Are the 2017 Warriors the most collective amount of Raw talent on team of all time?

[CodeBreaker]

That 2017 Warriors team is like...

SGA and Giannis joining forces in OKC right now. Now read that again and imagine.

[Nate505]

For sure. It's why their titles were a joke.

[pr0wler]

Two top 15 players of all time in their prime.
Two future HoFers
1 former all star

Easily the most talented team ever assembled.

[Wolveswin]

Has anyone mentioned modern day OKC? I know I know, too early.

We know of the big three. Who are so damn young with a future that COULD mean multiple rings and accolades.

But Presti has such a deep team. Assets coming out his asset. Who does he keep? Does he do an all in trade for another young’ish big star?

When the chapters are finally written, a big three with 3+ rings and other players elevated by team success - surely will be in discussion.

[KazuoOda]

2017 GSW is 4-0ing any Bulls team you put in front of them.

[Curmudgeon]

The 1962-63 Celtics, the year after Cousy retired had 7 Hall of Famers, two of whom (KC Jones and Heinsohn) went on to become HOF coaches and another who won two titles as a coach (Russell).

[TheGeneral99]

The 2017 Warriors are in my opinion the greatest team in NBA history in the modern era. It was a 70 win championship level team that added one of the greatest players of all time in his prime...just disgusting.

Curry - top 12 player of all-time
Durant - top 15 player of all-time
Klay - top 100 player of all-time
Green - one of the best defensive players of all-time

And then you got decent depth with Iaggy, McGee, Barnes, Livingston, West, Clark etc.

They steamrolled everyone that year and went 16-1 in the finals, destroying a stacked Cavaliers team with prime Lebron, Kyrie and Love.

[TheGeneral99]

If we don't have to factor in age. 2011 Boston?

Shaq
KG
Pierce
Ray Allen
Rondo
Jermaine O'Neal
Avery Bradley
Nate Robinson
Carlos Arroyo

There also has to have a few Mav teams with Dirk that will blow your mind.

2002 Mavs

Dirk
Nash
Finley
Juwan Howard
Raef LaFrentz
Nick Van Exel
Tin Hardaway
Shawn Bradley
Danny Manning
Avery Johnson

No, because you didn't provide any context.

The 2011 Boston team had an old Shaq and Jermaine who were way past their prime and basically bench players. KG, Allen, and Pierce were also not at their peak. If all of those players were in their late 20s and in their primes, you would have an argument.

The 2002 Mavs is a great team but not close to the talent the 2017 Warriors had.

I mean the Clippers roster in 2024 on paper is crazy with Kawhi, Westbrook, Harden, George, Powell, Zubac etc. but you can't use that because Westbrook is way past his prime and Harden is no longer in his prime. If they were all in their primes that's a juggernaut roster.

[dhsilv2]

If we don't have to factor in age. 2011 Boston?

Shaq
KG
Pierce
Ray Allen
Rondo
Jermaine O'Neal
Avery Bradley
Nate Robinson
Carlos Arroyo

There also has to have a few Mav teams with Dirk that will blow your mind.

2002 Mavs

Dirk
Nash
Finley
Juwan Howard
Raef LaFrentz
Nick Van Exel
Tin Hardaway
Shawn Bradley
Danny Manning
Avery Johnson

No, because you didn't provide any context.

The 2011 Boston team had an old Shaq and Jermaine who were way past their prime and basically bench players. KG, Allen, and Pierce were also not at their peak. If all of those players were in their late 20s and in their primes, you would have an argument.

The 2002 Mavs is a great team but not close to the talent the 2017 Warriors had.

I mean the Clippers roster in 2024 on paper is crazy with Kawhi, Westbrook, Harden, George, Powell, Zubac etc. but you can't use that because Westbrook is way past his prime and Harden is no longer in his prime. If they were all in their primes that's a juggernaut roster.

Isn't the ENTIRE point of this to find the best "RAW TALENT"? The logical place to start are guys WAY WAY past their prime to find the most stacked "raw talent" possible?

[flow]

If we don't have to factor in age. 2011 Boston?

Shaq
KG
Pierce
Ray Allen
Rondo
Jermaine O'Neal
Avery Bradley
Nate Robinson
Carlos Arroyo

There also has to have a few Mav teams with Dirk that will blow your mind.

