Kawhi Leonard Signed a Secret $28M Deal. Steve Ballmer Funded a Fraud. We Followed the Money. | PTFO

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Re: Kawhi Leonard Signed a Secret $28M Deal. Steve Ballmer Funded a Fraud. We Followed the Money. | PTFO 

Post#1021 » by og15 » Sat Sep 6, 2025 10:41 am

316Hornets wrote:The money was so insignificant to Balmer that he didn't even bother covering it up? This isn't something the NBA can just let go because other owners are going to see the type of risk/reward from the outcome.

I just don't know how one of the top 10 richest guys in the world was so sloppy. Like he could pad most players pockets like it's nothing. And the genius plan was to set up some fraudulent company instead of offering Kawhi some untraceable crypto currency or bank account in the Caymans?

Ballmer did not set up this company, the company was already present. I don't know how they connected, but it's been verified that they contacted many rich people trying to get funding. His funding did not give him any controlling interest or anything like that, as it was around 3%, but he was of course an investor.

What we can piece together that Ballmer did is that he gave the company funding, which we can assume helped to further legitimize then in the eyes of others, because they can say, "see, Ballmer funded us", and then they can get other people to fund them. They had a lot of investors and collected a good amount.

Likely there was some understanding that they would essentially pay Ballmer back with the Clippers sponsorship, which was supposed to give $300 million over 20-ish years, which meant he would also get the $50 million back in 5 years, plus more down the road.

The cap related aspect would be that there was an understanding, implication, suggestion, whatever you want to call it, that they would introduce Kawhi, and he would receive an endorsement deal with them.

Everyone believed the company was "legit". Of course it would have been dumb to set up a fraudulent company any then have them do fraudulent things, that's an easy way to get caught. On the other hand, introducing what is considered a legitimate company to a player for a sponsorship is not against the NBA rules.

What the NBA does not allow is for that to be part of your contract signing pitch. So when a team is pitching to the player, they can't have the execs of a company there saying, "if you sign with this team, we will also give you ____ endorsement for this amount".

Now, there's wiggle, because execs like Time Warner, Comcast, etc have been part of pitches for many teams, and the NBA has said it is allowed, but they can only talk about market opportunities being in the area, but can't offer specific perks or endorsements for signing the contract.

After the contract is signed though, the NBA does not restrict teams from connecting players with companies for possible endorsements, only rule is that they can introduce, but they can't be part of the negotiation or contracts.

Now of course this is where Ballmer can feign ignorance. He would not have access to Aspirations records or decision making, that part is true. He can of course say, I'm not allowed to be in the negotiation between Kawhi and Aspiration, also true. But, as far as I'm aware of, players will usually share the details of their endorsement deals with their teams, even though it is their own business and not the companies.

The reason is so to avoid conflict of interest or anything that breaches theit contract or goes against cap laws, etc. This last post would be the last that requires the most explaining. If Ballmer claims the Clippers were not informed, why? Then they also have to as Kawhi and co, if you know that it is best practice to give the team details to ensure compliance, why didn't you, any if both parties can't give sufficient answers to these inquiries, then you know there was foul play somewhere.
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Post#1022 » by RyderMike » Sat Sep 6, 2025 11:20 am

Ballmer also claiming he had no idea Kahwi had an endorsement deal with Aspiration, as he only introduced them, so no knowledge if they actually reached one. He was inviting those guys to games to sit in his box. Those guys are going to come to games and it's not going to come up once that your star player has an endorsement deal with them?
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Post#1023 » by John Murdoch » Sat Sep 6, 2025 11:46 am

Tha Cynic wrote:Uncle Dennis probably groomed this dude to make a buck off him.

Whatever happened to Uncle Dennis and that other parasite Castleberry?

Same reason u suddenly seen Lavar Ball dissappear...paid him to go away
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Post#1024 » by JeepCSC » Sat Sep 6, 2025 1:05 pm

og15 wrote:
316Hornets wrote:The money was so insignificant to Balmer that he didn't even bother covering it up? This isn't something the NBA can just let go because other owners are going to see the type of risk/reward from the outcome.

