What do we make of the Washington Wizards Rebuild so far?

[prime1time]

I've watched virtually every Sarr minute in the NBA lol.

He can be better this year, and also not be in the same universe as guys like Wemby and Chet. To even compare him to those 2 is ridiculous unless the only thing you look at is body type.

so watched him tonight and 2 nights ago, right?

Like you’re out here posting #s based on his rookie year on quite possibly the worst Wizards team ever and you’re pretending to know what you’re saying

It’s so funny how dudes like this get so offended if you don’t shower their favorite players with praise

He’s so mad he didn’t even read any of the posts he’s so angry about. Guarantee dude was just waiting for a good game to come scream this at me.

Yell at a wall bud, no amount of your crying and screaming is going to make Sarr as good as Chet lol

I hope you feel better now that you got that off your chest

Lol, Chet benefits from playing with SGA. What would his numbers be if he didn't have the league MVP being the main focus of the defense? Even with that Holmgren's numbers were down across last year. Holmgren is also in year 4 and Sarr is in year 2. Most people would take Holmgren over Sarr pretty easily but let's put these two players in perspective. Holmgren was supposed to be an elite player. Sarr was supposed to be a project. Sarr went 0-15 in summer league.

Watch on YouTube

Fast forward to yesterday

Watch on YouTube

Sarr's upward trajectory has been nothing short of stunning. He just keeps on improving. Whereas with Holmgren I question where is he game improving? Once Jalen Williams comes back his shot attempts will drop and he'll basically be the third wheel. They don't need him for offense. Which is ideal because his offense is predicated on taking easy shots that the defense allows for him. Holmgren has played well to start this season and we will see if it lasts but who has actually had the better start to the year?

Sarr - 19/8.8/4.5/2/.8 on 55.2/36.4/83.3 ot Chet 23/10/1.8/1.3/1.3 on 56.9/41.7/85.7.

The fact that it's even that close shows the upward trajectory Sarr was on. Sarr has vastly exceeded every expectation that was placed on him when he was drafted. And, if we're being honest, Holmgren has flatlined. I'm also very concerned about Holmgren's skinny frame. Holmgren gets to be viewed as a winner because he plays with SGA and Jalen Williams. Without those guys commanding defensive attention Holmgren's inability to create good looks by himself would be exposed. Not to mention the durability concerns around Holmgren. He's missed literally half his career due to injury. Missed his entire rookie year and only played 32 games last year.

Beating your chest about how good Holmgren is is laughable. Given Sarr's upward trajectory, it's completely realistic to expect Sarr to pass Holmgren at some point in the next 3 years.

[jasonxxx102]

so watched him tonight and 2 nights ago, right?

Like you’re out here posting #s based on his rookie year on quite possibly the worst Wizards team ever and you’re pretending to know what you’re saying

It’s so funny how dudes like this get so offended if you don’t shower their favorite players with praise

He’s so mad he didn’t even read any of the posts he’s so angry about. Guarantee dude was just waiting for a good game to come scream this at me.

Yell at a wall bud, no amount of your crying and screaming is going to make Sarr as good as Chet lol

I hope you feel better now that you got that off your chest

Lol, Chet benefits from playing with SGA. What would his numbers be if he didn't have the league MVP being the main focus of the defense? Even with that Holmgren's numbers were down across last year. Holmgren is also in year 4 and Sarr is in year 2. Most people would take Holmgren over Sarr pretty easily but let's put these two players in perspective. Holmgren was supposed to be an elite player. Sarr was supposed to be a project. Sarr went 0-15 in summer league.

Watch on YouTube

Fast forward to yesterday

Watch on YouTube

Sarr's upward trajectory has been nothing short of stunning. He just keeps on improving. Whereas with Holmgren I question where is he game improving? Once Jalen Williams comes back his shot attempts will drop and he'll basically be the third wheel. They don't need him for offense. Which is ideal because his offense is predicated on taking easy shots that the defense allows for him. Holmgren has played well to start this season and we will see if it lasts but who has actually had the better start to the year?

Sarr - 19/8.8/4.5/2/.8 on 55.2/36.4/83.3 ot Chet 23/10/1.8/1.3/1.3 on 56.9/41.7/85.7.

