Just for fun: What do you do to go all in on this team?

[HomoSapien]

What do you do to go all in? Trick question. We're already all in.

[WesPeace]

Man, if we can keep this core on team friendly deals going forward, that would be pretty good.

White up to 25M per
Ayo between 14-16M per
Huerter 12-14M per
Maybe even Vucevic on 10-12M one year deal

[coldfish]

What do you do to go all in? Trick question. We're already all in.

True dat. The Bulls are on an 82 win pace. Hard to upgrade at this point. That's without Coby and Collins.

In general the target everyone would want to replace is Vucevic but over the first 5 games he is playing like one of the best centers in the NBA. At this point, any trade is going to be a downgrade.

[Seccci]

Man, if we can keep this core on team friendly deals going forward, that would be pretty good.

White up to 25M per
Ayo between 14-16M per
Huerter 12-14M per
Maybe even Vucevic on 10-12M one year deal

No offense, but this is Dreamland. U can add 5+mil/year on top of those numbers and still probably not get them to sign. Those numbers could have worked before season started, just like how bulls got Giddey to sign for 25. If they didn't, than it would skyrocket over 35.

That's why I suggest this is difficult, but need to identify who u want to keep and trade rest with some 1st for upgrade, even if that upgrade is at 45/50mil a season.

I personally would keep those that also play defense, so Huerter, ayo, Tre resign and keep, rest wheel and deal for upgrades.
This miracle power of friendship, sum of parts greater than individual pieces works exactly until the point u have to pay them market rate.

( Im old enough to have watched and loved noc, Hinrich, Gordon and Deng right until the second contract, at which point they become not good enough and overpaid)
Hometown discount work BEFORE guys get good, not once it is established

I would try to get Zion or booker or JJ and than with rest of cap space or assets work around their weaknesses- so athletic defensive center. Or just go for broke and offer every pick and swap next 4 years+ contracts to match Giannis

[coldfish]

Man, if we can keep this core on team friendly deals going forward, that would be pretty good.

White up to 25M per
Ayo between 14-16M per
Huerter 12-14M per
Maybe even Vucevic on 10-12M one year deal

No offense, but this is Dreamland. U can add 5+mil/year on top of those numbers and still probably not get them to sign. Those numbers could have worked before season started, just like how bulls got Giddey to sign for 25. If they didn't, than it would skyrocket over 35.

That's why I suggest this is difficult, but need to identify who u want to keep and trade rest with some 1st for upgrade, even if that upgrade is at 45/50mil a season.

I personally would keep those that also play defense, so Huerter, ayo, Tre resign and keep, rest wheel and deal for upgrades.
This miracle power of friendship, sum of parts greater than individual pieces works exactly until the point u have to pay them market rate.

( Im old enough to have watched and loved noc, Hinrich, Gordon and Deng right until the second contract, at which point they become not good enough and overpaid)
Hometown discount work BEFORE guys get good, not once it is established

I would try to get Zion or booker or JJ and than with rest of cap space or assets work around their weaknesses- so athletic defensive center. Or just go for broke and offer every pick and swap next 4 years+ contracts to match Giannis

IMO $5m per year more per year is closer to the market. That would leave the team at:
White $30m
Ayo $20m
Huerter $17m
Vuc $15m
Giddey $25m
Patrick $18m
Tre $8m
Buzelis $6m
Essengue $6m
Phillips $3m

Total of $148m. Cap is $154m. The real number is the lux tax which is $188m.

Basically, the Bulls can keep this team together for a while because they don't have any $50m or $60m per year players. Realistically nowadays, if you pay that kind of money that guy better be fantastic AND healthy.

[Red Larrivee]

I said it on the last page, but with the expected cap (166), the Bulls will have anywhere from 75-80M to spend + the room exception (9.4 ish). Plus, there may actually be a chance the Portland pick conveys this year. So, they have an opportunity to keep their depth and stack the team. I don't know if re-sign everyone is the best strategy, but if Coby continues playing the way he did last year, they'll have some tough choices. Right now, I'm more in the camp of keeping Ayo, Huerter and seeing what we can do with the rest of the cap.

