Toronto needs a new Center

[PushDaRock]

He had the entire offseason and more to rest up and get healthy since he was being sat out games at the end of last season, I don't think sitting him 10 games will do anything beyond dig this team a hole that they will never climb out of, the season will be over before it really begins.

I never suggested sitting him 10 games.
I said let's give the team 10 games before jumping to any conclusions.

Sorry, my mistake. The only way things change in the next ten games is if they change the defensive scheme which I don't see happening, this team is just horrible on defence at a fundamental level with the personnel they have available, it's so much worse with Jak looking like a shadow of who he was last season.

It's also early season where they call everything. That negates a lot of our physicality that we are trying to play with. We saw essentially the same thing happen last season where once the refs stopped calling every foul, our D was significantly better. We went from the worst D in the league to being the best for like a 15-20 game stretch.

[Indeed]

"Toronto needs a new center"

What year is this? Feels like we have this discussion every season.

Since 1995. That's how Hoffa happened. That's how the Yogi Stewart contract happened. Our Championship core was the only time in History that this team had sold depth at the 5.

I don't know what it is about this FO, but they won't draft legit bigs. They always say "well, we can just pick one up for cheap somewhere.......they are a dime a dozen". Then they proceed to not pick up anyone useful.

They should gave given that Sarr brother a contract. The guy played with energy, he blocked shots, he's quick.

What a waste of a pick Martin and Mogbo were. They had plenty of chancrs.

Our championship run wasnt because of our C. Our championship run has a lot of great defensive guard and forward.
Green, Powell and VanVleet
Leonard, Siakam, Ibaka (maybe playing as C, but more a forward size)

Usually that may not have enough scoring, but most of them can shoot (Siakam couldnt shoot though)

I dont think our problem is the C. Paying Barnes, Ingram, Quickley (and perhaps Barrett with a more reasonable salary), those should contribute one way or both.

[Grew]

"Toronto needs a new center"

What year is this? Feels like we have this discussion every season.

Since 1995. That's how Hoffa happened. That's how the Yogi Stewart contract happened. Our Championship core was the only time in History that this team had sold depth at the 5.

I don't know what it is about this FO, but they won't draft legit bigs. They always say "well, we can just pick one up for cheap somewhere.......they are a dime a dozen". Then they proceed to not pick up anyone useful.

They should gave given that Sarr brother a contract. The guy played with energy, he blocked shots, he's quick.

What a waste of a pick Martin and Mogbo were. They had plenty of chancrs.

Our championship run wasnt because of our C. Our championship run has a lot of great defensive guard and forward.
Green, Powell and VanVleet
Leonard, Siakam, Ibaka (maybe playing as C, but more a forward size)

Usually that may not have enough scoring, but most of them can shoot (Siakam couldnt shoot though)

I dont think our problem is the C. Paying Barnes, Ingram, Quickley (and perhaps Barrett with a more reasonable salary), those should contribute one way or both.

Flashback to Marc Gasol making Embiid look like Hasheem Thabeet. Then future MVP Embiid crying on Marc's shoulder like a little baybay because he was his teams 3rd best player in a 7 game series that came down to a buzzer beater.

[Syd-TK3]

We had 3 drafts to get our new center and never did

[Clutch0z24]

I never liked Yak as a starting level C in the league....Hes never been apart of a winning team as your starting C....Its not his fault only that we are a bad team but his fit does not help....Hes best suited as a bench big playing as a starter. Doesn't space the floor, Not protecting the rim, Nor is he a lob threat....

The fact we went all in on Jakob to try and compete with Siakam/OG/FVV all of which are not even on the team anymore and also wasted years of prolly top 5 Draft picks for him is pretty bad management.

Not saying Yak is a bad C we just could have drafted a better C by now if we didn't go all in on Yak as we could of had Kel'el Ware or Walker Kessler (Thad Young blunder)

[Indeed]

Since 1995. That's how Hoffa happened. That's how the Yogi Stewart contract happened. Our Championship core was the only time in History that this team had sold depth at the 5.

I don't know what it is about this FO, but they won't draft legit bigs. They always say "well, we can just pick one up for cheap somewhere.......they are a dime a dozen". Then they proceed to not pick up anyone useful.

They should gave given that Sarr brother a contract. The guy played with energy, he blocked shots, he's quick.

What a waste of a pick Martin and Mogbo were. They had plenty of chancrs.

Our championship run wasnt because of our C. Our championship run has a lot of great defensive guard and forward.
Green, Powell and VanVleet
Leonard, Siakam, Ibaka (maybe playing as C, but more a forward size)

Usually that may not have enough scoring, but most of them can shoot (Siakam couldnt shoot though)

I dont think our problem is the C. Paying Barnes, Ingram, Quickley (and perhaps Barrett with a more reasonable salary), those should contribute one way or both.

Flashback to Marc Gasol making Embiid look like Hasheem Thabeet. Then future MVP Embiid crying on Marc's shoulder like a little baybay because he was his teams 3rd best player in a 7 game series that came down to a buzzer beater.

Good C puts us at a higher floor, they dont put us at a higher ceiling.
And no, it wasnt a buzzer beater difference, as it was a tire

[dballislife]

if draymond can handle the 5, i think cmb with barnes can handle it too

[Psubs]

I never liked Yak as a starting level C in the league....Hes never been apart of a winning team as your starting C....Its not his fault only that we are a bad team but his fit does not help....Hes best suited as a bench big playing as a starter. Doesn't space the floor, Not protecting the rim, Nor is he a lob threat....

