2025 Offseason Thread Vol.6

[3ammy3uck3ts]

Because you say so, he is wrong. Ok lol.

No because pretending Herro is not only the missing piece to a team who was bounced prior to the finals winning the entire championship but the missing piece to turning a franchise into a “dynasty” is just a completely wild hot take considering he’s never shown he can impact winning in the playoffs. Not only that but he’s now in a much lesser offensive role which further hurts his effectiveness and just gives the opposing team an easy target to hunt all game. Lol.

So, you saying that with a "much lesser offensive role" on the current team, Herro will get targeted more? He should be freed up more. Don't understand that rationale.

Targeted defensively. You’ll take the ball out of his hands far more behind Brunson and Towns which will hurt his effectiveness offensively but he will continue to be targeted as a weak defender all game, like the Cavs openly said was the gameplan, and will become even more of a negative in the playoffs than he already is. If he’s your 3rd option he’s better off coming off the bench.

I’m not even trying to dog the dude, I’m just saying I can promise you he was not the difference between the wolves getting bounced in 5 or winning the championship and he is definitely not turning the Wolves or Knicks into an instant dynasty lol.

[Pokuokic]

Tyler would be a great piece for most teams if he was making Davion Mitchell or Malik Monk money but at his price tag and future contract he's not helping anyone but himself.

[Kobewade11]

Tyler would be a great piece for most teams if he was making Davion Mitchell or Malik Monk money but at his price tag and future contract he's not helping anyone but himself.

Sandwich him in between Cade Cunningham and Ausar Thompson at his 'price tag' and they're contending for the EC title next year. He's not the problem with this team no matter how much people try to force it.

[twix2500]

Tyler would be a great piece for most teams if he was making Davion Mitchell or Malik Monk money but at his price tag and future contract he's not helping anyone but himself.

Sandwich him in between Cade Cunningham and Ausar Thompson at his 'price tag' and they're contending for the EC title next year. He's not the problem with this team no matter how much people try to force it.

For me it's all about how Spo uses him. Over reliance on Herro as a ball handler and a passer in half court as if he is James Harden puts the Heat in a bind at times. When Herro can focus more as a scorer, he is at his best.

[contract]

Jovic 1st game at Eurobasket

Spoiler:

Watch on YouTube

1 pt ... 2 rebs ... 2 ast ... 1 stl ... 1 blk ... & 2 to ... in 28 min vs Latvia

[SA37]

Jovic 1st game at Eurobasket

Spoiler:

Watch on YouTube

1 pt ... 2 rebs ... 2 ast ... 1 stl ... 1 blk ... & 2 to ... in 28 min vs Latvia

So you're saying he's Draymond Green?

[3ammy3uck3ts]

Tyler would be a great piece for most teams if he was making Davion Mitchell or Malik Monk money but at his price tag and future contract he's not helping anyone but himself.

Sandwich him in between Cade Cunningham and Ausar Thompson at his 'price tag' and they're contending for the EC title next year. He's not the problem with this team no matter how much people try to force it.

For me it's all about how Spo uses him. Over reliance on Herro as a ball handler and a passer in half court as if he is James Harden puts the Heat in a bind at times. When Herro can focus more as a scorer, he is at his best.

All he does is try to score, the type of player you’re describing is a Jordan Clarkson, Lou Williams, or Jamal Crawford. If that’s the role he needs to play then so be it, he should be paid for that role as well.

Pistons are contending for the East next year with or without Tyler and they just snagged an elite shooter that fits what they need better than Tyler, they dont need someone to take the ball out of Cades hands. No one’s forcing Herro as the problem in this discussion, we’re disputing that he’s not the final piece to a dynasty for 2 teams that got bounced pretty handedly before the Finals lol. OKC or Indy would’ve ate him alive just like Cleveland did

[Crazy-Canuck]

Sandwich him in between Cade Cunningham and Ausar Thompson at his 'price tag' and they're contending for the EC title next year. He's not the problem with this team no matter how much people try to force it.

For me it's all about how Spo uses him. Over reliance on Herro as a ball handler and a passer in half court as if he is James Harden puts the Heat in a bind at times. When Herro can focus more as a scorer, he is at his best.

All he does is try to score, the type of player you’re describing is a Jordan Clarkson, Lou Williams, or Jamal Crawford. If that’s the role he needs to play then so be it, he should be paid for that role as well.