The fact that it's even that close shows the upward trajectory Sarr was on. Sarr has vastly exceeded every expectation that was placed on him when he was drafted. And, if we're being honest, Holmgren has flatlined. I'm also very concerned about Holmgren's skinny frame. Holmgren gets to be viewed as a winner because he plays with SGA and Jalen Williams. Without those guys commanding defensive attention Holmgren's inability to create good looks by himself would be exposed. Not to mention the durability concerns around Holmgren. He's missed literally half his career due to injury. Missed his entire rookie year and only played 32 games last year.

Beating your chest about how good Holmgren is is laughable. Given Sarr's upward trajectory, it's completely realistic to expect Sarr to pass Holmgren at some point in the next 3 years.

Reading is fundamental.

I never brought Chet up in the first place. That other guy did. He called Sarr a "mini Wemby" which is one of the worst takes I have ever seen on these boards.

Clearly Sarr is not as good as Chet. There's no debate and that's why people like Godymas just cry and insult instead of using facts and stats to argue their point.

Maybe he will be better than Chet, maybe he won't be... but none of that changes the reality of right now. That also doesn't mean he's not improving as a player.

[prime1time]

The comparison between Sarr and Holmgren touches on a unique issue in American basketball. American basketball players have perplexing combination of arrogance. French players come into the league and consistently improve. American players come in to the league and they flatline. Say what you want about Sarr but go back and watch his games in Australia, then watch his summer league games, then watch his rookie games, then watch his game this season. It's clear that he's working on his game. I remember watching Holmgren in high school with Jalen Suggs. And then watching him at Gonzaga. Then following him at OKC.

Maybe you can argue that it's his role, but he looks like the same guy to me. An efficient 3rd option that plays solid defense. In the finals last year Holmgren shot 39.5% from the field and 15.8% from 3. Most teams that draft a guy 2nd overall need that guy to produce in order to win a championship. If Holmgren was on any other team that OKC he would be viewed as a very different kind of player. But because he's on OKC his flawed get overlooked and he's looked at as a winner.

[tsherkin]

They're 1-1, and their offense has been a disaster on par with the last 2 years. They are going to suck again this year, most likely, and haven't won more than 35 games since 2018. They've been north of .500 4 times since 2008. The last time they won 50 games was 1979. Over that same span, they've been under 30 wins in 16 different seasons.

The rebuild is not going well.

That’s brutal to read.

I feel really bad for the fans, man. Like, Toronto fans where I'm from moan and bitch about our rebuild since the title in 2019. And then you remember something like Washington's situation, and it's like... "ehhhhhh.... we don't have it so bad after all."

[prime1time]

Seems some structure has been introduced this season. I like how Sarr is actually thinking about shot selection this season, it's going to aid his development tremendously. I see him as a rich man's Adebayo in the future.

We haven't seen Coulibaly who imo is the second best prospect and player on the team. I see him as a future Mikal Bridges tyope of players with slightly better driving/dishing ability.

The rest of the pool of young players will at least yield a couple of excellent role players. Picks to come. I think they're in a good spot. Could compete for the playoffs next season if they sign a couple of veteran FA's next summer.

Sane with the completely insane take lol.

Rich mans Bam is a perennial all star, multi time DPOY, borderline MVP.

Who's better at 20 Sarr or Bam?

[prime1time]

Wizards rebuild is going fine. Rebuilds in the NBA come down to getting lucky with the lottery balls. We have a pick swap with Phoenix this year so if they suck and we suck we'll have a really good chance at getting a top 3 pick. A lot of what will happen with the Wizards rebuild will hinge on getting a top pick in the draft.

As for individual draft picks I think the Wizards have been a pleasant surprise. People talked about Alex Sarr as a scrub. Now that he's actually played well the goal posts have moved. Kyshawn George has been another surprise. No one expected anything of him but his improvement from last year to this year has been stunning. Tre Johnson will be a good player in this league. The best that can be said about the Wizards rebuild is that some of the young players have shown both flashes of potential and improvement.

[jasonxxx102]

Seems some structure has been introduced this season. I like how Sarr is actually thinking about shot selection this season, it's going to aid his development tremendously. I see him as a rich man's Adebayo in the future.

We haven't seen Coulibaly who imo is the second best prospect and player on the team. I see him as a future Mikal Bridges tyope of players with slightly better driving/dishing ability.

The rest of the pool of young players will at least yield a couple of excellent role players. Picks to come. I think they're in a good spot. Could compete for the playoffs next season if they sign a couple of veteran FA's next summer.

