for the season before it begins and say they can still be around the team, but can't play. That doesn't make sense for someone dealing with anxiety or depression or bipolar or something like that. You also wouldn't likely say that you found the "root cause" of a mental condition and you're going to treat it over a year. That just isn't really an applicable approach for a mental condition.

That's why I said it sounds like cancer. Something that you know the treatment will leave him too weak to participate in football activities, but still allow him to be around the team. There are other things too perhaps like if he needed to be on dialysis or some types of blood clots and probably a host of other things, but all the things I can think of in this category are extremely serious.

Shades of Eddy Curry and HCM (Hypotrophic Cardio Myopathy - did I spell that right?).

That or when Jimmy Johnson tried out for Survivor and they found that he had a heart condition which probably saved his life and allowed him to appear on Survivor in a subsequent season.

Whatever is going on - I tend to lean to "kudos to the Bears for putting the man before the player". They could have just cut him loose and not dealt with whatever is happening.

[fleet]

i think it is generally healthy to accept "sometimes stuff just happens" as a possible explanation, rather than assuming everything that goes wrong is the result of an active failure

It’s pretty easy to ask these questions in Ryan Poles’ case because we have 3 documented cases of his regime either not doing all the homework, or ignoring voices of doubt… Nate Davis, Chase Claypool, and every 2024 quarterback not named Caleb Williams. Guy falls in love with certain courses of action, and he’s tunnel-visioned.

[JohnnyKILLroy]

Always spinning the narrative negative feels like such miserable way to be a fan especially recently when for the first time in forever there’s things to be hopeful about both short term and long term.

Zah is a Chicago Bear now and I wish him all the best and it sounds like the organization is trying its best to do right by him.

[fleet]

Always spinning the narrative negative feels like such miserable way to be a fan especially recently when for the first time in forever there’s things to be hopefully about both short term and long term.

Zah is a Chicago Bear now and I wish him all the best and it sounds like the organization is trying its best to do right by him.

That’s quite the contradiction/self explanation embedded into your lament. You just told yourself why there have been negative accounts. Because there are numerous negatives.

All I can offer you is to fan the way you want, and talk about the Bears the way you want. It’s a free country and I won’t tell you not to. I’m the one that has been vindicated a million times over telling it it soberly, and it doesn’t matter if it offends you or not if you aren’t willing to look at things that are disturbing.

Frazier case is pending. The Bears may look good in the end, but I have seen enough over the years to to raise fair questions. The Bears potentially wasted a draft pick, and as long as they aren’t forthcoming with information, their track record does not lend the benefit of the doubt. They should should be held to account as always.

I will add, this is a professional football team. It may matter to you if Frazier is taken care of. But the Bears exist to win football games, and the McCaskeys exist to make money. That’s it. It doesn’t matter except if a ball player is produced.

[Dresden]

Always spinning the narrative negative feels like such miserable way to be a fan especially recently when for the first time in forever there’s things to be hopefully about both short term and long term.

Zah is a Chicago Bear now and I wish him all the best and it sounds like the organization is trying its best to do right by him.

That’s quite the contradiction/self explanation embedded into your lament. You just told yourself why there are negative accounts. Because there are negatives.

All I can offer you is to fan the way you want, and talk about the Bears the way you want. It’s a free country and I won’t tell you not to. I’m the one that has been vindicated a million times over telling it how I see it, and it doesn’t matter if it offends you or not if you aren’t willing to look at things that are disturbing.

Frazier case is pending. The Bears may look good in the end, but I have seen enough over the years to to raise fair questions. The Bears potentially wasted a draft pick, and as long as they aren’t forthcoming with information, their track record does not lend the benefit of the doubt. They should should be held to account as always.

In my time on this board your record has been as mixed as anyone else's, which is to say none of us has a crystal ball, and second guessing front offices by fans is what makes boards like this popular.

Just because the Bears take a chance on a player doesn't mean they "ignored voices of doubt", or were irresponsible. Sometimes you hit a home run with a player other teams have given up on. The Raiders in the 70's fielded a championship caliber team with other organizations cast-offs. It's easy to say "I told you so" when things don't work out.

[Dresden]

Always spinning the narrative negative feels like such miserable way to be a fan especially recently when for the first time in forever there’s things to be hopefully about both short term and long term.

Zah is a Chicago Bear now and I wish him all the best and it sounds like the organization is trying its best to do right by him.

I agree.

[jnrjr79]

Always spinning the narrative negative feels like such miserable way to be a fan especially recently when for the first time in forever there’s things to be hopefully about both short term and long term.

Zah is a Chicago Bear now and I wish him all the best and it sounds like the organization is trying its best to do right by him.

That’s quite the contradiction/self explanation embedded into your lament. You just told yourself why there have been negative accounts. Because there are numerous negatives.

All I can offer you is to fan the way you want, and talk about the Bears the way you want. It’s a free country and I won’t tell you not to. I’m the one that has been vindicated a million times over telling it it soberly, and it doesn’t matter if it offends you or not if you aren’t willing to look at things that are disturbing.

Frazier case is pending. The Bears may look good in the end, but I have seen enough over the years to to raise fair questions. The Bears potentially wasted a draft pick, and as long as they aren’t forthcoming with information, their track record does not lend the benefit of the doubt. They should should be held to account as always.

I will add, this is a professional football team. It may matter to you if Frazier is taken care of. But the Bears exist to win football games, and the McCaskeys exist to make money. That’s it. It doesn’t matter except if a ball player is produced.

This is a pretty bleak way to go through life.

