Massive NBA Conspiracy Continues To Unfold! Loss vs DET 10/26

[redslastlaugh]

My understanding is the salary figures for June trades are from 2025-26. After the season we will have a couple of weeks before the league calendar flips over and if we take a player into the TPE it will be at their cap figure for 25-26, in which case all the guys I listed would fit into the TPE

This is my understanding anyway

[Curmudgeon]

If rebounding were the issue, Charles Bassey was there for the taking. This is just a blatant tank by Stevens and Mazulla. I didn't think Mazulla had it in him to lose on purpose, but apparently he does.

I think Joe is unlikely to be bought in on the tank, but that's what the money is for.
He's going to coach his pants off and do his darndest to get this team to the playoffs.

If he were coaching his pants off, Simons would be at the end of the bench and Minott (22 years old) and Gonzalez (19 years old) would be playing 25+ minutes each, and so would Queta, absent foul trouble.

He's coaching to lose, and everyone can see it. He's covering Stevens' butt, who erred when he took back Simons. You don't think someone like Pelinka would have jumped at the chance to get Jrue Holiday?

[redslastlaugh]

If rebounding were the issue, Charles Bassey was there for the taking. This is just a blatant tank by Stevens and Mazulla. I didn't think Mazulla had it in him to lose on purpose, but apparently he does.

I think Joe is unlikely to be bought in on the tank, but that's what the money is for.
He's going to coach his pants off and do his darndest to get this team to the playoffs.

If he were coaching his pants off, Simons would be at the end of the bench and Minott (22 years old) and Gonzalez (19 years old) would be playing 25+ minutes each, and so would Queta, absent foul trouble.

He's coaching to lose, and everyone can see it.

no way. Joe isn't capable of that and it absolutely doesn't look like that. He took a low probability challenge last night trying desperately to steal one possession down 11 in the 4th. He is 100% trying to win

[keevsnick1]

They can use the tpe this summer. Doesn't need to be used by trade deadline.


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Yea, and players who would fit inside the TPE include:

Jarrett Allen
Jakob Poeltl
Naz Reid
Okongwu
Zubac
Steven Adams
Gafford
Mitchell Robinson
Wendell Carter JR

Allen signed an extension..so he's not eligible to be traded until February 2. And even then, the C's are unlikely to use the TPE until the summer because that would mean adding payroll but clearly the objective this season is trimming payroll and not adding to it.

Plus the Cavs are trying to win a championship this season so there's no way in hell they are trading Allen during the season.

Then in the summer, Allen's extension kicks in and he'll be at like $32mil a year so will no longer fit the TPE.

Zubac - making $18, 19 and $20mil a year over these next 3 years is one of the best value contracts in the league..Clippers are trying to win, too so there' s no way in hell they're trading him.

Some of the other names though could be a possibility if they are available next summer..

Clippers are trying to win *right now.* That's a very old team, that wheels could fall off anytime and then they'd enter a rebuild where Zubac might be available.

I think it would make a lot of sense to try and swap Simons out for somebody making just under their current TPE of 22.5 million. That would allow them to take that player into the TPE and generate an even larger TPE of 27.6 million that would be viable for one year. It would also save them a little money this year. One idea would be Simons-->Nurkic. That would save then 8.3 million in salary and another big chunk in luxury tax while expanding the TPE.

[djFan71]

My understanding is the salary figures for June trades are from 2025-26. After the season we will have a couple of weeks before the league calendar flips over and if we take a player into the TPE it will be at their cap figure for 25-26, in which case all the guys I listed would fit into the TPE

This is my understanding anyway

That sounds right to me. Once the calendar flips in July a few guys wouldn't fit - but Brad was done with most of his work by then this year anyway. Could always hit the situation where the other team(s) in the trade couldn't do it til the 26-27 year, though.

[Curmudgeon]

no way. Joe isn't capable of that and it absolutely doesn't look like that. He took a low probability challenge last night trying desperately to steal one possession down 11 in the 4th. He is 100% trying to win

He's absolutely capable of it and he's doing it right before our eyes.

[Hal14]

Yea, and players who would fit inside the TPE include:

Jarrett Allen
Jakob Poeltl
Naz Reid
Okongwu
Zubac
Steven Adams
Gafford
Mitchell Robinson
Wendell Carter JR

Allen signed an extension..so he's not eligible to be traded until February 2. And even then, the C's are unlikely to use the TPE until the summer because that would mean adding payroll but clearly the objective this season is trimming payroll and not adding to it.

Plus the Cavs are trying to win a championship this season so there's no way in hell they are trading Allen during the season.