Sane with the completely insane take lol.

Rich mans Bam is a perennial all star, multi time DPOY, borderline MVP.

Who's better at 20 Sarr or Bam?

Box score watching is bad.

Bam was better by pretty much every advanced metric. Please stop embarrassing yourself

[prime1time]

Sane with the completely insane take lol.

Rich mans Bam is a perennial all star, multi time DPOY, borderline MVP.

Who's better at 20 Sarr or Bam?

Box score watching is bad.

Bam was better by pretty much every advanced metric. Please stop embarrassing yourself

This is the problem with advanced metrics. They artificially inflate the value of players that have limited roles. Think about it like this, if Bam was so good why didn't the Heat give him more minutes/possessions?

Second of all Sarr's rookie year he was 19. Sarr is only 20 this year. So are those numbers you used from Sarr's rookie year or this current year? Let me help you yesterday Sarr cooked Embiid as a 20 year old.

Watch on YouTube

This is Sarr at 20. He won't turn 21 until April 2026.

This is what happens when people get more interested in winning debates than actually having a basketball conversation. Imagine trashing a 19 year old waking up and needing to lie and trash a 20 year old lol. Would you take the Sarr that just dropped 31 and 10 over rookie version of Bam. The question is simple. Keep in mind how much Sarr has improved. And that you don't know what Bam would become. Don't make it harder than it has to be.

[Godymas]

Jason keeps posting screenshots of his home made Excel spreadsheets with no context

No years

No names

that could be literally anyone in those cells

[jasonxxx102]

Who's better at 20 Sarr or Bam?

Box score watching is bad.

Bam was better by pretty much every advanced metric. Please stop embarrassing yourself

This is the problem with advanced metrics. They artificially inflate the value of players that have limited roles. Think about it like this, if Bam was so good why didn't the Heat give him more minutes/possessions?

Second of all Sarr's rookie year he was 19. Sarr is only 20 this year. So are those numbers you used from Sarr's rookie year or this current year? Let me help you yesterday Sarr cooked Embiid as a 20 year old.

Watch on YouTube

This is Sarr at 20. He won't turn 21 until April 2026.

This is what happens when people get more interested in winning debates than actually having a basketball conversation. Imagine trashing a 19 year old waking up and needing to lie and trash a 20 year old lol. Would you take the Sarr that just dropped 31 and 10 over rookie version of Bam. The question is simple. Keep in mind how much Sarr has improved. And that you don't know what Bam would become. Don't make it harder than it has to be.

Oh now the analytics are the problem.

The point here is that no matter what I would have posted, you wouldn't have accepted it.

I never trashed Sarr, I simply pointed out what the analytics say. You just can't accept that you're wrong. You'll just keep moving the goal posts until you find something that sticks.

Your surface level understanding of basketball exists in highlights and box scores only, so no matter what I show you, you wouldn't understand it anyways.

[prime1time]

Box score watching is bad.

Bam was better by pretty much every advanced metric. Please stop embarrassing yourself

This is the problem with advanced metrics. They artificially inflate the value of players that have limited roles. Think about it like this, if Bam was so good why didn't the Heat give him more minutes/possessions?

Second of all Sarr's rookie year he was 19. Sarr is only 20 this year. So are those numbers you used from Sarr's rookie year or this current year? Let me help you yesterday Sarr cooked Embiid as a 20 year old.

Watch on YouTube

This is Sarr at 20. He won't turn 21 until April 2026.

This is what happens when people get more interested in winning debates than actually having a basketball conversation. Imagine trashing a 19 year old waking up and needing to lie and trash a 20 year old lol. Would you take the Sarr that just dropped 31 and 10 over rookie version of Bam. The question is simple. Keep in mind how much Sarr has improved. And that you don't know what Bam would become. Don't make it harder than it has to be.

Oh now the analytics are the problem.

The point here is that no matter what I would have posted, you wouldn't have accepted it.

I never trashed Sarr, I simply pointed out what the analytics say. You just can't accept that you're wrong. You'll just keep moving the goal posts until you find something that sticks.

Your surface level understanding of basketball exists in highlights and box scores only, so no matter what I show you, you wouldn't understand it anyways.

What year are those analytics from?

[prime1time]

This is the problem with advanced metrics. They artificially inflate the value of players that have limited roles. Think about it like this, if Bam was so good why didn't the Heat give him more minutes/possessions?