I just don't know how one of the top 10 richest guys in the world was so sloppy. Like he could pad most players pockets like it's nothing. And the genius plan was to set up some fraudulent company instead of offering Kawhi some untraceable crypto currency or bank account in the Caymans?

Ballmer did not set up this company, the company was already present. I don't know how they connected, but it's been verified that they contacted many rich people trying to get funding. His funding did not give him any controlling interest or anything like that, as it was around 3%, but he was of course an investor.

What we can piece together that Ballmer did is that he gave the company funding, which we can assume helped to further legitimize then in the eyes of others, because they can say, "see, Ballmer funded us", and then they can get other people to fund them. They had a lot of investors and collected a good amount.

Likely there was some understanding that they would essentially pay Ballmer back with the Clippers sponsorship, which was supposed to give $300 million over 20-ish years, which meant he would also get the $50 million back in 5 years, plus more down the road.

The cap related aspect would be that there was an understanding, implication, suggestion, whatever you want to call it, that they would introduce Kawhi, and he would receive an endorsement deal with them.

Everyone believed the company was "legit". Of course it would have been dumb to set up a fraudulent company any then have them do fraudulent things, that's an easy way to get caught. On the other hand, introducing what is considered a legitimate company to a player for a sponsorship is not against the NBA rules.

What the NBA does not allow is for that to be part of your contract signing pitch. So when a team is pitching to the player, they can't have the execs of a company there saying, "if you sign with this team, we will also give you ____ endorsement for this amount".

Now, there's wiggle, because execs like Time Warner, Comcast, etc have been part of pitches for many teams, and the NBA has said it is allowed, but they can only talk about market opportunities being in the area, but can't offer specific perks or endorsements for signing the contract.

After the contract is signed though, the NBA does not restrict teams from connecting players with companies for possible endorsements, only rule is that they can introduce, but they can't be part of the negotiation or contracts.

Now of course this is where Ballmer can feign ignorance. He would not have access to Aspirations records or decision making, that part is true. He can of course say, I'm not allowed to be in the negotiation between Kawhi and Aspiration, also true. But, as far as I'm aware of, players will usually share the details of their endorsement deals with their teams, even though it is their own business and not the companies.

The reason is so to avoid conflict of interest or anything that breaches theit contract or goes against cap laws, etc. This last post would be the last that requires the most explaining. If Ballmer claims the Clippers were not informed, why? Then they also have to as Kawhi and co, if you know that it is best practice to give the team details to ensure compliance, why didn't you, any if both parties can't give sufficient answers to these inquiries, then you know there was foul play somewhere.


The last paragraph kind of negates your previous speculative one’s. There really is no good answer but one. Everything else is sound and fury.
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Post#1025 » by Mr Peanut » Sat Sep 6, 2025 1:27 pm

Ballmer and the Clippers can play the "plausible deniability" card all they want, but the CBA states that only circumstantial evidence is needed. And the current evidence far exceeds the circumstantial threshold.

Unfortunately all I can see is a hefty fine (hefty to most people, but insignificant to Ballmer who is mega rich) and a few second round picks docked (maybe one first at most). Justice won't be served.
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Post#1026 » by Sixers in 4 » Sat Sep 6, 2025 1:54 pm

The Master wrote:
wco81 wrote:He could have planted a thousand trees and it still wouldn't justify $28 million in cash payments and $20 million in stock.

Yeah, people are saying 'if Kawhi had promoted..., it would've been okay', but it's not true, first, actually someone could get interested in Kawhi's relation with Aspiration, second, that's still salary cap circumvention considering he was paid millions of dollars over his market value/whatever, and even if he weren't, it's still a blatant conflict of interests.

That's why they went with fake endorsement route.