Pistons are contending for the East next year with or without Tyler and they just snagged an elite shooter that fits what they need better than Tyler, they dont need someone to take the ball out of Cades hands. No one’s forcing Herro as the problem in this discussion, we’re disputing that he’s not the final piece to a dynasty for 2 teams that got bounced pretty handedly before the Finals lol. OKC or Indy would’ve ate him alive just like Cleveland did

Along with scoring, herro will need to become a facilitator or defender to warrant his minutes and cost. Its the only way a scoring guard lead team can win in the playoffs. That's his evolution. Just being a better scorer is basically lavine, derozan, cj etc.. They get paid, they will get respect as a player, but it just doesn't translate to wins in the playoffs. Unless you believe herro will be the first to do it.

If he's going to be a 2nd option as a starter next lead guards like cade or brunson, he'll need to defend or come off the bench.

[Vertical Limit]

Sandwich him in between Cade Cunningham and Ausar Thompson at his 'price tag' and they're contending for the EC title next year. He's not the problem with this team no matter how much people try to force it.

For me it's all about how Spo uses him. Over reliance on Herro as a ball handler and a passer in half court as if he is James Harden puts the Heat in a bind at times. When Herro can focus more as a scorer, he is at his best.

All he does is try to score, the type of player you’re describing is a Jordan Clarkson, Lou Williams, or Jamal Crawford. If that’s the role he needs to play then so be it, he should be paid for that role as well.

Pistons are contending for the East next year with or without Tyler and they just snagged an elite shooter that fits what they need better than Tyler, they dont need someone to take the ball out of Cades hands. No one’s forcing Herro as the problem in this discussion, we’re disputing that he’s not the final piece to a dynasty for 2 teams that got bounced pretty handedly before the Finals lol. OKC or Indy would’ve ate him alive just like Cleveland did

Those players in bold, you described the exact player/ceiling Herro is. Thats his ceiling and we probably wont see him have a better year than last. And he did that while being force fed the ball on high volume.. like hes Wade..

Delusional fans think hes a curry/klay hybrid..

[3ammy3uck3ts]

For me it's all about how Spo uses him. Over reliance on Herro as a ball handler and a passer in half court as if he is James Harden puts the Heat in a bind at times. When Herro can focus more as a scorer, he is at his best.

All he does is try to score, the type of player you’re describing is a Jordan Clarkson, Lou Williams, or Jamal Crawford. If that’s the role he needs to play then so be it, he should be paid for that role as well.

Pistons are contending for the East next year with or without Tyler and they just snagged an elite shooter that fits what they need better than Tyler, they dont need someone to take the ball out of Cades hands. No one’s forcing Herro as the problem in this discussion, we’re disputing that he’s not the final piece to a dynasty for 2 teams that got bounced pretty handedly before the Finals lol. OKC or Indy would’ve ate him alive just like Cleveland did

Along with scoring, herro will need to become a facilitator or defender to warrant his minutes and cost. Its the only way a scoring guard lead team can win in the playoffs. That's his evolution. Just being a better scorer is basically lavine, derozan, cj etc.. They get paid, they will get respect as a player, but it just doesn't translate to wins in the playoffs. Unless you believe herro will be the first to do it.

If he's going to be a 2nd option as a starter next lead guards like cade or brunson, he'll need to defend or come off the bench.

His playmaking is at least solid, his defense likely never will be though. He has to get over these playoff struggles and find a way to be effective or there’s not much use for him. Idc if you can score 24 a night in the regular season if you completely disappear when the playoffs come around and you are an easy target defensively for opposing teams. I’m sure he knows this is the next step he needs to take (outside of finding a way to become a somewhat respectable defender) so we’ll see what happens.

[3ammy3uck3ts]

For me it's all about how Spo uses him. Over reliance on Herro as a ball handler and a passer in half court as if he is James Harden puts the Heat in a bind at times. When Herro can focus more as a scorer, he is at his best.

All he does is try to score, the type of player you’re describing is a Jordan Clarkson, Lou Williams, or Jamal Crawford. If that’s the role he needs to play then so be it, he should be paid for that role as well.

Pistons are contending for the East next year with or without Tyler and they just snagged an elite shooter that fits what they need better than Tyler, they dont need someone to take the ball out of Cades hands. No one’s forcing Herro as the problem in this discussion, we’re disputing that he’s not the final piece to a dynasty for 2 teams that got bounced pretty handedly before the Finals lol. OKC or Indy would’ve ate him alive just like Cleveland did

Those players in bold, you described the exact player/ceiling Herro is. Thats his ceiling and we probably wont see him have a better year than last. And he did that while being force fed the ball on high volume.. like hes Wade..

Delusional fans think hes a curry/klay hybrid..

We had him in his perfect role the year we snagged the 1st seed. It put the ball in our 2 best players hands more to start games and we had a smart playmaking PG who helped get our guys in their spots. This team was always at its best with an actual PG starting next to Jimmy and Bam with a specialist starting at the 2 (Strus/Duncan) and a hard nosed 3 and D 4.

