PG: ohh no, we suck again!

[HumbleRen]

It is 100% true. RJ and Jakobe don’t have the same level of attention from their defenders on the perimeter.

It’s not RJ’s fault, it’s just a shooters repetition often takes years to get the respect of a defender from the 3 point line if you aren’t drafted into the league as a known shooter.

There is also that RJ is much worse ATB than those guys, so they really only have to guard him from the right-side corner. Obviously, that hasn't been quite the case over the opening two games, but he hasn't historically been any sort of consistent threat from up top, so there's no real reason to lend any extra defensive attention to him in that spot until he's able to show it over a meaningful sample, you know?

Yeah, sometimes it takes years to develop a shooting reputation. RJ shot 40% from the 3 on the Knicks for one season and it didn’t change how defences defended him the next following season.

It’s why I don’t view 3 point percentage as the end all, be all. Shooting 35% from the 3 on mainly catch and shoot 3’s isn’t changing how defences guard RJ.

[tsherkin]

Yeah, sometimes it takes years to develop a shooting reputation. RJ shot 40% from the 3 on the Knicks for one season and it didn’t change how defences defended him the next following season.

But again, that season, he took nearly 43% of his total 3PA from the corners, and shot 42.4%.

He actually shot well enough ATB that year, but that's been his deal: he's a corner 3 merchant and he's treated as such. He actually took 2.3 3PA/g at 37.3% FG from ATB that year, which as I said was him shooting well enough. But it was his second season. Subsequently, he's shot 35, 30.3, 34, and 33.3% from ATB. So he's established a reputation of not being super dangerous from there, and is defended accordingly.

If that changes this year, then we'll eventually see teams adapt.

He's a career 34.7% 3pt shooter who has shot 37% from the corners in his career, but has had some better seasons. He's a 41.3% shooter from the corners with Toronto, though, and so as we leverage that, we'll see teams treat him differently. Likewise if he rediscovers his ATB 3.

[deck]

It’s what they’re already doing, Darko may just have to do it quicker.

RJ is one of the worst defenders at his position, IQ is average at best. Ingram is mid at it.

That’s all 3 of your perimeter guys being below average as a collective on defence.

Meanwhile on the offence side, RJ, Scottie and Poeltl provide 0 spacing gravity.

I’m just not sure how that starting 5 can win their minutes against good teams.

RJ has shot 36% from 3 as a Rap and 43% this year can we not lump him in with Barnes/Jakob for shooting? lol

If Barnes or Yak could shoot like Barrett they’d be all nba players

Shooting percentage isn’t spacing gravity. They are completely are okay with RJ shooting 3’s.

RJ, Jakobe and Gradey shoot a similar % from the 3. One is attracting a different echelon of attention from the perimeter than the other 2 lol.

Your assertion is that RJ, Scottie, and Poeltl all provide the same spacing gravity? Because that is what your post effectively says. What a ridiculous thing to say.

[LoveMyRaps]

Crazy overreactions after just the second game of the season.

We've been playing well from preseason till now.

These next five games are gonna be pretty challenging - Mavs, Spurs, Rockets, Grizzlies, Cavs.

I'd be content with us winning only two of those games AS LONG AS we remain competitive in the others.

Once this team puts it all together (by the 10-15 game mark), I think we'll be very good the rest of the way and will make the playoffs.

[nikster]

Crazy overreactions after just the second game of the season.

We've been playing well from preseason till now.

These next five games are gonna be pretty challenging - Mavs, Spurs, Rockets, Grizzlies, Cavs.

I'd be content with us winning only two of those games AS LONG AS we remain competitive in the others.

Once this team puts it all together (by the 10-15 game mark), I think we'll be very good the rest of the way and will make the playoffs.

Yeah ive been saying similar time frame, give this team 15 games or so before we really make judgements

[TorontoBarneys]

Trade everyone.

[causal_fan]

Trade everyone.

Except Gary Temple

[HumbleRen]

RJ has shot 36% from 3 as a Rap and 43% this year can we not lump him in with Barnes/Jakob for shooting? lol

If Barnes or Yak could shoot like Barrett they’d be all nba players

Shooting percentage isn’t spacing gravity. They are completely are okay with RJ shooting 3’s.

RJ, Jakobe and Gradey shoot a similar % from the 3. One is attracting a different echelon of attention from the perimeter than the other 2 lol.

Your assertion is that RJ, Scottie, and Poeltl all provide the same spacing gravity? Because that is what your post effectively says. What a ridiculous thing to say.

No, my assertion is that they don’t provide spacing gravity in any meaningful way. Obviously Poeltl and Scottie are significantly worse in contributing to that.

The only threats from the perimeter are IQ and BI.

[YogurtProducer]

It is 100% true. RJ and Jakobe don’t have the same level of attention from their defenders on the perimeter.

It’s not RJ’s fault, it’s just a shooters repetition often takes years to get the respect of a defender from the 3 point line if you aren’t drafted into the league as a known shooter.

There is also that RJ is much worse ATB than those guys, so they really only have to guard him from the right-side corner. Obviously, that hasn't been quite the case over the opening two games, but he hasn't historically been any sort of consistent threat from up top, so there's no real reason to lend any extra defensive attention to him in that spot until he's able to show it over a meaningful sample, you know?