[Dresden]

Bears claim 2 off waivers- bringing back CB Jaylon Johnson, and getting a LB cut by the Saints (who played under Dennis Allen). I assume this means they have to cut two more players- I'm sure the LB no one had ever heard of, Carl Jones, will be one of them.

[fleet]

Always spinning the narrative negative feels like such miserable way to be a fan especially recently when for the first time in forever there’s things to be hopefully about both short term and long term.

Zah is a Chicago Bear now and I wish him all the best and it sounds like the organization is trying its best to do right by him.

That’s quite the contradiction/self explanation embedded into your lament. You just told yourself why there have been negative accounts. Because there are numerous negatives.

All I can offer you is to fan the way you want, and talk about the Bears the way you want. It’s a free country and I won’t tell you not to. I’m the one that has been vindicated a million times over telling it it soberly, and it doesn’t matter if it offends you or not if you aren’t willing to look at things that are disturbing.

Frazier case is pending. The Bears may look good in the end, but I have seen enough over the years to to raise fair questions. The Bears potentially wasted a draft pick, and as long as they aren’t forthcoming with information, their track record does not lend the benefit of the doubt. They should should be held to account as always.

I will add, this is a professional football team. It may matter to you if Frazier is taken care of. But the Bears exist to win football games, and the McCaskeys exist to make money. That’s it. It doesn’t matter except if a ball player is produced.

This is a pretty bleak way to go through life.

I get by. It’s unfortunate you’re unable to hold a debate instead of getting personal. That’s bleak for a discussion thread.

[JohnnyKILLroy]

That’s quite the contradiction/self explanation embedded into your lament. You just told yourself why there have been negative accounts. Because there are numerous negatives.

All I can offer you is to fan the way you want, and talk about the Bears the way you want. It’s a free country and I won’t tell you not to. I’m the one that has been vindicated a million times over telling it it soberly, and it doesn’t matter if it offends you or not if you aren’t willing to look at things that are disturbing.

Frazier case is pending. The Bears may look good in the end, but I have seen enough over the years to to raise fair questions. The Bears potentially wasted a draft pick, and as long as they aren’t forthcoming with information, their track record does not lend the benefit of the doubt. They should should be held to account as always.

I will add, this is a professional football team. It may matter to you if Frazier is taken care of. But the Bears exist to win football games, and the McCaskeys exist to make money. That’s it. It doesn’t matter except if a ball player is produced.

This is a pretty bleak way to go through life.

I get by. It’s unfortunate you’re unable to hold a debate instead of getting personal. That’s bleak for a discussion thread.

Come into the light my brother feel the suns rays against your face. Be hopeful with us there’s a very good chance this season is going to be awesome. By no means is it perfect and yes it could go sideways but today it’s better being a Bears fan than it has been in a long time. Embrace it give yourself to the great energy we’re in.

[fleet]

This is a pretty bleak way to go through life.

I get by. It’s unfortunate you’re unable to hold a debate instead of getting personal. That’s bleak for a discussion thread.

Come into the light my brother feel the suns rays against your face. Be hopeful with us there’s a very good chance this season is going to be awesome. By no means is it perfect and yes it could sideways but today it’s better being a Bears fan than it has been in a long time. Embrace it give yourself to the great energy we’re in.

I take it as it comes, not as I hope. That’s real. I realize most fans don’t fan in reality. Its pollyanaiism. Thanks for the well wishes. Ben will win if Poles doesn’t get in his way because Ben is a winner.

[jnrjr79]

That’s quite the contradiction/self explanation embedded into your lament. You just told yourself why there have been negative accounts. Because there are numerous negatives.

All I can offer you is to fan the way you want, and talk about the Bears the way you want. It’s a free country and I won’t tell you not to. I’m the one that has been vindicated a million times over telling it it soberly, and it doesn’t matter if it offends you or not if you aren’t willing to look at things that are disturbing.

Frazier case is pending. The Bears may look good in the end, but I have seen enough over the years to to raise fair questions. The Bears potentially wasted a draft pick, and as long as they aren’t forthcoming with information, their track record does not lend the benefit of the doubt. They should should be held to account as always.

I will add, this is a professional football team. It may matter to you if Frazier is taken care of. But the Bears exist to win football games, and the McCaskeys exist to make money. That’s it. It doesn’t matter except if a ball player is produced.

This is a pretty bleak way to go through life.

I get by. It’s unfortunate you’re unable to hold a debate instead of getting personal. That’s bleak for a discussion thread.

I'm not "getting personal." Saying that it doesn't matter if this guy has a serious illness or what have you and that all that matters is if he turns into a good football player is, in fact, bleak (and gross).

The Bears organization does not deserve trust and confidence. I get it. But given this guy may have something quite serious going on in his life that may not have been known or knowable to the Bears, maybe we just take a breath for a minute.

[JohnnyKILLroy]

I get by. It’s unfortunate you’re unable to hold a debate instead of getting personal. That’s bleak for a discussion thread.

Come into the light my brother feel the suns rays against your face. Be hopeful with us there’s a very good chance this season is going to be awesome. By no means is it perfect and yes it could sideways but today it’s better being a Bears fan than it has been in a long time. Embrace it give yourself to the great energy we’re in.

I take it as it comes, not as I hope. That’s real. I realize most fans don’t fan in reality. Its pollyanaiism. Thanks for the well wishes. Ben will win if Poles doesn’t get in his way because Ben is a winner.

It’s a symbiotic partnership. When the wins come both will get credit for their roles in it. Let’s say we win a SuperBowl at the end of it are you going to say Poles gets no credit and it’s only because he got out of the way?