As far as this season goes, I think the target should be an affordable rim protector or a two-way SG if Okoro continues struggling. You could even take on salary for the right player.

[coldfish]

I said it on the last page, but with the expected cap (166), the Bulls will have anywhere from 75-80M to spend + the room exception (9.4 ish). Plus, there may actually be a chance the Portland pick conveys this year. So, they have an opportunity to keep their depth and stack the team. I don't know if re-sign everyone is the best strategy, but if Coby continues playing the way he did last year, they'll have some tough choices. Right now, I'm more in the camp of keeping Ayo, Huerter and seeing what we can do with the rest of the cap.

As far as this season goes, I think the target should be an affordable rim protector or a two-way SG if Okoro continues struggling. You could even take on salary for the right player.

Free agent class looks horrendous. Some of the best players available are Bulls. If Chicago wants to do something, its likely by trade. Portland doing well gives them an unexpected asset.

Agreed that the spot to look at is Okoro but even then, once Coby comes back I suspect Okoro's minutes are going to go way down.

[Red Larrivee]

Free agent class looks horrendous. Some of the best players available are Bulls. If Chicago wants to do something, its likely by trade. Portland doing well gives them an unexpected asset.

Agreed that the spot to look at is Okoro but even then, once Coby comes back I suspect Okoro's minutes are going to go way down.

There are a few interesting players who fit the timeline and style:

- Walker Kessler (RFA)
- Mark Williams (RFA)
- Mitchell Robinson (UFA)
- Tari Eason (RFA)

It really just depends on what Coby's market is. I think it's similar to Giddey in the offseason, where every team doesn't see eye-to-eye on his role and value. That could create a value deal, but there will be more teams with cap space next summer.

There's a strong case of moving forward with Giddey and Buzelis as the primary offensive options and going for a different look around them while retaining key reserves. But, right now TBD until we see Coby back.

[coldfish]

Free agent class looks horrendous. Some of the best players available are Bulls. If Chicago wants to do something, its likely by trade. Portland doing well gives them an unexpected asset.

Agreed that the spot to look at is Okoro but even then, once Coby comes back I suspect Okoro's minutes are going to go way down.

There are a few interesting players who fit the timeline and style:

- Walker Kessler (RFA)
- Mark Williams (RFA)
- Mitchell Robinson (UFA)
- Tari Eason (RFA)

It really just depends on what Coby's market is. I think it's similar to Giddey in the offseason, where every team doesn't see eye-to-eye on his role and value. That could create a value deal, but there will be more teams with cap space next summer.

There's a strong case of moving forward with Giddey and Buzelis as the primary offensive options and going for a different look around them while retaining key reserves. But, right now TBD until we see Coby back.

Williams and Robinson have such bad injury histories I would assume that it would become a Lonzo Ball situation. No thanks.

Kessler is interesting but I bet Utah matches. That basically leaves Eason, who I think is interesting but not a huge needle mover. Maybe you move Matas to SF.

Giddey / Ayo / Jones
Coby / Huerter
Matas / Pat
Eason / Noa
Vucevic / Collins (resigned?)

That gets your deep team of good players. No real room for the two picks next year either. Its an interesting pickle.

[coldfish]

https://www.nba.com/stats/teams/shots-closest-defender?dir=D&sort=FG2_PCT

Another team to look at is OKC. They are going to come apart due to monetary limitations. No way they have a $250m payroll next year.

[Red Larrivee]

Williams and Robinson have such bad injury histories I would assume that it would become a Lonzo Ball situation. No thanks.

Kessler is interesting but I bet Utah matches. That basically leaves Eason, who I think is interesting but not a huge needle mover. Maybe you move Matas to SF.

Giddey / Ayo / Jones
Coby / Huerter
Matas / Pat
Eason / Noa
Vucevic / Collins (resigned?)

That gets your deep team of good players. No real room for the two picks next year either. Its an interesting pickle.

