Bears thread 13

[TheSuzerain]

My fear is that Williams turns out to be another Zach Wilson. While Williams is certainly more talented, a lot of the things that people fawned over for Caleb, were the same for Wilson. Ridiculous comparisons to Mahomes and rodgers and unrealistic expectations are the result of horrible scouting. And a possible consequence of that is Williams so much pressure that he can’t even be average. Yes, it’s not even halfway through his second and he needs patience, but most of mine was spent after firing lovie

He's more in the Trevor Lawrence/ Kyler Murray tier.

Not a bust (Wilson, Trubisky, Fields) but a disappointment.

Still early but that's what I'm seeing.

Those were some of the names tossed around at comps on here before he was drafted.

That is a very dangerous tier because it usually ends up in an overpay on that 2nd contract if the team that drafted him keeps him. You end up paying "franchise" money to a very average QB.

There is still time though. I think we are all just waiting for it to finally "click" with him.

Agreed. I feel like Ben Johnson is a good voice to have on the topic though.

If we had our typical defense first HC, there's zero chance they'd have the guts to do anything but pay him.

[fleet]

So.... I still want so badly, in my heart, to believe Caleb is that guy. But my eyes and my brain tell me differently. So far I see poor football IQ/decision making, an inaccurate arm, slow reaction times.

And it's not like he is starting one of his first few games. We're well into season 2.

Beyond the scripted plays, I don’t see him thinking well and reacting with the IQ needed so far, consistently enough in order to have confidence that it’s going to come. Some physical things we have seen quarterbacks fix with reps and technique work. The thinking second by second is what it is normally. If someone can inform me how that happens for Caleb, I am all ears. Ben Johnson will simplify things for him as far as he can. But this is tough to overcome sufficiently in terms of the highest level of quarterbacking. When Caleb learns more about the offense, he will improve. Will he be the generational guy? Those guys have the total package. Caleb is a little light.

[Bulls69]

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[Jello Biafra]

So.... I still want so badly, in my heart, to believe Caleb is that guy. But my eyes and my brain tell me differently. So far I see poor football IQ/decision making, an inaccurate arm, slow reaction times.

And it's not like he is starting one of his first few games. We're well into season 2.

Beyond the scripted plays, I don’t see him thinking well and reacting with the IQ needed so far, consistently enough in order to have confidence that it’s going to come. Some physical things we have seen quarterbacks fix with reps and technique work. The thinking second by second is what it is normally. If someone can inform me how that happens for Caleb, I am all ears. Ben Johnson will simplify things for him as far as he can. But this is tough to overcome sufficiently in terms of the highest level of quarterbacking. When Caleb learns more about the offense, he will improve. Will he be the generational guy? Those guys have the total package. Caleb is a little light.

You don't win consistently with a low football IQ QB. Hopefully he is overthinking and the game will slow down, but man, he makes bad decisions and is inaccurate.

[dice]

So.... I still want so badly, in my heart, to believe Caleb is that guy. But my eyes and my brain tell me differently. So far I see poor football IQ/decision making, an inaccurate arm, slow reaction times.

And it's not like he is starting one of his first few games. We're well into season 2.

Beyond the scripted plays, I don’t see him thinking well and reacting with the IQ needed so far, consistently enough in order to have confidence that it’s going to come. Some physical things we have seen quarterbacks fix with reps and technique work. The thinking second by second is what it is normally. If someone can inform me how that happens for Caleb, I am all ears. Ben Johnson will simplify things for him as far as he can. But this is tough to overcome sufficiently in terms of the highest level of quarterbacking. When Caleb learns more about the offense, he will improve. Will he be the generational guy? Those guys have the total package. Caleb is a little light.

mahomes-lite hopes are fading, but he can still be a 2nd tier guy

[dice]

maye plays well, they win. he doesn't, they lose. now 6-2

and is today the day justin leapfrogs dalton once and for all? stay tuned!

[Betta Bulleavit]

People, we lost a tough game. Can we just get over it ans stop acting like every loss means we need a new coach or QB?? I think it's important to understand that a validated lack of patience doesn't mean that it's not required. Lets just give this thing some time, please!