[twix2500]

For me it's all about how Spo uses him. Over reliance on Herro as a ball handler and a passer in half court as if he is James Harden puts the Heat in a bind at times. When Herro can focus more as a scorer, he is at his best.

All he does is try to score, the type of player you’re describing is a Jordan Clarkson, Lou Williams, or Jamal Crawford. If that’s the role he needs to play then so be it, he should be paid for that role as well.

Pistons are contending for the East next year with or without Tyler and they just snagged an elite shooter that fits what they need better than Tyler, they dont need someone to take the ball out of Cades hands. No one’s forcing Herro as the problem in this discussion, we’re disputing that he’s not the final piece to a dynasty for 2 teams that got bounced pretty handedly before the Finals lol. OKC or Indy would’ve ate him alive just like Cleveland did

Along with scoring, herro will need to become a facilitator or defender to warrant his minutes and cost. Its the only way a scoring guard lead team can win in the playoffs. That's his evolution. Just being a better scorer is basically lavine, derozan, cj etc.. They get paid, they will get respect as a player, but it just doesn't translate to wins in the playoffs. Unless you believe herro will be the first to do it.

If he's going to be a 2nd option as a starter next lead guards like cade or brunson, he'll need to defend or come off the bench.

Harden style of play hasn't won anything. The closest to win playing that style was Luka and he failed as well. Durant and Leonard are not ball dominant handlers, or distributors. Their primarily focus on scoring .They come off the ball to get to their scoring spots. It appears the Heat has now decided to lean away from Herro being a dominant ball handler by adding ball handlers in Jakucionis, Mitchell and Powell.

Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk

[twix2500]

All he does is try to score, the type of player you’re describing is a Jordan Clarkson, Lou Williams, or Jamal Crawford. If that’s the role he needs to play then so be it, he should be paid for that role as well.

Pistons are contending for the East next year with or without Tyler and they just snagged an elite shooter that fits what they need better than Tyler, they dont need someone to take the ball out of Cades hands. No one’s forcing Herro as the problem in this discussion, we’re disputing that he’s not the final piece to a dynasty for 2 teams that got bounced pretty handedly before the Finals lol. OKC or Indy would’ve ate him alive just like Cleveland did

Those players in bold, you described the exact player/ceiling Herro is. Thats his ceiling and we probably wont see him have a better year than last. And he did that while being force fed the ball on high volume.. like hes Wade..

Delusional fans think hes a curry/klay hybrid..

We had him in his perfect role the year we snagged the 1st seed. It put the ball in our 2 best players hands more to start games and we had a smart playmaking PG who helped get our guys in their spots. This team was always at its best with an actual PG starting next to Jimmy and Bam with a specialist starting at the 2 (Strus/Duncan) and a hard nosed 3 and D 4.

Jimmy gone so a new formula has to be found.


Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk

[3ammy3uck3ts]

Those players in bold, you described the exact player/ceiling Herro is. Thats his ceiling and we probably wont see him have a better year than last. And he did that while being force fed the ball on high volume.. like hes Wade..

Delusional fans think hes a curry/klay hybrid..

We had him in his perfect role the year we snagged the 1st seed. It put the ball in our 2 best players hands more to start games and we had a smart playmaking PG who helped get our guys in their spots. This team was always at its best with an actual PG starting next to Jimmy and Bam with a specialist starting at the 2 (Strus/Duncan) and a hard nosed 3 and D 4.

Jimmy gone so a new formula has to be found.


Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk

Agreed but we messed up the formula that worked years ago as it is lol. Trial and error I guess but I’d say they likely still haven’t learned.

[Hallstar]

Tyler would be a great piece for most teams if he was making Davion Mitchell or Malik Monk money but at his price tag and future contract he's not helping anyone but himself.

Sandwich him in between Cade Cunningham and Ausar Thompson at his 'price tag' and they're contending for the EC title next year. He's not the problem with this team no matter how much people try to force it.

https://www.reddit.com/r/nba/comments/1n3h315/who_were_the_top_open_play_offensive_contributors/

Who were the top open play offensive contributors by total field goals and assists in 2024-25?
Soccer and hockey notably track total goal contributions as a leading statistic. Basketball tracks them individually but I don’t often see this type of list and wanted to see some discussion about it. The top 25 players by field goals made plus field goals assisted in 24-25:

