Would you offer Ayo an extension?

[Ballerkingn23]

I think its a given we're going to keep or try to keep both Coby and Ayo and make them apart of this grand master plan AK was talking about for 2026.

We're just waiting on Giddy to ink his deal and then after that we're going to go all out for Coby and Ayo and call it an off-season.

There's nothing to be done with Coby this summer. We can only offer him like 18 mil/year on an extension right now per CBA rules, which I think we did but obviously he did or will turn that down cause he's worth more.

I don't think it's automatic at all that we'll try to keep Ayo. We've acquired 4 new guys that directly or indirectly compete with Ayo for roles since the middle of last season.

You misunderstood because I know Coby's not getting resigned now, but as I was alluding to, Coby will be a part of AK's grand plan in 2026, as well as Ayo, and that will be it. I don't feel we're able to acquire any star players anytime soon.

[League Circles]

I think its a given we're going to keep or try to keep both Coby and Ayo and make them apart of this grand master plan AK was talking about for 2026.

We're just waiting on Giddy to ink his deal and then after that we're going to go all out for Coby and Ayo and call it an off-season.

There's nothing to be done with Coby this summer. We can only offer him like 18 mil/year on an extension right now per CBA rules, which I think we did but obviously he did or will turn that down cause he's worth more.

I don't think it's automatic at all that we'll try to keep Ayo. We've acquired 4 new guys that directly or indirectly compete with Ayo for roles since the middle of last season.

You misunderstood because I know Coby's not getting resigned now, but as I was alluding to, Coby will be a part of AK's grand plan in 2026, as well as Ayo, and that will be it. I don't feel we're able to acquire any star players anytime soon.

You certainly may be right on not acquiring any star players any time soon, but IMO Ayo is likely going to be gone regardless IMO, unless he wildly outplays Okoro, which I think is unlikely.

[Ballerkingn23]

There's nothing to be done with Coby this summer. We can only offer him like 18 mil/year on an extension right now per CBA rules, which I think we did but obviously he did or will turn that down cause he's worth more.

I don't think it's automatic at all that we'll try to keep Ayo. We've acquired 4 new guys that directly or indirectly compete with Ayo for roles since the middle of last season.

You misunderstood because I know Coby's not getting resigned now, but as I was alluding to, Coby will be a part of AK's grand plan in 2026, as well as Ayo, and that will be it. I don't feel we're able to acquire any star players anytime soon.

You certainly may be right on not acquiring any star players any time soon, but IMO Ayo is likely going to be gone regardless IMO, unless he wildly outplays Okoro, which I think is unlikely.

And now you could be right about Ayo. Why im not sure why we didn't trade him but then again I know why it's AK he never makes the deals he's supposed to make. Although I don't mind keeping Ayo long term if a deal can be struck, but I do think teams will pay him a lot as long as he has a healthy productive season.

[meekrab]

Billy has played Ayo nearly 30 minutes a game anytime he's healthy, I don't see this scenario where he's struggling to get off the bench as a realistic one. It's a lot more likely that Jones and Okoro feel the pinch to me.

[waffle]

sure...I could see him being a really decent 2nd unit guy, even a 6th man. He's a very solid defender and has some positional flexibility...

Not my money of course

[sco]

I am really rooting for Ayo to come back and be good. I can't tell what of his fall-off was injury driven, bulking-up driven, and what he can do now. At one point he did seem to have found a 3pt stroke, which is key. The defense though, I haven't seen an above average-defender in him really since he was a rookie...he seems slower and less fluid since bulking up, but maybe I see that in every guy who bulks up after it happened to Lauri.

[DuckIII]

I have an irrational love for ayo. Don't know what contract he's worth but I want him in the team long term

It’s not irrational. Every team wants a guy like Ayo. All fans want a guy like Ayo.

And Ayo’s game is basically perfectly suited to what we are now trying to do. The problem is there is no logical room longer term for Ayo and Coby on their next contracts. A choice has to be made.

That’s probably the only real “roster battle” we have going this season.

[sco]

I have an irrational love for ayo. Don't know what contract he's worth but I want him in the team long term

It’s not irrational. Every team wants a guy like Ayo. All fans want a guy like Ayo.

And Ayo’s game is basically perfectly suited to what we are now trying to do. The problem is there is no logical room longer term for Ayo and Coby on their next contracts. A choice has to be made.

That’s probably the only real “roster battle” we have going this season.

Interesting question, so let's say Ayo goes back to being his best self, but because of his reduced role is gettable for 4/$50M...would folks prefer signing Ayo (and hypothetically a good starting C...say Hartenstein becomes a FA) or resign a version of Coby who was the guy he was post Zach for 4/$120M?