There are a lot of interesting (fun?) scenarios here. Plus, the Bulls have no major payroll decisions to make until Buzelis becomes eligible for a deal. So, you could rollover some of the cap space to 2027. If that Portland pick conveys, maybe you move one of those picks for Hartenstein straight into cap space. He's the most likely cap casualty in OKC.

Either way you have to taken advantage of the fact that Buzelis is still on a rookie deal and Giddey potentially being an all-star on a value deal.

[Chi town]

Williams and Robinson have such bad injury histories I would assume that it would become a Lonzo Ball situation. No thanks.

Kessler is interesting but I bet Utah matches. That basically leaves Eason, who I think is interesting but not a huge needle mover. Maybe you move Matas to SF.

Giddey / Ayo / Jones
Coby / Huerter
Matas / Pat
Eason / Noa
Vucevic / Collins (resigned?)

That gets your deep team of good players. No real room for the two picks next year either. Its an interesting pickle.

There are a lot of interesting (fun?) scenarios here. Plus, the Bulls have no major payroll decisions to make until Buzelis becomes eligible for a deal. So, you could rollover some of the cap space to 2027. If that Portland pick conveys, maybe you move one of those picks for Hartenstein straight into cap space. He's the most likely cap casualty in OKC.

Either way you have to taken advantage of the fact that Buzelis is still on a rookie deal and Giddey potentially being an all-star on a value deal.

Pat is playing better than Eason.

I think AK errors on the side of… you guessed it…
CONTINUITY.

I think AK believes in this 9-10 good players with pace and IQ.

If there is a trade it’s probably POR pick for a vet that fits or it’s a bigger trade involving a player like Pat and expiring salary.

I personally think the game has changed and star salaries hurt your depth and stack up injuries.

[Jello Biafra]

So, let's say that all the best case scenarios actually play out. Matas becomes a 20 PER player. Giddey is near a triple double every night. Coby is good Coby. The depth looks good and the team continues to hustle. They are starting to look like a mid 40's win team and you actually want to build on it. The Bulls have tons of expiring deals and all their picks. The east looks wide open.

How do you do that? What position do you target? Who do you trade? Who do you trade for?

One of the interesting things is that I think that Matas would be fine as either a SF or PF.

Huerter + Patrick + Carter + 1st for Lauri?
Giddey
Coby
Matas
Lauri
Vuc / Collins

Vucevic + Patrick + Carter + 2 1sts for Adebayo?

Take a chance on Zion?
Brandon Ingram?
Sabonis?

Who else is out there who could possibly be available?

Are you of the mindset that there is no possible way that you would ever "invest" in this team? Even if they start 20-2 or something, its fool's gold so don't do it.

Last note: I fully expect the team to go back and forth between wins and losses all season and people to be bagging on everyone and doom and gloom after the losses. We just tend to focus on the downside here and rarely discuss the upside.

Obviously just depends on who is available. Your Adebayo trade might be the best all-in move that feels reasonable in terms of Adebayo being the type of guy who would help a lot, the price being about right, and him being available. Your Lauri trade is also reasonable, but Lauri helping us, but I'd certainly do it in an all-in move if I couldn't find something better.

Zion feels like a guy who simply won't be available if he is healthy to me, or the price will exceed the risk. At the point you get over the hump to say yes, NOP probably refuses to trade him. Would say no to Ingram/Sabonis, just not good fits IMO and wouldn't actually make us any better.

Should Giannis become available, that's obviously an option, but odds are we couldn't bid high enough even if we wanted to, and it would only make sense if he agreed to an extension as part of the deal, so he'd also have to pick us over his other options.

Is there a world where the Suns are like F it, and trade Devin Booker? That might be intriguing.

This thread actually comes from a post where Seccci suggested that. Can't find the post right now but I should give him credit.

As I was writing down Sabonis my first thought was "don't do another Vuc trade". If the Bulls are going to go "all in" it should be for a guy who is a legit needle mover and not just the only guy who is available in trade. Personally I would rather see the team sit pat and see what it can do in free agency or something before giving up future firsts for a guy like him.