Then in the summer, Allen's extension kicks in and he'll be at like $32mil a year so will no longer fit the TPE.

Zubac - making $18, 19 and $20mil a year over these next 3 years is one of the best value contracts in the league..Clippers are trying to win, too so there' s no way in hell they're trading him.

Some of the other names though could be a possibility if they are available next summer..

Clippers are trying to win *right now.* That's a very old team, that wheels could fall off anytime and then they'd enter a rebuild where Zubac might be available.

I think it would make a lot of sense to try and swap Simons out for somebody making just under their current TPE of 22.5 million. That would allow them to take that player into the TPE and generate an even larger TPE of 27.6 million that would be viable for one year. It would also save them a little money this year.

I'll believe it when I see it. That's not how the Clippers operate. Even when they traded Paul George, did they use it as an opportunity to rebuild? Did they trade PG for young players/picks? No, they traded him for James Harden.

That's what the Clippers do.

They just keep adding more vets, year after year.

Ballmer has money coming out of his ears so he just keeps throwing more $ at proven vets to just keep trying for a title.

And even if they did a rebuild, the guys they would look to trade would be Kawhi, Harden, Beal, Collins..

Zubac is only 28 yrs old, never gets hurt, is 1 of the best contracts in the league - he's the last guy they would trade.

[redslastlaugh]

no way. Joe isn't capable of that and it absolutely doesn't look like that. He took a low probability challenge last night trying desperately to steal one possession down 11 in the 4th. He is 100% trying to win

He's absolutely capable of it and he's doing it right before our eyes.

okay, I dont see it that way, just totally gonna have to agree to disagree...

[redslastlaugh]

I have to admit, with the new CBA it is really hard even for die hard fans to stay current on every trade rule and what not, which took a lot of the fun out this last offseason for me, just coming up with countless Jrue and KP trades that ended up illegal under the trade rules, lol

My understanding is the salary figures for June trades are from 2025-26. After the season we will have a couple of weeks before the league calendar flips over and if we take a player into the TPE it will be at their cap figure for 25-26, in which case all the guys I listed would fit into the TPE

This is my understanding anyway

That sounds right to me. Once the calendar flips in July a few guys wouldn't fit - but Brad was done with most of his work by then this year anyway. Could always hit the situation where the other team(s) in the trade couldn't do it til the 26-27 year, though.

[redslastlaugh]

Zubac - making $18, 19 and $20mil a year over these next 3 years is one of the best value contracts in the league..Clippers are trying to win, too so there' s no way in hell they're trading him.

Some of the other names though could be a possibility if they are available next summer..

Clippers are trying to win *right now.* That's a very old team, that wheels could fall off anytime and then they'd enter a rebuild where Zubac might be available.

I think it would make a lot of sense to try and swap Simons out for somebody making just under their current TPE of 22.5 million. That would allow them to take that player into the TPE and generate an even larger TPE of 27.6 million that would be viable for one year. It would also save them a little money this year.

I'll believe it when I see it. That's not how the Clippers operate. Even when they traded Paul George, did they use it as an opportunity to rebuild? Did they trade PG for young players/picks? No, they traded him for James Harden.

That's what the Clippers do.

They just keep adding more vets, year after year.

Ballmer has money coming out of his ears so he just keeps throwing more $ at proven vets to just keep trying for a title.

And even if they did a rebuild, the guys they would look to trade would be Kawhi, Harden, Beal, Collins..

Zubac is only 28 yrs old, never gets hurt, is 1 of the best contracts in the league - he's the last guy they would trade.

Probably LA is not trading Zubac. But also there's a lot of unpredictablity in that organization right now. Personally, I want to see what happens with these investigations and what (if any) penalties come down on the Clips. Lot of uncertainty, for sure... Still I dont foresee an obvious circumstance why LAC would trade Zubac tho

[Larry_Russell]

So I have read all posts an still don't understand why some think we shouldn't or won't tank this season. The last time Boston had a top 3 pick, we built ourselves to contending status with them (Tatum and Brown). This has to be the year to get a top 3ish pick again. Next year Tatum returns and we, barring injuries, shouldn't be sniffing anything close to that. And the fact that this year is very high in talent up high in the lottery, I see it as a no Brainer. And as our losses start piling up, just start playing White and Brown less. Start playing our best 3 young talents in Hugo, Minott and Queta so they can be ready for a title run with Tatum Brown White and a hopefully High lottery pick in addition. SAS and OKC are going nowhere. We won't get close to beating them without some "major" talent upgrade.

This really is such as Pivotal season for Boston's future. They need to do it right.