2002 Mavs

Dirk
Nash
Finley
Juwan Howard
Raef LaFrentz
Nick Van Exel
Tin Hardaway
Shawn Bradley
Danny Manning
Avery Johnson

No, because you didn't provide any context.

The 2011 Boston team had an old Shaq and Jermaine who were way past their prime and basically bench players. KG, Allen, and Pierce were also not at their peak. If all of those players were in their late 20s and in their primes, you would have an argument.

The 2002 Mavs is a great team but not close to the talent the 2017 Warriors had.

I mean the Clippers roster in 2024 on paper is crazy with Kawhi, Westbrook, Harden, George, Powell, Zubac etc. but you can't use that because Westbrook is way past his prime and Harden is no longer in his prime. If they were all in their primes that's a juggernaut roster.

Isn't the ENTIRE point of this to find the best "RAW TALENT"? The logical place to start are guys WAY WAY past their prime to find the most stacked "raw talent" possible?

You're interpreting the word "raw" differently than what was likely meant by OP (or anyone else in this discussion). He's basically saying the greatest amount of combined/overall talent (at the time) regardless of how they may have gelled as a team. Of course, the '17 warriors gelled just fine.

.

[dhsilv2]

No, because you didn't provide any context.

The 2011 Boston team had an old Shaq and Jermaine who were way past their prime and basically bench players. KG, Allen, and Pierce were also not at their peak. If all of those players were in their late 20s and in their primes, you would have an argument.

The 2002 Mavs is a great team but not close to the talent the 2017 Warriors had.

I mean the Clippers roster in 2024 on paper is crazy with Kawhi, Westbrook, Harden, George, Powell, Zubac etc. but you can't use that because Westbrook is way past his prime and Harden is no longer in his prime. If they were all in their primes that's a juggernaut roster.

Isn't the ENTIRE point of this to find the best "RAW TALENT"? The logical place to start are guys WAY WAY past their prime to find the most stacked "raw talent" possible?

You're interpreting the word "raw" differently than what was likely meant by OP (or anyone else in this discussion). He's basically saying the greatest amount of combined/overall talent (at the time) regardless of how they may have gelled as a team. Of course, the '17 warriors gelled just fine.

.

That isn't what "raw" means. Raw is almost always intended to mean "not in prime". I've never seen it used any other way. If the intent was greatest team in terms of ability he could say "talented". The "raw" qualifier means to remove age, injury, and what ever else. It's just "raw" talent.

[michaelm]

Isn't the ENTIRE point of this to find the best "RAW TALENT"? The logical place to start are guys WAY WAY past their prime to find the most stacked "raw talent" possible?

You're interpreting the word "raw" differently than what was likely meant by OP (or anyone else in this discussion). He's basically saying the greatest amount of combined/overall talent (at the time) regardless of how they may have gelled as a team. Of course, the '17 warriors gelled just fine.

.

That isn't what "raw" means. Raw is almost always intended to mean "not in prime". I've never seen it used any other way. If the intent was greatest team in terms of ability he could say "talented". The "raw" qualifier means to remove age, injury, and what ever else. It's just "raw" talent.

I agree with you. Their combination of raw talent, fit and playing schemes are close to unmatched, with Curry and KD extremely complementary in that season during which KD fully bought in for the whole season. He has been searching for such magic again since, but I doubt a similarly complementary player exists now or perhaps ever existed previously. Of course since the 2019 finals all his teams and play for those teams have been post the Achilles’ tear though.

So yes how great a team GSW were and whether they had the most raw talent as a team are different questions, although not completely unrelated of course.

[dhsilv2]

You're interpreting the word "raw" differently than what was likely meant by OP (or anyone else in this discussion). He's basically saying the greatest amount of combined/overall talent (at the time) regardless of how they may have gelled as a team. Of course, the '17 warriors gelled just fine.

.

That isn't what "raw" means. Raw is almost always intended to mean "not in prime". I've never seen it used any other way. If the intent was greatest team in terms of ability he could say "talented". The "raw" qualifier means to remove age, injury, and what ever else. It's just "raw" talent.