Isn't your Bam proposal just a worse version of the Vuc trade?

Lauri plays the same position as Buzelis. You really want to trade the farm to get him back? He doesn't effect winning.

[Red Larrivee]

Pat is playing better than Eason.

I think AK errors on the side of… you guessed it…
CONTINUITY.

I think AK believes in this 9-10 good players with pace and IQ.

If there is a trade it’s probably POR pick for a vet that fits or it’s a bigger trade involving a player like Pat and expiring salary.

I personally think the game has changed and star salaries hurt your depth and stack up injuries.

If you don't have a superstar(s), "9-10 good players" is the best way to build under the current CBA. It allows you to stay competitive and position yourself for a consolidation trade for a star.

I think the mistake is and always has been that they don't acquire enough draft capital for currency. Best case scenario, the Bulls could offer some combination of:

2026 1st (CHI)
2026 1st (POR)
Coby?
Essengue
+ expirings

if the right deal opened up.

But still, the Bulls suddenly are in a good position if this team is even just above average this season.

- Healthy payroll
- Young team
- Own all their own 1sts
- Cap space in 2026
- No significant contracts to negotiate until Buzelis in 2028

[ghostinthepost1]

It seems like Ja Morant is on the way out in Memphis.

Seems like an absolute head case and can't shoot to save his life but was an MVP level player not too long ago.

But it seems like the names that will be available are:
- Morant
- Trae Young
- Zion
- Trey Murphy
- Herb Jones
- Lauri

[DuckIII]

Until proven otherwise I’ll keep saying it. Enjoy this for a year because we can’t and won’t stay built like this. And the more games we win, the less likely it becomes, because our role players become league darlings and their contract value goes way up.

We need to trade some pieces whether it’s for an “all in” trade or not. This is a blast but it’s not what we’re going to look like long term.

[Indomitable]

What do you do to go all in? Trick question. We're already all in.

True dat. The Bulls are on an 82 win pace. Hard to upgrade at this point. That's without Coby and Collins.

In general the target everyone would want to replace is Vucevic but over the first 5 games he is playing like one of the best centers in the NBA. At this point, any trade is going to be a downgrade.

He has shown more quickness in 5 games. Then he has done for his entire time here.

[Indomitable]

Until proven otherwise I’ll keep saying it. Enjoy this for a year because we can’t and won’t stay built like this. And the more games we win, the less likely it becomes, because our role players become league darlings and their contract value goes way up.

We need to trade some pieces whether it’s for an “all in” trade or not. This is a blast but it’s not what we’re going to look like long term.

The new CBA will cause a lot of issues for us and them. The second apron is on our side.

Plus we might have 3 draft picks next year. Portland might actually convey. Our pick 1 and a 2.

Still I am a big fan about living in the moment after the Rose debacle.

[HomoSapien]

Ja Morant is a name worth talking about. A few years ago I would have given up a war chest for him. His stock is at the lowest it has probably been and he will likely ask for a trade soon. I would hate to do anything that could mess up Giddey's momentum but Morant is the type of name this thread was created to discuss.

[Chi town]

Until proven otherwise I’ll keep saying it. Enjoy this for a year because we can’t and won’t stay built like this. And the more games we win, the less likely it becomes, because our role players become league darlings and their contract value goes way up.

We need to trade some pieces whether it’s for an “all in” trade or not. This is a blast but it’s not what we’re going to look like long term.

Disagree.

CF showed above how we can keep everyone even if they get paid market value. Don’t think any of these guys think they are the man and want to prove how great they are on an up and coming team. Ayo is a Chicago kid too. Don’t think anyone gets crazy overpaid enough that AK doesn’t give a competitive offer either.

He will want to prove how great his build is.

If guys do get crazy overpaid I think we can find underpaid vets to quite a bit of what we are seeing. The beauty is the brand of hoops we are playing. Who doesn’t want to play with competitive unselfish players?