If we were going for a top 3 pick I think White is already in Toronto because Brad accepts the trade offer they made this summer. If we were going for a top 3 pick this year I think Celtics would already be under luxury tax.

I could be wrong. I try not to over react and completely change up my take after every game.

Naw, White is the guy you keep at all costs.

If team lucked into AJ you probably shop brown honestly...and he most likely nets a stud PG or Center and thr TPE grabs the final piece.

White is a perfect 3rd man.

Brown is a fantastic 2nd man...but he thinks he is a first man and would never accept being 3rd.

For example...

Luck into AJ
Trade brown for Dyson Daniels, risacher and Okongwu and filler

Daniels/pritchard
White/hugo
AJ/risacher
Tatum/hauser
Okongwu/queta

Savage team imo

[Curmudgeon]

no way. Joe isn't capable of that and it absolutely doesn't look like that. He took a low probability challenge last night trying desperately to steal one possession down 11 in the 4th. He is 100% trying to win

He's absolutely capable of it and he's doing it right before our eyes.

okay, I dont see it that way, just totally gonna have to agree to disagree...

Watch tonight's game and focus on the plus-minus. Write down the score each time he enters the game, and again when he leaves.

[Fierce1]

Roster is not bad enough for a top 5 pick.

Maybe the #15 pick is more realistic.

It doesn't seem like you understand how the draft lottery works. They don't just hand top 5 picks to the bottom 5 teams in the standings. There's a lottery. Mavericks barely missed the play-in yet got the no. 1 pick..got Flagg.

Hawks were in the play-in, barely missed playoffs and got the no. 1 pick.

As long as we miss the playoffs, we at least have a chance at a high draft pick - with some lottery luck.

And the more games we lose this season, the more the team will try to keep losing - to improve lottery odds.

That's what Philly, Dallas and San Antonio did last season..as they lost more games, they sat their studs out more and more. And it worked - they all got lottery luck with the top 3 picks.

I know how the lottery works.

It's just that the Celtics really have no luck when it comes to the lottery.

You can go back to 1997 when the Cs had 2 picks in the top 6 and they ended up with #3 and #6.

Or 2007 when the Cs had the 2nd worst record in the league and instead of ending up with the #2 pick, they ended up getting the #5 pick.

The latest lottery pick was Marcus Smart at #6.
And to think the Cs had the 5th worst record in 2014.

So the lottery doesn't really excite me because the Cs have no luck in the lottery.

The Jays are picks from Brooklyn.
That's a different story.
But if you're talking about the history of the Celtics' own lottery picks, no dice!

[31to6]

If rebounding were the issue, Charles Bassey was there for the taking. This is just a blatant tank by Stevens and Mazulla. I didn't think Mazulla had it in him to lose on purpose, but apparently he does.

I think Joe is unlikely to be bought in on the tank, but that's what the money is for.
He's going to coach his pants off and do his darndest to get this team to the playoffs.

If he were coaching his pants off, Simons would be at the end of the bench and Minott (22 years old) and Gonzalez (19 years old) would be playing 25+ minutes each, and so would Queta, absent foul trouble.

He's coaching to lose, and everyone can see it. He's covering Stevens' butt, who erred when he took back Simons. You don't think someone like Pelinka would have jumped at the chance to get Jrue Holiday?

I think Rob Pelinka can **** right off

But to your point, I won't claim any inside perspective on where Brad and Joe are on tanking. I think generally GMs tank, and coaches and players don't. That seems to match our configuration here, with a competitive bunch of players and a hypercompetitive coach. I think it'd be totally normal if Joe, having lost four front-line players from last year, was seeing what he has in the biggest ticket new toy he has. For all his flaws, Simons is elite in 3pt volume. You can't expect Joe to nail him to the bench in October. By Thanksgiving? Could certainly happen. We'll all be voting for Hugo to make the All Star game at that point, right?

[jmr07019]

So I have read all posts an still don't understand why some think we shouldn't or won't tank this season. The last time Boston had a top 3 pick, we built ourselves to contending status with them (Tatum and Brown). This has to be the year to get a top 3ish pick again. Next year Tatum returns and we, barring injuries, shouldn't be sniffing anything close to that. And the fact that this year is very high in talent up high in the lottery, I see it as a no Brainer. And as our losses start piling up, just start playing White and Brown less. Start playing our best 3 young talents in Hugo, Minott and Queta so they can be ready for a title run with Tatum Brown White and a hopefully High lottery pick in addition. SAS and OKC are going nowhere. We won't get close to beating them without some "major" talent upgrade.

This really is such as Pivotal season for Boston's future. They need to do it right.