The fact we went all in on Jakob to try and compete with Siakam/OG/FVV all of which are not even on the team anymore and also wasted years of prolly top 5 Draft picks for him is pretty bad management.

Not saying Yak is a bad C we just could have drafted a better C by now if we didn't go all in on Yak as we could of had Kel'el Ware or Walker Kessler (Thad Young blunder)

Walker Kessler can shoot 3's now.

We really effed up that draft.

Should not have traded the pick (#20 Spurs drafted Malaki Branham). Should've drafted Walker Kessler #20. Still we had #33 and drafted Koloko. I wanted Jaylin Williams.

[sidsid]

This thread just underscores one thing:

Without a healthy Poeltl we are screwed.
What we witnessed the last two season is also true this year, without him, we are very bad at defense.

We all should pray and hope its nothing serious, cause if Poeltl regressed that much in just 2-3 months we are in deep trouble.
But i have hope, cause he never had a major injury, even if the one month in january 23, were he sat, was not a big issue.

So it might not be a big issue now. Sadly, we need patience.

Jak was always going to be the single point of failure for this season since C was the position of least depth on this team, having him play at the level he did last season was going to be absolutely critical to the success of the team this season.

But after the back issues he had last season it should have been obvious he couldn't be relied on to stay healthy. The front office needed to come up with a solid plan B in case Jak missed a significant number of games and they didn't. Instead doubled down on Jak as the starter for at least the next 4 seasons, that contract extension is now quite likely an albatross if Jak never really recovers or continues to age poorly, this team is in very deep trouble going forward if Jak is basically washed.

As for patience... I really don't look forward to waiting until 2029-2030 for Jak to come off the books, even then they still have to pay him the $5M of guaranteed money in the last year of that contract. Just a horrible decision, there was really no reason to rush a contract extension, they've ruined this franchise with multiple overpay contracts to marginal talent over the last few years.

Jak as our key failure point is a far bigger issue than anything specifically related to Jak. Guys get injured, it happens. The bigger problem is: everything falls apart because we’re missing a league average starting C? We’re paying our other 4 starters $135m this year. If they can’t somewhat carry the team in his absence/injury this team is cooked.

Jak is not an all-star. Or an all-defense level player. Losing him should not be this impactful. Yet here we are. What does that say about the other highly paid guys on this team?

The GM has been actively trying to trade two of the starters (RJ and IQ) for quite a while, and our promising lottery rookie wouldn't be on the team if the GM had his way (we'd have the starting 31yo PG from the 1-3 Celtics here instead). It's clear the FO wasn't that high on their own team building here either.

The reason he's stuck with these players is because the GM didn't want more draft picks, but an existing bad contract and a potentially untapped potential 6th man that came with it for a highly valued OG. We traded what is starting to look like a very good Pacers pick to get another body to bolster the offense but further killing the D.

Shedding assets for potentially devalued but expensive castoffs to get to a level of consistent mediocrity as a shortcut for growth hasn't paid off yet in the past 5 years. It's also difficult to team build this way. But the FO has sunk costs, and doesn't believe in the fallacy.

[ATLTimekeeper]

The GM has to trade one of IQ or RJ to make the salary structure make sense long-term.

Masai was trying to trade the pick and then he was relieved of his duties once Giannis said he wasn't going anywhere. The Derrick White rumour is heavily Celtics-friendly. I doubt it was an actual offer, as a lot of Celtic rumours are as legit as Jaylen Brown's hairline.

The Poeltl extension was questionable at the time, and looks bad now that Jak has back issues. It could be catastrophic if this is a long-term thing.

[ConSarnit]

if draymond can handle the 5, i think cmb with barnes can handle it too

Draymond is one of the greatest defenders of all time. It’s a massive ask to ask CMB to try and anchor a defense as an undersized rookie center.

[niQ]

Any good disgruntled Centers out there?

[tdotrep2]

Jaks hurt, the real issue is Darko playing him while he's hurt.

[dagger]

Poeltl is "doubtful" for tomorrow

Read on Twitter

[PushDaRock]

The GM has to trade one of IQ or RJ to make the salary structure make sense long-term.

Masai was trying to trade the pick and then he was relieved of his duties once Giannis said he wasn't going anywhere. The Derrick White rumour is heavily Celtics-friendly. I doubt it was an actual offer, as a lot of Celtic rumours are as legit as Jaylen Brown's hairline.

The Poeltl extension was questionable at the time, and looks bad now that Jak has back issues. It could be catastrophic if this is a long-term thing.

I think the AAV was quite high but we got him to pick up the player option and the last year is only guaranteed for 5m which makes it not as bad and gives us some optionality. Obviously if he becomes damaged goods, it ends up looking awful but that's the case with any long term contract given out.

[PushDaRock]

Any good disgruntled Centers out there?

There aren't even that many good Centers out there period. People keep complaining about our situation but they don't take a look around the league.

[MikeM]

Only 10 more years of him clogging the paint for 30 mill

[Nature]

Poeltl is "doubtful" for tomorrow

Read on Twitter

We certainly don't have the easiest opening schedule.

[Raptorfan2012]

I think its time to use that open 15th spot to replace Jak until he feels better. Mo Bamba and Ben Simmons are okay options for the vet min.

[Van_Trump]

James wiseman?