1. Nikola Jokic, 1502 (786 FGM, 716 assists, 21.5 per game)

2. Trae Young, 1446 (566, 880, 19.0)

3. Shai Gilgeous-Alexander, 1346 (860, 486, 17.7)

4. Cade Cunningham, 1322 (684, 638, 18.9)

5. Giannis Antetokounmpo, 1226 (793, 493, 18.3)

6. LeBron James, 1226 (651, 575, 17.5)

7. James Harden, 1218 (531, 687, 15.4)

8. Devin Booker, 1183 (654, 529, 15.8)

9. Tyrese Haliburton, 1149 (476, 673, 15.7)

10. Jayson Tatum, 1093 (662, 431, 15.2)

11. Anthony Edwards, 1080 (721, 359, 13.7)

12. Tyler Herro, 1075 (651, 424, 14.0)

13. Jalen Brunson, 1060 (585, 475, 16.3)

14. Darius Garland, 1060 (554, 506, 14.1)

15. Steph Curry, 985 (564, 421, 14.1)

16. DeMar DeRozan, 966 (624, 342, 12.5)

17 Domantas Sabonis, 950 (527, 423, 13.6)

18. Donovan Mitchell, 939 (585, 354, 13.2)

19. Alperen Sengun, 939 (567, 372, 12.4)

20. Zach LaVine, 935 (625, 310, 12.6)

21. Jamal Murray, 934 (531, 403, 13.9)

22. De’Aaron Fox, 931 (539, 392, 15.0)

23. Jalen Williams, 919 (565, 354, 13.3)

24. Austin Reaves, 898 (477, 421, 12.3)

25. Mikal Bridges, 898 (592, 306, 11.0)

Other notable per game rates:

Luka Doncic, 16.9 FG + A per game

Damian Lillard, 14.7

Kevin Durant, 13.8

Scottie Barnes, 13.1

My notes:

Reaching 1000 total field goals and assists is a huge accomplishment and marks a moderately clear line for some of the top offensive players over the course of a season.

The top end of this list is interesting on its own, but comparing them to the group from 10-25 shows just how good the best players in the league are.

Jamal Murray, De’Aaron Fox, Darius Garland, and Tyler Herro all averaged more in this statistic than Anthony Edwards. Murray did that as a bona fide second option while Garland and Fox were the 1B for their teams. Herro may be underrated as a primary scorer.

Cade Cunningham and Trae Young are both absolutely underrated at this point. Both could be primed for a big step in their careers.

Explaining color to blind men is not something I plan on doing anymore this offseason. If they can't understand what they watched last season so be it, but we would have been in the 20s without Herro.

[insfo]

So what set off the usual suspects this time around? Last time it was KD saying something about the scouts valuing Tyler or something to that effect. So who posted something positive this time around? Something like that has to be considered trolling on this board now

[BadMofoPimp]

All he does is try to score, the type of player you’re describing is a Jordan Clarkson, Lou Williams, or Jamal Crawford. If that’s the role he needs to play then so be it, he should be paid for that role as well.

Pistons are contending for the East next year with or without Tyler and they just snagged an elite shooter that fits what they need better than Tyler, they dont need someone to take the ball out of Cades hands. No one’s forcing Herro as the problem in this discussion, we’re disputing that he’s not the final piece to a dynasty for 2 teams that got bounced pretty handedly before the Finals lol. OKC or Indy would’ve ate him alive just like Cleveland did

Along with scoring, herro will need to become a facilitator or defender to warrant his minutes and cost. Its the only way a scoring guard lead team can win in the playoffs. That's his evolution. Just being a better scorer is basically lavine, derozan, cj etc.. They get paid, they will get respect as a player, but it just doesn't translate to wins in the playoffs. Unless you believe herro will be the first to do it.

If he's going to be a 2nd option as a starter next lead guards like cade or brunson, he'll need to defend or come off the bench.

Harden style of play hasn't won anything. The closest to win playing that style was Luka and he failed as well. Durant and Leonard are not ball dominant handlers, or distributors. Their primarily focus on scoring .They come off the ball to get to their scoring spots. It appears the Heat has now decided to lean away from Herro being a dominant ball handler by adding ball handlers in Jakucionis, Mitchell and Powell.

Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk

Hopefully with better shooting or scoring around him, he can expend conserve more energy for defense. Will see if that can happen or he develops.

[MadD23]

Tyler would be a great piece for most teams if he was making Davion Mitchell or Malik Monk money but at his price tag and future contract he's not helping anyone but himself.

Sandwich him in between Cade Cunningham and Ausar Thompson at his 'price tag' and they're contending for the EC title next year. He's not the problem with this team no matter how much people try to force it.

Bingo!! These narrative pushers ignore many facts. First, it can be argued that Allstar Herro (last season), who is still a developing young upcoming star in this league was not in any position to succeed when it comes to impacting winning, specially in the playoffs against the number 1 seeded team in the EAST. That's more on his team than him.