It shall constitute a violation of Section 1(a) above for a Team (or Team Affiliate) to enter into an agreement or understanding with any sponsor or business partner or third party under which such sponsor, business partner, or third party pays or agrees to pay compensation for basketball services (even if such compensation is ostensibly designated as being for non-basketball services) to a player under Contract to the Team. Such an agreement with a sponsor or business partner or third party may be inferred where: (i) such compensation from the sponsor or business partner or third party is substantially in excess of the fair market value of any services to be rendered by the player for such sponsor or business partner or third party; and (ii) the Compensation in the Player Contract between the player and the Team is substantially below the fair market value of such Contract.


Aaaand that's why Clippers are cooked, he was literally paid 25-50x as much as his market value, I assume, considering that Torre was saying once on his podcast that this 28 mil $ deal was 4x as much as combined salary for Drake, DiCaprio and Downey Jr. Now, add another 20 mil $ in stocks promised and I'm pretty sure he was promised to be paid 25x as much as DiCaprio or something like that.

The only chance for Ballmer literally is that NBA will be dumb/willing to sweep everything under the carpet, because his only defense is: we didn't know anything and they paid Kawhi that much because they were afraid that he'll leave and the Clippers' value would go down (and they were negotiating/signed a sponsorship deal with the Clippers).

It's still bs - Ballmer literally invested 50 mil $ in the company and had close ties with them - but this is the only way to defend it.


The other issue is the endorsement deal was explicitly tied to him remaining a Clipper. Why? Aspiration was a global brand. The Clippers' local TV ratings are trash. The Lakers, Knicks, Celtics, and even the Sixers have more global brand recognition than they do. What makes him remaining a Clipper so valuable that it needed to be written directly into the contract?

Image

Unless...
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Post#1027 » by aj174 » Sat Sep 6, 2025 2:10 pm

https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/6602846/2025/09/05/kawhi-leonard-clippers-nba-investigation-salary-cap-circumvention/

"The NBA has hired New York-based law firm Wachtell, Lipton, Rosen & Katz"

The same firm that was on the Sterling and Sarver cases as well, big firm.

Looks like the league isn't messing around here
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Post#1028 » by xinxin » Sat Sep 6, 2025 2:37 pm

wco81 wrote:
xinxin wrote:
& to think all Kawhi had to do was to plant a freaking tree and he didn’t.



He could have planted a thousand trees and it still wouldn't justify $28 million in cash payments and $20 million in stock.



no argument there.. but hey, at least it would have been something rather than nothing... :D
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Post#1029 » by discconnected » Sat Sep 6, 2025 2:38 pm

I think the nba might be setting this up to bar Kwahi for life. From a marketing perspective, the NBA doesn’t need Kwahi and be leaking the fact that he asked the Maple Leafs for ownership, it is making sure that the emphasis will be on Kwahi and his team for asking for compensation that is illegal and violates union agreements.

Not sure how they will handle Balmer, but this is very serious from a legal perspective due to the players union and cba agreements.

Will be interesting……
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Post#1030 » by Curmudgeon » Sat Sep 6, 2025 2:50 pm

"Plausible deniability" is irrelevant here. As an NBA owner Ballmer was responsible for ensuring that the dollars he was investing in this entity were not being used to pay a Clippers player under the table. If he never bothered to find out how the money was being used, he is just as culpable under the CBA and the NBA constitution.
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Post#1031 » by levon » Sat Sep 6, 2025 3:03 pm

discconnected wrote:I think the nba might be setting this up to bar Kwahi for life. From a marketing perspective, the NBA doesn’t need Kwahi and be leaking the fact that he asked the Maple Leafs for ownership, it is making sure that the emphasis will be on Kwahi and his team for asking for compensation that is illegal and violates union agreements.

Not sure how they will handle Balmer, but this is very serious from a legal perspective due to the players union and cba agreements.

Will be interesting……

They'd have to void his contract and keep the money on the Clippers' books because Kawhi's apparent goal is very much to take the money and run.
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Post#1032 » by ciueli » Sat Sep 6, 2025 3:27 pm

Mr Peanut wrote:Ballmer and the Clippers can play the "plausible deniability" card all they want, but the CBA states that only circumstantial evidence is needed. And the current evidence far exceeds the circumstantial threshold.