Second of all Sarr's rookie year he was 19. Sarr is only 20 this year. So are those numbers you used from Sarr's rookie year or this current year? Let me help you yesterday Sarr cooked Embiid as a 20 year old.

Watch on YouTube

This is Sarr at 20. He won't turn 21 until April 2026.

This is what happens when people get more interested in winning debates than actually having a basketball conversation. Imagine trashing a 19 year old waking up and needing to lie and trash a 20 year old lol. Would you take the Sarr that just dropped 31 and 10 over rookie version of Bam. The question is simple. Keep in mind how much Sarr has improved. And that you don't know what Bam would become. Don't make it harder than it has to be.

Oh now the analytics are the problem.

The point here is that no matter what I would have posted, you wouldn't have accepted it.

I never trashed Sarr, I simply pointed out what the analytics say. You just can't accept that you're wrong. You'll just keep moving the goal posts until you find something that sticks.

Your surface level understanding of basketball exists in highlights and box scores only, so no matter what I show you, you wouldn't understand it anyways.

What year are those analytics from?

But yes I do have a problem when people post analytics like they are the end all and be all of basketball analysis. Analytics are one aspect of the analysis. To post them as if they are the end all and be all of basketball analysis is just bizarre to me. Think about this. Two young bigs enter the NBA. Both need to develop. One time says, let's throw him into the deep end and let him play through his mistakes. The other team says, let's limit his opportunities to places where we know he can be successful and slowly grow his role. Who's the better player? Which player will have better advanced stats? Are advanced stats the best way to evaluate players that need to grow and develop?

If the Wizards decide to limit Sarr's minutes, limit his possessions, constrain his shot selection and immediately take him out if he did something that wasn't allowed wouldn't his advanced stats look better? But regardless, I think you used Sarr's rookie stats when he was 19. And I specifically said to compare them as 20 year olds. Because it was a loaded question and I'm not stupid. Sarr at 20, aka this season (which does have a small sample size), is vastly better than Bam as a rookie. That's why I asked it. All this talk about advaned stats is hilarious.

Sarr this season has a PER of 24.3. Bam at 20 had a PER of 15.3. Sarr this season has BPM of 4.5. Bam at 20 had a BPM of -.4. You post statistics from Sarr as a 19 year old then, whine when you get called out on it and then claim that I wouldn't have changed my mind regardless of what you posted. Who's really unwilling to change their mind? Now will Sarr be a rich Man's Bam I don't know. What I do know that is at 19 Bam was in college. At 20 Bam could barely play 20 minutes a game. And Sarr has improved like crazy. I take exception to the notion that Sarr being a rich Man's Bam is being insane when it is certainly within the realm of possibility.

Imagine calling someone else insane and then using faulty statistics and whining when you get called out on it.

[prime1time]

Sarr will be the best player from the 2024 draft. He scored an efficient 21 points on 15 shots and had 3 blocks. He's 100% in the same line as a guy like Wemby/Chet, except unlike Chet he's going to the guy on his team which means he could be a mini Wemby.

One of these things is not like the other

You literally did the same thing here. What year are these stats from for Chet. Chet's first season he was 21. You're comparing 21 year old Chet to 19 year old Sarr and trashing him. This is weird behavior bro.

[Sane]

Who's better at 20 Sarr or Bam?

Box score watching is bad.

Bam was better by pretty much every advanced metric. Please stop embarrassing yourself

This is the problem with advanced metrics. They artificially inflate the value of players that have limited roles. Think about it like this, if Bam was so good why didn't the Heat give him more minutes/possessions?

Second of all Sarr's rookie year he was 19. Sarr is only 20 this year. So are those numbers you used from Sarr's rookie year or this current year? Let me help you yesterday Sarr cooked Embiid as a 20 year old.

Watch on YouTube

This is Sarr at 20. He won't turn 21 until April 2026.

This is what happens when people get more interested in winning debates than actually having a basketball conversation. Imagine trashing a 19 year old waking up and needing to lie and trash a 20 year old lol. Would you take the Sarr that just dropped 31 and 10 over rookie version of Bam. The question is simple. Keep in mind how much Sarr has improved. And that you don't know what Bam would become. Don't make it harder than it has to be.

Not to mention his 3PT shot is further along at the same age and his size is more ideal for rim protection.