Second, it could also be argued that next season and still being a young player hitting just the early stages of his prime, he could be better than last season and I am hoping the underrated addition of Powel could help free him up a little. With that said, if you put Herro with 2 super stars and a strong squad, he would be an integral piece as a third option (even 2B) of a championship type team.

[MadD23]

Tyler would be a great piece for most teams if he was making Davion Mitchell or Malik Monk money but at his price tag and future contract he's not helping anyone but himself.

Sandwich him in between Cade Cunningham and Ausar Thompson at his 'price tag' and they're contending for the EC title next year. He's not the problem with this team no matter how much people try to force it.

https://www.reddit.com/r/nba/comments/1n3h315/who_were_the_top_open_play_offensive_contributors/

Who were the top open play offensive contributors by total field goals and assists in 2024-25?
Soccer and hockey notably track total goal contributions as a leading statistic. Basketball tracks them individually but I don’t often see this type of list and wanted to see some discussion about it. The top 25 players by field goals made plus field goals assisted in 24-25:

1. Nikola Jokic, 1502 (786 FGM, 716 assists, 21.5 per game)

2. Trae Young, 1446 (566, 880, 19.0)

3. Shai Gilgeous-Alexander, 1346 (860, 486, 17.7)

4. Cade Cunningham, 1322 (684, 638, 18.9)

5. Giannis Antetokounmpo, 1226 (793, 493, 18.3)

6. LeBron James, 1226 (651, 575, 17.5)

7. James Harden, 1218 (531, 687, 15.4)

8. Devin Booker, 1183 (654, 529, 15.8)

9. Tyrese Haliburton, 1149 (476, 673, 15.7)

10. Jayson Tatum, 1093 (662, 431, 15.2)

11. Anthony Edwards, 1080 (721, 359, 13.7)

12. Tyler Herro, 1075 (651, 424, 14.0)

13. Jalen Brunson, 1060 (585, 475, 16.3)

14. Darius Garland, 1060 (554, 506, 14.1)

15. Steph Curry, 985 (564, 421, 14.1)

16. DeMar DeRozan, 966 (624, 342, 12.5)

17 Domantas Sabonis, 950 (527, 423, 13.6)

18. Donovan Mitchell, 939 (585, 354, 13.2)

19. Alperen Sengun, 939 (567, 372, 12.4)

20. Zach LaVine, 935 (625, 310, 12.6)

21. Jamal Murray, 934 (531, 403, 13.9)

22. De’Aaron Fox, 931 (539, 392, 15.0)

23. Jalen Williams, 919 (565, 354, 13.3)

24. Austin Reaves, 898 (477, 421, 12.3)

25. Mikal Bridges, 898 (592, 306, 11.0)

Other notable per game rates:

Luka Doncic, 16.9 FG + A per game

Damian Lillard, 14.7

Kevin Durant, 13.8

Scottie Barnes, 13.1

My notes:

Reaching 1000 total field goals and assists is a huge accomplishment and marks a moderately clear line for some of the top offensive players over the course of a season.

The top end of this list is interesting on its own, but comparing them to the group from 10-25 shows just how good the best players in the league are.

Jamal Murray, De’Aaron Fox, Darius Garland, and Tyler Herro all averaged more in this statistic than Anthony Edwards. Murray did that as a bona fide second option while Garland and Fox were the 1B for their teams. Herro may be underrated as a primary scorer.

Cade Cunningham and Trae Young are both absolutely underrated at this point. Both could be primed for a big step in their careers.

Explaining color to blind men is not something I plan on doing anymore this offseason. If they can't understand what they watched last season so be it, but we would have been in the 20s without Herro.

Be Careful man, FACTS on this board can get you the delusional label by the mentally superior beings in here lol

[3ammy3uck3ts]

I specifically have given Tyler credit for finally having a pretty damn good offensive regular season, about time since he’s led the team in shot attempts and usage for 4 seasons now.

The issue is it doesn’t translate to the playoffs and he plays 0 defense. Where’s the confusion? Idgaf if he helped get us to an elite 37-45 record, when the playoffs come around he is horrible every single time. Every time, it never fails and that can not be debated. That’s his next step, showing up in the playoffs where teams gameplan completely different and also attack you relentlessly for being a terrible defender.

This assumption were a 20 win team without Tyler last year is just that, an assumption. Every time Tyler has went down we’ve gotten better lol also a fact. Him going down in 2023 was a major catalyst to our finals run.

I truly wish he was as good as you all act on here, maybe this season is the one!