If we were going for a top 3 pick I think White is already in Toronto because Brad accepts the trade offer they made this summer. If we were going for a top 3 pick this year I think Celtics would already be under luxury tax.

I could be wrong. I try not to over react and completely change up my take after every game.

Naw, White is the guy you keep at all costs.

If team lucked into AJ you probably shop brown honestly...and he most likely nets a stud PG or Center and thr TPE grabs the final piece.

White is a perfect 3rd man.

Brown is a fantastic 2nd man...but he thinks he is a first man and would never accept being 3rd.

For example...

Luck into AJ
Trade brown for Dyson Daniels, risacher and Okongwu and filler

Daniels/pritchard
White/hugo
AJ/risacher
Tatum/hauser
Okongwu/queta

Savage team imo

I like that team you laid out and would be happy to go into next season with it.

I don't agree we need to keep White at all costs. Jrue declined quickly. I don't want to see the same thing from White while he's on the Celtics. He's a guard on the wrong side of 30. I'm also not saying we have to trade White but all options should be explored.

[Hal14]

Roster is not bad enough for a top 5 pick.

Maybe the #15 pick is more realistic.

It doesn't seem like you understand how the draft lottery works. They don't just hand top 5 picks to the bottom 5 teams in the standings. There's a lottery. Mavericks barely missed the play-in yet got the no. 1 pick..got Flagg.

Hawks were in the play-in, barely missed playoffs and got the no. 1 pick.

As long as we miss the playoffs, we at least have a chance at a high draft pick - with some lottery luck.

And the more games we lose this season, the more the team will try to keep losing - to improve lottery odds.

That's what Philly, Dallas and San Antonio did last season..as they lost more games, they sat their studs out more and more. And it worked - they all got lottery luck with the top 3 picks.

I know how the lottery works.

It's just that the Celtics really have no luck when it comes to the lottery.

You can go back to 1997 when the Cs had 2 picks in the top 6 and they ended up with #3 and #6.

Or 2007 when the Cs had the 2nd worst record in the league and instead of ending up with the #2 pick, they ended up getting the #5 pick.

The latest lottery pick was Marcus Smart at #6.
And to think the Cs had the 5th worst record in 2014.

So the lottery doesn't really excite me because the Cs have no luck in the lottery.

The Jays are picks from Brooklyn.
That's a different story.
But if you're talking about the history of the Celtics' own lottery picks, no dice!

It doesn't work like that. Individual teams don't have lottery "luck" that extends beyond any singular season. A team can be lucky or unlucky in the lottery during a given year..but the lottery luck they have in a given year is not impacted in any way by their lottery luck during previous seasons and the lottery luck they have during a given year does not have anything to do with the lottery luck that team will have during subsequent years.

They're just ping pong balls..objects that don't know which team they are bouncing for at any given time.

Your logic is very flawed.

[Fierce1]

It doesn't seem like you understand how the draft lottery works. They don't just hand top 5 picks to the bottom 5 teams in the standings. There's a lottery. Mavericks barely missed the play-in yet got the no. 1 pick..got Flagg.

Hawks were in the play-in, barely missed playoffs and got the no. 1 pick.

As long as we miss the playoffs, we at least have a chance at a high draft pick - with some lottery luck.

And the more games we lose this season, the more the team will try to keep losing - to improve lottery odds.

That's what Philly, Dallas and San Antonio did last season..as they lost more games, they sat their studs out more and more. And it worked - they all got lottery luck with the top 3 picks.

I know how the lottery works.

It's just that the Celtics really have no luck when it comes to the lottery.

You can go back to 1997 when the Cs had 2 picks in the top 6 and they ended up with #3 and #6.

Or 2007 when the Cs had the 2nd worst record in the league and instead of ending up with the #2 pick, they ended up getting the #5 pick.

The latest lottery pick was Marcus Smart at #6.
And to think the Cs had the 5th worst record in 2014.

So the lottery doesn't really excite me because the Cs have no luck in the lottery.

The Jays are picks from Brooklyn.
That's a different story.
But if you're talking about the history of the Celtics' own lottery picks, no dice!

It doesn't work like that. Individual teams don't have lottery "luck" that extends beyond any singular season. A team can be lucky or unlucky in the lottery during a given year..but the lottery luck they have in a given year is not impacted in any way by their lottery luck during previous seasons and the lottery luck they have during a given year does not have anything to do with the lottery luck that team will have during subsequent years.

They're just ping pong balls..objects that don't know which team they are bouncing for at any given time.

Your logic is very flawed.

As flawed as it may be, the results don't lie.

But I'm not against having a lottery pick.
I'm just not looking forward to it.