Separately, I could see a Noa/Pat battle this year (optimistically Noa is good and takes Pat's minutes).

[jnrjr79]

I have an irrational love for ayo. Don't know what contract he's worth but I want him in the team long term

It’s not irrational. Every team wants a guy like Ayo. All fans want a guy like Ayo.

And Ayo’s game is basically perfectly suited to what we are now trying to do. The problem is there is no logical room longer term for Ayo and Coby on their next contracts. A choice has to be made.

That’s probably the only real “roster battle” we have going this season.

Interesting question, so let's say Ayo goes back to being his best self, but because of his reduced role is gettable for 4/$50M...would folks prefer signing Ayo (and hypothetically a good starting C...say Hartenstein becomes a FA) or resign a version of Coby who was the guy he was post Zach for 4/$120M?

Separately, I could see a Noa/Pat battle this year (optimistically Noa is good and takes Pat's minutes).

My answer to that is if Josh Giddey is here long-term, I'd rather have Ayo + a good defensive C, but if Giddey is not here, I'd rather have Coby.

I just don't like the Coby + Giddey fit defensively.

[DuckIII]

It’s not irrational. Every team wants a guy like Ayo. All fans want a guy like Ayo.

And Ayo’s game is basically perfectly suited to what we are now trying to do. The problem is there is no logical room longer term for Ayo and Coby on their next contracts. A choice has to be made.

That’s probably the only real “roster battle” we have going this season.

Interesting question, so let's say Ayo goes back to being his best self, but because of his reduced role is gettable for 4/$50M...would folks prefer signing Ayo (and hypothetically a good starting C...say Hartenstein becomes a FA) or resign a version of Coby who was the guy he was post Zach for 4/$120M?

Separately, I could see a Noa/Pat battle this year (optimistically Noa is good and takes Pat's minutes).

My answer to that is if Josh Giddey is here long-term, I'd rather have Ayo + a good defensive C, but if Giddey is not here, I'd rather have Coby.

I just don't like the Coby + Giddey fit defensively.

This is my answer as well, sco.

Its really not even a pure positional battle in a traditional sense. Coby already won. I expect a much improved version of Ayo for two pretty significant reasons: (a) a stark stylistic change that perfectly fits his strengths as a player; and (b) not playing with freaking broken shoulder for the first time in two years. But despite that, I really do believe Coby turned a corner last season and his game evolved. I don't think on paper Ayo is going to be "better than Coby."

Its going to be more about contract dollars and fit. And by fit, I mean that a big part of this decision probably hinges on the play of guys who aren't even Ayo or Coby. Which brings it back around to what jnrjr said.

[League Circles]

I have an irrational love for ayo. Don't know what contract he's worth but I want him in the team long term

It’s not irrational. Every team wants a guy like Ayo. All fans want a guy like Ayo.

And Ayo’s game is basically perfectly suited to what we are now trying to do. The problem is there is no logical room longer term for Ayo and Coby on their next contracts. A choice has to be made.

That’s probably the only real “roster battle” we have going this season.

Interesting question, so let's say Ayo goes back to being his best self, but because of his reduced role is gettable for 4/$50M...would folks prefer signing Ayo (and hypothetically a good starting C...say Hartenstein becomes a FA) or resign a version of Coby who was the guy he was post Zach for 4/$120M?

Separately, I could see a Noa/Pat battle this year (optimistically Noa is good and takes Pat's minutes).

Easily re-sign Coby. We should be able to afford a good C regardless of Coby, but Ayo locked in as a bench role player when we'll already have Jones, Okoro, Patrick and Noa all under contract is probably a luxury we can't afford.

I don't see Coby and Ayo as being remotely comparable players. I do see Coby as much better than Ayo now, but more importantly, they are simply very different players, and we currently have a LOT more of what Ayo offers than we have of what Coby offers.

[MikeDC]

I don't understand what you guys are seeing positively in Ayo. By pretty much every conceivable measure he's... not good. He doesn't rate out as a good man defender. His DFG% is not good and wasn't last year either.

His on-off and advanced stats are generally negative.

He's had one good shooting year, but on low volume. Which looks pretty fluky given his other 3 seasons of being bad on low volume.

And... I don't get the idea that he somehow fits next to Giddey? How? The Bulls best lineups were when they were surrounding Giddey with shooters. In fact, the pairing of Giddey and Ayo was uniquely bad... had a negative -11.8 net rating.

[dougthonus]

I have an irrational love for ayo. Don't know what contract he's worth but I want him in the team long term

It’s not irrational. Every team wants a guy like Ayo. All fans want a guy like Ayo.