Barrett has shot 37% from the right side ATB as a raptor for his carrer to be fair, and his other spots haven’t been to far off league average at all

[tsherkin]

Barrett has shot 37% from the right side ATB as a raptor for his carrer to be fair, and his other spots haven’t been to far off league average at all

But again, he's been pretty crap from ATB overall for several years in a row now, which is definitely a feature element of why he doesn't receive a lot of defensive attention there. I'm sure teams are aware of his zone-specific numbers, and just don't really care to do anything differently because he's average from there in his better seasons, 2021 notwithstanding.

[YogurtProducer]

Barrett has shot 37% from the right side ATB as a raptor for his carrer to be fair, and his other spots haven’t been to far off league average at all

But again, he's been pretty crap from ATB overall for several years in a row now, which is definitely a feature element of why he doesn't receive a lot of defensive attention there. I'm sure teams are aware of his zone-specific numbers, and just don't really care to do anything differently because he's average from there in his better seasons, 2021 notwithstanding.

He gets a lot more attention than we seek to be giving him credit for. He’s not on the report as a guy you can’t lose but he also isn’t a guy you leave wide open

[tsherkin]

He gets a lot more attention than we seek to be giving him credit for. He’s not on the report as a guy you can’t lose but he also isn’t a guy you leave wide open

Sure. Wasn't suggesting otherwise, but responding to a specific point about why he doesn't get more attention than he sees at this time.

[LoveMyRaps]

BRANDON
INGRAM

[YogurtProducer]

He gets a lot more attention than we seek to be giving him credit for. He’s not on the report as a guy you can’t lose but he also isn’t a guy you leave wide open

Sure. Wasn't suggesting otherwise, but responding to a specific point about why he doesn't get more attention than he sees at this time.

The original point was a poster linking RJ in with Barnes/Poeltl in terms of spacing to be fair.

[tsherkin]

Sure. Wasn't suggesting otherwise, but responding to a specific point about why he doesn't get more attention than he sees at this time.

The original point was a poster linking RJ in with Barnes/Poeltl in terms of spacing to be fair.[/quote]

True enough. But like I said, I was examining the defensive attention angle, wherefore my commentary on his ATB shooting. There's no real need for teams to cover him more because he isn't making them pay to a level where that's a good trade-off, that's all.

Looks like he's off to a very nice start to the season regardless, though. 12 FGA/g in 30 mpg is a pretty good rough level of usage for him. He obviously isn't going to shoot 68% from the field all year, nor is he apt to continue shooting 40% from 3 while only 10% of them are coming from the corner, nor is he apt to stay 0-for there, either. So we'll see what he looks like after he settles down. But early, it looks like he has a reasonable usage level and that's helping him do well.

Scottie's going to calm down soon. The FT and 3pt shooting won't last. But he's shooting a ton inside the arc and at a rate similar to his career numbers, which is nice. And his FTr has been relatively low compared to the past two seasons despite smashing it around the a lot more than recently, so that's likely to come up a bit. If he can keep up that general distribution, even as his FT% and 3P% drop, he's going to have a very good season.

[Vampirate]

Sure. Wasn't suggesting otherwise, but responding to a specific point about why he doesn't get more attention than he sees at this time.

The original point was a poster linking RJ in with Barnes/Poeltl in terms of spacing to be fair.

True enough. But like I said, I was examining the defensive attention angle, wherefore my commentary on his ATB shooting. There's no real need for teams to cover him more because he isn't making them pay to a level where that's a good trade-off, that's all.

Looks like he's off to a very nice start to the season regardless, though. 12 FGA/g in 30 mpg is a pretty good rough level of usage for him. He obviously isn't going to shoot 68% from the field all year, nor is he apt to continue shooting 40% from 3 while only 10% of them are coming from the corner, nor is he apt to stay 0-for there, either. So we'll see what he looks like after he settles down. But early, it looks like he has a reasonable usage level and that's helping him do well.

Scottie's going to calm down soon. The FT and 3pt shooting won't last. But he's shooting a ton inside the arc and at a rate similar to his career numbers, which is nice. And his FTr has been relatively low compared to the past two seasons despite smashing it around the a lot more than recently, so that's likely to come up a bit. If he can keep up that general distribution, even as his FT% and 3P% drop, he's going to have a very good season.

Looking at his numbers, I can buy that he might have a season of above 80% FT shooting because he's flirted near 80% a couple of years getting to 78% one year. His 3pt shooting is definitely coming down but he isn't launching that many, only 3 a game, so he could (and actually should) have a bounce back year from 3, with low enough volume and it's variance, he probably can get to 31% from 3. Really I just want semi respectable numbers from 3 at this point, not the 27.1% he had last year.

[tsherkin]

Looking at his numbers, I can buy that he might have a season of above 80% FT shooting because he's flirted near 80% a couple of years getting to 78% one year. His 3pt shooting is definitely coming down but he isn't launching that many, only 3 a game, so he could (and actually should) have a bounce back year from 3, with low enough volume and it's variance, he probably can get to 31% from 3. Really I just want semi respectable numbers from 3 at this point, not the 27.1% he had last year.

I can buy 31% from 3 from Scottie, sure. It's not great, and no one will respect it, but it's better than 27%. And yes, so far, he isn't over-shooting it, which is great. If he can maintain this proportion of shots around the rim, or anything near it, I will be thrilled, because he's crushing it right now.