I agree with you. Their combination of raw talent, fit and playing schemes are close to unmatched, with Curry and KD extremely complementary in that season during which KD fully bought in for the whole season. He has been searching for such magic again since, but I doubt a similarly complementary player exists now or perhaps ever existed previously. Of course since the 2019 finals all his teams and play for those teams have been post the Achilles’ tear though.

So yes how great a team GSW were and whether they had the most raw talent as a team are different questions, although not completely unrelated of course.

Well no...that team was optimal aged. They aren't the best raw talent. Though its' wild they were not far off which is crazy.

[michaelm]

Double

[michaelm]

That isn't what "raw" means. Raw is almost always intended to mean "not in prime". I've never seen it used any other way. If the intent was greatest team in terms of ability he could say "talented". The "raw" qualifier means to remove age, injury, and what ever else. It's just "raw" talent.

I agree with you. Their combination of raw talent, fit and playing schemes are close to unmatched, with Curry and KD extremely complementary in that season during which KD fully bought in for the whole season. He has been searching for such magic again since, but I doubt a similarly complementary player exists now or perhaps ever existed previously. Of course since the 2019 finals all his teams and play for those teams have been post the Achilles’ tear though.

So yes how great a team GSW were and whether they had the most raw talent as a team are different questions, although not completely unrelated of course.

Well no...that team was optimal aged. They aren't the best raw talent. Though its' wild they were not far off which is crazy.

That was my point, they had great “raw talent’ but also combined at the right time with great fit and good coaching (at the time) with a playing scheme which helped optimise those talented players who were at or close to their primes. Even in their own time the KD OKC team was arguably more talented but never coalesced as the 2017 GSW team did.

[Sane]

WOW 67% is crazy high agreement for a question like this.

There’s no team in NBA history whose 4th best player is considered by everyone to be a near-max or max player. Your 4th best player is a DPOY big man who gets 8 assists and has won a title already in that role lol.

That’s why everyone but the rockets and Cavs packed it up and punted on that season.

[AussieBuck]

Has anyone mentioned modern day OKC? I know I know, too early.

We know of the big three. Who are so damn young with a future that COULD mean multiple rings and accolades.

But Presti has such a deep team. Assets coming out his asset. Who does he keep? Does he do an all in trade for another young’ish big star?

When the chapters are finally written, a big three with 3+ rings and other players elevated by team success - surely will be in discussion.

Yeah, They look like the 91 Bulls with better bigs and depth for days. Sure SGA might only be 90% of Jordan or whatever but the rest is just stupid. And they a million picks to keep improving until they have a GOAT level team.

[GreatWhiteStiff]

The raptors had a lot of raw talent on one team at one time, with a young McGrady/Vince/Camby/Chauncey Billups. Might be forgetting someone else.

[Wolveswin]

Has anyone mentioned modern day OKC? I know I know, too early.

We know of the big three. Who are so damn young with a future that COULD mean multiple rings and accolades.

But Presti has such a deep team. Assets coming out his asset. Who does he keep? Does he do an all in trade for another young’ish big star?

When the chapters are finally written, a big three with 3+ rings and other players elevated by team success - surely will be in discussion.

Yeah, They look like the 91 Bulls with better bigs and depth for days. Sure SGA might only be 90% of Jordan or whatever but the rest is just stupid. And they a million picks to keep improving until they have a GOAT level team.

I think what Presti has done in OKC is amazing. How good his roster is and how many assets he still has is truly amazing.

The league is very lucky he is a human and missed on a few picks. His big draft was in 2022 with Chet and Jalen (but missed on Dieng - who is ok for depth). But can you imagine if 2021 he would have kept Sengun and drafted Wagner at #6 (he went 8th). The league was super close to - in back to back drafts - having a Presti dynasty of:

Sengun
Chet
Wagner
Jalen
SGA

I know every GM has misses, but when one has so many hits like Presti, fun to imagine how close he was to being perfect GM.

[dhsilv2]

WOW 67% is crazy high agreement for a question like this.

There’s no team in NBA history whose 4th best player is considered by everyone to be a near-max or max player. Your 4th best player is a DPOY big man who gets 8 assists and has won a title already in that role lol.

That’s why everyone but the rockets and Cavs packed it up and punted on that season.

Iggy was a big man? I can see PDOY level perhaps though that seems a bit much.