[Dresden]

What a sucky game. This team has a ways to go. They make way too many mistakes. 12 more penalties today, giving up kickoff returns to the 35-45 every kick, can't get it in the end zone from inside the 5.

I just had a feeling when they got pinned back inside the 5 that Caleb might throw a pick 6 in that situation. They look like a team that needs another 6 weeks of practice to iron out some of these issues.

[Dresden]

Moore needs to be a bigger emphasis in the offense. By Johnson and Williams

Sometimes, I wish they'd just let Caleb air it out, and throw the ball 40-45 times a game so he can get in a rhythm. The last couple of drives they did that and they moved the ball pretty well.

[Betta Bulleavit]

What a sucky game. This team has a ways to go. They make way too many mistakes. 12 more penalties today, giving up kickoff returns to the 35-45 every kick, can't get it in the end zone from inside the 5.

I just had a feeling when they got pinned back inside the 5 that Caleb might throw a pick 6 in that situation. They look like a team that needs another 6 weeks of practice to iron out some of these issues.

They do. And I'd say the whole season really. If instant gratification is one's cup of tea, they should probably find another team to follow because.this one is still a ways off. It's really that simple.

[TheGOATRises007]

The penalties are just killer

We didn't deserve to win today, but that missed call on Hopkins is a disgrace. The refs would have called offensive PI on us for that same play with how the season has gone.

[NZB2323]

My fear is that Williams turns out to be another Zach Wilson. While Williams is certainly more talented, a lot of the things that people fawned over for Caleb, were the same for Wilson. Ridiculous comparisons to Mahomes and rodgers and unrealistic expectations are the result of horrible scouting. And a possible consequence of that is Williams so much pressure that he can’t even be average. Yes, it’s not even halfway through his second and he needs patience, but most of mine was spent after firing lovie

I was also against firing Lovie but that has nothing to do with Williams.

On the one hand, it’s frustrating that he’s not better. On the other hand, Baker Mayfield, Mac Jones, and Daniel Jones are all playing much better than they did in their 2nd year.

[Stratmaster]

People, we lost a tough game. Can we just get over it ans stop acting like every loss means we need a new coach or QB?? I think it's important to understand that a validated lack of patience doesn't mean that it's not required. Lets just give this thing some time, please!

If you're seeing something different please fill me in. What has Caleb looked good at? I would love some hope right now.

[Dresden]

The penalties are just killer

We didn't deserve to win today, but that missed call on Hopkins is a disgrace. The refs would have called offensive PI on us for that same play with how the season has gone.

The other call I thought they missed was on that controversial play where Zacheus got hit, and the ball got dislodged, and he and the defender came down with it at the same time. It looked like a helmet to helmet hit by the defender, and should have been a 15 yard penalty. None of the announcers or the ref in the booth pointed that out, but he hit Zacheus right in the face with the top of his helmet.

[Dresden]

People, we lost a tough game. Can we just get over it ans stop acting like every loss means we need a new coach or QB?? I think it's important to understand that a validated lack of patience doesn't mean that it's not required. Lets just give this thing some time, please!

If you're seeing something different please fill me in. What has Caleb looked good at? I would love some hope right now.

He's got a rocket arm, and can make a 20 yard sideline throw look easy. When he's on, he's zipping the ball on a rope and putting it right where it needs to be. The problem is consistency.

[Dresden]

What a sucky game. This team has a ways to go. They make way too many mistakes. 12 more penalties today, giving up kickoff returns to the 35-45 every kick, can't get it in the end zone from inside the 5.

I just had a feeling when they got pinned back inside the 5 that Caleb might throw a pick 6 in that situation. They look like a team that needs another 6 weeks of practice to iron out some of these issues.

They do. And I'd say the whole season really. If instant gratification is one's cup of tea, they should probably find another team to follow because.this one is still a ways off. It's really that simple.

And I"m sure Ben Johnson is going to weed out a lot of players after the season who can't follow what he wants them to do.

[Betta Bulleavit]

People, we lost a tough game. Can we just get over it ans stop acting like every loss means we need a new coach or QB?? I think it's important to understand that a validated lack of patience doesn't mean that it's not required. Lets just give this thing some time, please!