Unfortunately all I can see is a hefty fine (hefty to most people, but insignificant to Ballmer who is mega rich) and a few second round picks docked (maybe one first at most). Justice won't be served.


I don't understand why people think this, the league issues minor fines and takes second round picks for tampering which is a tiny fraction of what happened here. The league has literally never had something this serious happen and the last time there was anything close to it the team responsible was absolutely gutted (lost the player and 5 FRP). The league will do its due diligence, but ultimately they can and will come down very hard on Ballmer, the Clippers, and Kawhi. I expect nothing less than a significant suspension for Kawhi, possibly even the complete voiding of his contract, stripping multiple first round picks from the Clippers, and obviously the maximum fine of $7.5M. It's not even out of the question that Ballmer is forced to sell the Clippers, while I doubt the NBA goes that far it's possible given this is not the first time he's been caught circumventing the salary cap.

The other teams will be screaming for Silver to issue the maximum punishment for this, and Silver's whole job is just to do what the other owners tell him to, no way Ballmer and Kawhi come out of this unscathed.
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Post#1033 » by manlisten » Sat Sep 6, 2025 3:27 pm

I think there's a good chance Ballmer/Kawhi are already implicated in the Aspiration case. One of the co-founders already accepted a plea deal and Sanberg just plead guilty a little over a week ago, shortly before all this cap circumvention news broke.

I also think Pablo has more information than he's letting on. Judging by his initial reveal in the podcast, he seems to enjoy the slow burn approach and will probably keep dropping crumbs as the days go by. I don't think the investigation should take very long, it took less than a week for them to pin Sterling and this one seems like an open and shut case as well.
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Post#1034 » by Richard4444 » Sat Sep 6, 2025 3:54 pm

I cant understand why it would be legal for a team sponsor to contract a player of this same team. Because it makes very easy to use these deals to circumvent the salary cap.

The team can always ask the sponsor to instead of giving them 200M in the sponsorship deal, giving them only 150M and paying 50M directly to the player in a way to circumvent the salary cap. Or am I wrong?

If Ballmer was in a bad faith, he would not need to fake invest in the sponsor to pay up KL. He could just ask to the sponsor pay KL in the side deal, discounting the amount of the sponsorship deal. I have a hard time believing Ballmer is so dumb.
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Post#1035 » by wco81 » Sat Sep 6, 2025 4:11 pm

Sixers in 4 wrote:Image




Wow this is the first time I"ve seen local NBA ratings.

Warriors had a good season in 21-22 so I can see ratings being high but how could they be so much higher than the Lakers, Knicks or Bulls, 3 teams in much bigger markets with huge fan bases?

Because I regularly watch local Warriors games and the broadcasts are such low production quality. Hell I know some NBA local games are shown in 4K and the channel which does the Warriors games are a long way from doing something like that. If they're ratings are that high, they should be rolling in cash.
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Post#1036 » by Curmudgeon » Sat Sep 6, 2025 4:58 pm

In another version of the NBA, Connie Hawkins was banned for life for borrowing $200 from Jack Molinas, a loan that was repaid in full by Hawkins' brother Fred before any point shaving scandal broke. Hawkins was a poor kid from Bed-Stuy who didn't have clothes to go to college.

And even years later, the league wouldn't let him in until Hawkins sued. Then the NBA finally relented.

Nowadays we have players routinely feigning injury so their associates can win prop bets by taking the under.
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Post#1037 » by Larry Ellison » Sat Sep 6, 2025 5:02 pm

wco81 wrote:
xinxin wrote:
& to think all Kawhi had to do was to plant a freaking tree and he didn’t.



He could have planted a thousand trees and it still wouldn't justify $28 million in cash payments and $20 million in stock.


I disagree. It is actually possible to quantify the value of every sponsorship appearance by a famous athlete like Kawhi. It would require a valuation expert who is familiar with the market for endorsement contracts and what they typically pay and ask of the endorser in return. I am not going to try to put a number on it but I'd guess that every time Kawhi does anything, whether it be an appearance, social media post, etc. that is worth a six figure amount. They could have done this in a way that had Kawhi put in a little bit of work and nobody would call it a cap violation. Uncle Dennis is the reason the contract was written in such a ridiculous way.
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Post#1038 » by Curmudgeon » Sat Sep 6, 2025 5:07 pm

Larry Ellison wrote:
wco81 wrote:
xinxin wrote:
& to think all Kawhi had to do was to plant a freaking tree and he didn’t.