And Ayo’s game is basically perfectly suited to what we are now trying to do. The problem is there is no logical room longer term for Ayo and Coby on their next contracts. A choice has to be made.

That’s probably the only real “roster battle” we have going this season.

I feel this way a bit, but I think the reality of Ayo is a lot less than the dream of what you're saying. In reality, despite his size he's not a good rebounder, despite his long term play as a PG, he's not a really good passer, theoretically he's a good defender, but has underwhelmed more recently in that area. He's a guy you feel like should be all those things, but he's not been able to consistently deliver on them well enough to be a big impact player.

I still have hope that he can, and would gamble on him getting there, because if he is that guy, there is plenty of room for him on his next contract here. If he's that guy he's better than Okoro and Jones, and Huerter will likely be gone, and Coby might be gone too, particularly if Ayo's value prop is higher.

That said, Coby has consistently gotten better in the league, and Ayo has not. It's not to say I think Coby's trend line is going to keep going up, but Ayo's trend line hasn't really gone up at all, so at this point, I'm not sure there is reason to think it starts going up.

[CROBulls]

Do you know when you want guy like Ayo on roster? When you set like OKC. Do you know when you dont need guy like Ayo? When you set like Chicago Bulls. Bulls actually need high end talent, there is a way to get that high end talent. Many users on this board dont wanna hear it, but that's their problem. But even that it's not possible with Bulls until Bulls are literally sold and Reinsdorf family doesnt own a cent in a franchise.

So let's forget that story. I still prefer keeping Ayo over Coby, just due salary demands. Because Ayo is worth 6-9M per year and that's gonna be his price at FA market, and with Coby I feel he will rather play for 15-20M for another team when Bulls dont offer him 30M+. Just a feeling.

[League Circles]

A lot of people look at the Bulls and think things like "the Bulls aren't good because guys like Coby, Giddey and Matas aren't as good as guys like Curry, LeBron and Giannis."

I look at the Bulls and think "the Bulls aren't good because guys like Ayo, Huerter, Williams, and Vuc............"

Hard for me to wrap my head around focusing on our strengths instead of our weaknesses.

[MikeDC]

Do you know when you want guy like Ayo on roster? When you set like OKC. Do you know when you dont need guy like Ayo? When you set like Chicago Bulls. Bulls actually need high end talent, there is a way to get that high end talent. Many users on this board dont wanna hear it, but that's their problem. But even that it's not possible with Bulls until Bulls are literally sold and Reinsdorf family doesnt own a cent in a franchise.

So let's forget that story. I still prefer keeping Ayo over Coby, just due salary demands. Because Ayo is worth 6-9M per year and that's gonna be his price at FA market, and with Coby I feel he will rather play for 15-20M for another team when Bulls dont offer him 30M+. Just a feeling.

Doesn't thinking about OKC put the lie to Ayo being "worth" a significant contract though?

On OKC, Ayo wouldn't play a single minute. Not 1. They want guys who can shoot. Further, OKC understands that as they have to lock in to a core set of guys, they can't afford to pay guys like Ayo to sit on the bench. They cycle through guys.

You can see this with how they've got Caruso, but then they've got Cason Wallace waiting in the wings for Caruso to decline, and they've got AJ Mitchell waiting in the wings to replace Wallace if they need to. Then they've got Joe and Wiggins, who are both high level shooters.

OKC doesn't think they need a guy like Ayo on their roster at all. And definitely not tied to a longer term, relatively pricy deal.

[Chi town]

I think Okoro and Jones have replaced Ayo.

Will be surprised if Ayo is not traded before the deadline.

[Clint Eastwood]

I think Okoro and Jones have replaced Ayo.

Will be surprised if Ayo is not traded before the deadline.

Ayo is going nowhere (unless we get a mid to high first round pick for him)

[jnrjr79]

I think Okoro and Jones have replaced Ayo.

Will be surprised if Ayo is not traded before the deadline.

Ayo is going nowhere (unless we get a mid to high first round pick for him)

IMO, the Bulls are not going to pay Giddey, Coby, and Ayo, IMO. So if they do keep Ayo, someone else is on the move, I'd imagine.

[Chi town]

I think Okoro and Jones have replaced Ayo.

Will be surprised if Ayo is not traded before the deadline.

Ayo is going nowhere (unless we get a mid to high first round pick for him)

IMO, the Bulls are not going to pay Giddey, Coby, and Ayo, IMO. So if they do keep Ayo, someone else is on the move, I'd imagine.

Good luck getting a first for Ayo and his expiring deal. Unless you add Jalen and take a bad contract.

Okoro 11 and Jones 8 are Ayo’s replacement. Bulls picked Pat over Ayo.