If you're seeing something different please fill me in. What has Caleb looked good at? I would love some hope right now.

Poise, elusivness, ball placement and clutch ability are all things that we've seen at times. It's the consistency of these things that we're missing. And I get how infuriating that can be. But I believe that a significant part of that is just his development curve.

If it's one thing that we're seeing pretty frequently (especially over the last decade or so) is players being evaluated based on tags they were given as prospects rather than just letting these guys bake. I believe either Drew Brees or Matt Ryan recently eluded to this. Guys that are dubbed as 'generational' are expected to be top 5 QBs within 2 years and if they aren't, they are either divas, headcases or have poor work ethics even though none of those things my apply. They could just be a coming into th league being a few years away from being polished products.

[fleet]

I don’t know about that. Caleb’s handicaps are supposed to be considered as normal development speedbumps? He is worst in the NFL at some things. I don’t know if all of what ails Caleb are just reg growth patterns. Are we moving the goalposts? We are often counseled that Caleb is gonna be “fine”. Or “good”. Well, that wasn’t all of what was on the menu. Beating Tom Brady’s numbers was on the menu. Being another Mahomes was on the menu. When we are asked for patience, is the full menu still being printed?

If you’re wanting to be more positive about it, thats great. But nobody knows one way or another. Just stop acting like people are being unreasonable to have doubts or questions. That’s not a fair ask.

[Betta Bulleavit]

I don’t know about that. Caleb’s handicaps are supposed to be considered as normal development speedbumps? He is worst in the NFL at some things. I don’t know if all of what ails Caleb are just reg growth patterns. Are we moving the goalposts? We are often counseled that Caleb is gonna be “fine”. Or “good”. Well, that wasn’t all of what was on the menu. Beating Tom Brady’s numbers was on the menu. Being another Mahomes was on the menu. When we are asked for patience, is the full menu still being printed?

If you’re wanting to be more positive about it, thats great. But nobody knows one way or another. Just stop acting like people are being unreasonable to have doubts or questions. That’s not a fair ask.

For me, doubts and concerns aren't out of the norm nor do those things really bother me. It's the lack of patience and sometimes extreme overreactions that I'm speaking against. The menu is all well and good. But let's not act like Caleb himself is the one that drew up that menu. The media and so-called analysts did that for him just as they have many other quarterbacks that they are calling generational every other year it seems.

In my opinion, Caleb is a talented QB that simply isn't close to being a finished product. And given how much of him I watched in college, there's nothing about that that shocks me. While I believe in his talent, I was never all in on the hype.

[fleet]

I don’t know about that. Caleb’s handicaps are supposed to be considered as normal development speedbumps? He is worst in the NFL at some things. I don’t know if all of what ails Caleb are just reg growth patterns. Are we moving the goalposts? We are often counseled that Caleb is gonna be “fine”. Or “good”. Well, that wasn’t all of what was on the menu. Beating Tom Brady’s numbers was on the menu. Being another Mahomes was on the menu. When we are asked for patience, is the full menu still being printed?

If you’re wanting to be more positive about it, thats great. But nobody knows one way or another. Just stop acting like people are being unreasonable to have doubts or questions. That’s not a fair ask.

For me, doubts and concerns aren't out of the norm nor do those things really bother me. It's the lack of patience and sometimes extreme overreactions that I'm speaking against. The menu is all well and good. But let's not act like Caleb himself is the one that drew up that menu. The media and so-called analysts did that for him just as they have many other quarterbacks that they are calling generational every other year it seems.

In my opinion, Caleb is a talented QB that simply isn't close to being a finished product. And given how much of him I watched in college, there's nothing about that that shocks me. While I believe in his talent, I was never all in on the hype.

IIRC, Caleb literally has breaking Tom Brady’s records on his home page to do list. Freely displayed for the public to digest.


Some people got mad when doubt and questions were raised over Justin Fields too. However you classify those. Not that Caleb is Justin. Hardly anyone believes that. Folks are entitled to it. All of it. Its all fair, and it’s all reasonable.