Sarr's potential is higher than Adebayo's impact. The advanced stats heavily favor more talented teams which is outside a player's control. Sarr's numbers are not a realistic reflection of his talent and potential on a winning team.

He's looking great so far.

[hauntedcomputer]

Maybe you can argue that it's his role, but he looks like the same guy to me. An efficient 3rd option that plays solid defense. In the finals last year Holmgren shot 39.5% from the field and 15.8% from 3. Most teams that draft a guy 2nd overall need that guy to produce in order to win a championship. If Holmgren was on any other team that OKC he would be viewed as a very different kind of player. But because he's on OKC his flawed get overlooked and he's looked at as a winner.

Chet was 6-for-8, 18 points, 8 boards and 5 blocks in a close-out Finals game. Sure he had an opportunity but that's a winning player.

[jasonxxx102]

Jason keeps posting screenshots of his home made Excel spreadsheets with no context

No years

No names

that could be literally anyone in those cells

What would the purpose of me faking the screenshots be? The guy asked for rookie year Bam as a comparison so I pulled the numbers. It's not my problem that you're so upset you think I made them up

You're just upset because I have refuted your objectively wrong takes with no emotion facts.

[jasonxxx102]

Sarr will be the best player from the 2024 draft. He scored an efficient 21 points on 15 shots and had 3 blocks. He's 100% in the same line as a guy like Wemby/Chet, except unlike Chet he's going to the guy on his team which means he could be a mini Wemby.

One of these things is not like the other

You literally did the same thing here. What year are these stats from for Chet. Chet's first season he was 21. You're comparing 21 year old Chet to 19 year old Sarr and trashing him. This is weird behavior bro.

I'm comparing their rookie seasons, because that's what normal people do. I could put any year here and like I said it wouldn't matter. \

The numbers and facts clearly don't matter to you. You're so emotional right now, take a step back and think about what you're even mad about in the first place.

I never called Sarr trash like you seem to think. I simply shared a statistical comparison between the players that YOU and the other guy brought up.

If anything be mad at yourself for making a dumb comparison

[prime1time]

Maybe you can argue that it's his role, but he looks like the same guy to me. An efficient 3rd option that plays solid defense. In the finals last year Holmgren shot 39.5% from the field and 15.8% from 3. Most teams that draft a guy 2nd overall need that guy to produce in order to win a championship. If Holmgren was on any other team that OKC he would be viewed as a very different kind of player. But because he's on OKC his flawed get overlooked and he's looked at as a winner.

Chet was 6-for-8, 18 points, 8 boards and 5 blocks in a close-out Finals game. Sure he had an opportunity but that's a winning player.

He is a winning player. But winning players always look better when you have great players around you. A normal #2 pick goes to a terrible team. 8 attempts tells you a lot. Like what would Chet do on a team like the Wizards last year? I like Chet. Smart, 3 level scorer who lets the game come to him and plays solid defense. But we should be honest. SGA is Batman. J-Will is Robin. And Chet is Alfred. You didn't mean it that way but look at his percentage outside of his great game 7. 35.3/11.8/94.7. Vast majority of teams who draft a guy #2 overall will need way more than that in 6 games in the finals. So yes, give him credit for his great game 7 but also acknowledge the fact that he didn't show up for the other 6 games and the series was tied 3-3.

That tells you all you need to know about Chet's role on OKC. He's not a 1 and he's not a 2. And now that they've locked in this core he never will be more than a 3. This matters because people want to use only advanced stats to talk about players but they don't want to discuss the context that produces those stats. The Pacers did not go into that series saying, "We need to stop Chet." They said we need to stop SGA and J-Will. And even in that context Chet struggled. If Haliburton doesn't go down, we are blaming that series on Chet but he benefits from a series of fortunate events.

[Godymas]

Jason keeps posting screenshots of his home made Excel spreadsheets with no context

No years

No names

that could be literally anyone in those cells

What would the purpose of me faking the screenshots be? The guy asked for rookie year Bam as a comparison so I pulled the numbers. It's not my problem that you're so upset you think I made them up

You're just upset because I have refuted your objectively wrong takes with no emotion facts.

you still didn't even provide any relevant information in regards to your excel spreadsheet. no source data, no years, no names on the cells, it could be anyone, you love talking about absolutely nothing

[Godymas]

bro i am actually dead right now

3 other people are asking for the years, the context, he's posting NAMELESS YEARLESS STATS. Somehow he's acknowledged their posts without even answering the easiest question