He could have planted a thousand trees and it still wouldn't justify $28 million in cash payments and $20 million in stock.


I disagree. It is actually possible to quantify the value of every sponsorship appearance by a famous athlete like Kawhi. It would require a valuation expert who is familiar with the market for endorsement contracts and what they typically pay and ask of the endorser in return. I am not going to try to put a number on it but I'd guess that every time Kawhi does anything, whether it be an appearance, social media post, etc. that is worth a six figure amount. They could have done this in a way that had Kawhi put in a little bit of work and nobody would call it a cap violation. Uncle Dennis is the reason the contract was written in such a ridiculous way.


LOL. So you think that if they had done a better drafting job the deal would have been squeaky clean under the league's current noncircumvention rules?

I practiced corporate law for many decades and I'll give you a simple legal principle: If it looks like a duck, walks like a duck, quacks like a duck and smells like a duck, it's a duck.
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Post#1039 » by mastermixer » Sat Sep 6, 2025 5:12 pm

Richard4444 wrote:I cant understand why it would be legal for a team sponsor to contract a player of this same team. Because it makes very easy to use these deals to circumvent the salary cap.

The team can always ask the sponsor to instead of giving them 200M in the sponsorship deal, giving them only 150M and paying 50M directly to the player in a way to circumvent the salary cap. Or am I wrong?

If Ballmer was in a bad faith, he would not need to fake invest in the sponsor to pay up KL. He could just ask to the sponsor pay KL in the side deal, discounting the amount of the sponsorship deal. I have a hard time believing Ballmer is so dumb.


Because at the end of the day the NBA and the players are a business and more about money than competition. I don’t even mean that in a cynical sense.

If they made that separation then that would mean less sponsorship opportunities available for both the team and the players.

Let’s say you’re Toyota, now you have to choose if you want a Clippers Sponsorship deal or KL sponsorship deal. So one of them is out of a deal. Less money to go around for everyone.

Or imagine you’re a major conglomerate like Google. You want to pick Kawhi Leonard to be the face of your new Google Vr product and you want the clippers to advertise Google Chrome browser in their stadium. Now you have to choose.

So If NBA really had a rule that stopped a company from being partners with both player and team, yes it would be the most fair if your goal is competitive balance with no conflict of interest. But it severely limits the money side of things. And we know money comes first.

The players, owner, and league would all choose more money over fair competition.
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Post#1040 » by Sixers in 4 » Sat Sep 6, 2025 5:17 pm

Richard4444 wrote:I cant understand why it would be legal for a team sponsor to contract a player of this same team. Because it makes very easy to use these deals to circumvent the salary cap.

The team can always ask the sponsor to instead of giving them 200M in the sponsorship deal, giving them only 150M and paying 50M directly to the player in a way to circumvent the salary cap. Or am I wrong?

If Ballmer was in a bad faith, he would not need to fake invest in the sponsor to pay up KL. He could just ask to the sponsor pay KL in the side deal, discounting the amount of the sponsorship deal. I have a hard time believing Ballmer is so dumb.


Since it's a private company, if they hadn't filed for bankruptcy, none of this would have surfaced. Why, then, should Ballmer worry? Hell, we only know Kawhi was even an ambassador because he claimed he was owed 7M in the bankruptcy filings. In essence, only a string of unrelated incidents and a little bit of pure luck were responsible for this. Furthermore, the timing of the sponsorship and the 50m figure differ by, if memory serves, something like a year. I think Ballmer pointed that out in the interview.

The company is not going to just front money on the possibility of a future sponsorship with Ballmer and considering they went bankrupt and paid Kawhi in installments and stock options despite getting the full 50M, they may not have even had the cash on hand to do so.

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