The "gather step" needs to be removed from the game ASAP.

[The Servant]

This is inspired by the Giannis thread but it doesnt pertain to just Giannis.

The integrity of the NBA is currently at an all time low and fans have lost faith in many areas over the past decade. Rules are there to make the game fair, to remove the elements of chaos, and should be easy to follow for the players, the fans, and the officials.

Allowing some players to take a 3 step gather and then two more steps, taking only one dribble from beyond the 3 point line is something else. Its not enjoyable. Its completely up to interpretation and as a result it just doesnt make for a good product. Just remove the concept or the rule. The NBA has changed the rules and the way the game has been called tons of times (hand checking, 5 second rule, 3 point etc. etc.).

Seeing Jordan Pool and Ja Morant with their "hesi" moves, seeing Giannis take a single dribble crossing half court to the hoop... Its all stuff that if you were playing with your friends on a court you'd call bs on. Fans feel it and see it.

Time to remove gather step from the game for the sake of the game. Its no different than the rip through throw my arms up at half court type nonsense.

[theforumblue]

"gather step" has been in the "mainstream" for 15+ years at least. nowadays they've combined it with euro step and the hesi *cough*carry*cough*. none of it is going away. we're all boomers.

[sashaturiaf]

Stop. Next you'll be telling me they will call travelling in the NBA

[The Servant]

"gather step" has been in the "mainstream" for 15+ years at least. nowadays they've combined it with euro step and the hesi *cough*carry*cough*. none of it is going away. we're all boomers.

Where does it end though? The game continues to "evolve" and by evolve I mean get worse. Its 5 steps now, but does it eventually become 6? Do we let the hand stick to 75% of the ball instead of the half way point?

7 steps and hand only 80% under the ball?

Its just becoming slop instead of sport, innit?

[UcanUwill]

I dont even really know what gather step really is, but that Giannis clip is not it, it is just a travel they didnt call, you can not take 5 steps in basketball, I dont care what rules you are using.

And if we are speaking about rules, 10 second free throw shooting limit is a rule, right? So why its allowed to be broken every tine same Giannis shoots fts?

[The Servant]

I dont even really know what gather step really is, but that Giannis clip is not it, it is just a travel they didnt call, you can not take 5 steps in basketball, I dont care what rules you are using.

And if we are speaking about rules, 10 second free throw shooting limit is a rule, right? So why its allowed to be broken every tine same Giannis shoots fts?

No one knows what is or isn't a gather step, that is the point. Its a grey area that leaves the game completely up to interpretation and makes for a product you cant really understand at times. I hope below helps:

https://youtube.com/shorts/d3eFNyRO9rI?si=LIrvxtGRAjVWgYP0

[Thaddy]

I dont even really know what gather step really is, but that Giannis clip is not it, it is just a travel they didnt call, you can not take 5 steps in basketball, I dont care what rules you are using.

And if we are speaking about rules, 10 second free throw shooting limit is a rule, right? So why its allowed to be broken every tine same Giannis shoots fts?

It comes down to them letting the ball float in their hand. When they actually grip it the step count starts. Harden was the first to master this and it spread like a wild fire.

[whatisacenter]

All these young fellas would look like a bunch of plumbers if they couldn't carry the ball while they hop/skip/jump their way to the basket....

[Yinwest]

Giannis is the poster child of a anti-fundamental basketball player. I don't mean it as negative, cause it works most of the time.

[The Servant]

Giannis is the poster child of a anti-fundamental basketball player. I don't mean it as negative, cause it works most of the time.

The big-nonfundamental

[Capn'O]

It shouldn't be removed but it should be a maximum of one step. This stroll around the park **** while you gather doesn't fly.

[ropjhk]

Basketball is broken in the NBA.

[jbsays]

I agree.... I'm already 25 years older than these kids in the gym. I can't keep up with them anyways. But, now you add the gather step and the hesitation (was a carry in my day) and I've got no shot! Where's my vet minimum deal?!?

[jbk1234]

It shouldn't be removed but it should be a maximum of one step. This stroll around the park **** while you gather doesn't fly.

This.

[DCasey91]

Same reason why LeBron has inconsistent pity patter sloppy feet on the post no call, same reason Jordan's face up or back turn around face up double step sprint drive, same reason Magic carried, same reason, something something... its to market the business that's it.

What gets me even worse is the sh*t younger players pull that are directly influenced by its predecssors

Cade, Ja, Shai legit can't dribble for sh*t under the letter of the law that aint dribbling thats full on carrying what are you a waiter?

NBA business first and foremost always will be.

[ItsDanger]

Maybe they allow these things like gathers, carrying, palming, etc to mask the lack of skill today and artificially enhance the perceived talent in the league today.

[madmaxmedia]

The big problem is that it's not a 'gather step' rule, it's more like the gather rule which means you can take as many steps as you want while you're still 'gathering' the ball.

If you were only allowed one gather step after you first touch the ball with your hands (not when you have firm control), it would agree more with most people's 'eye test'.

EDIT- Capn'O said it first above me,

[jokeboy86]

It's more the lax carrying rules that annoy me. And yet you have these same new fans that act like Durant, Giannis, Wemby or any 6'10 and up player is leaps and bound better than guys from the past like Kareem, Bird because they have better "handles". Can you imagine if guys like Kareem, Ewing, Malone, Worthy, Mourning, or Robinson had been able to dribble the basketball the way modern players have been able to?

[jokeboy86]

Maybe they allow these things like gathers, carrying, palming, etc to mask the lack of skill today and artificially enhance the perceived talent in the league today.

It's moreso about entertainment. They want everybody at every position to be able to play like guards and also the league has wanted their product to have some elements of street/pickup basketball for entertainment purposes for some time now.

This has always been one of my favorite basketball videos by The Ringer and it explains a lot:

Watch on YouTube

[og15]

It shouldn't be removed but it should be a maximum of one step. This stroll around the park **** while you gather doesn't fly.

Yes, guys were doing the gather step for a long time, but they weren't' trying to push any limits.

That said, the rule IS that you get one step, the zero step is the step that is taken as soon as you have gained control of the ball, then after that control you only have two steps. Now, there are some people who still don't grasp that, especially when they watch a layup on dunk in slow motion, but that one isn't really new. What players are doing is that they are delaying the pickup and stretching how long they let the ball float and are not "in control" to allow them to gather longer than past players would, but guys were just using a quicker zero step in the 80's and 90's.

What starts the arguments, and they are legit arguments is the question of when has a player officially gathered, because like mentioned, players are deliberately allowing the ball to float longer and delaying the pickup in order to cover more ground, and that makes things harder to officiate.

I don't think a maximum of one step can work, because when running fast for example, you do a push dribble and you're taking multiple steps between dribbles before you catch up to the ball, kind of hard to have just one step to gather. Also, would it contrast with a stutter step too, to make the rule like that, since you can take 8 steps in one dribble stuttering, and there's no travel? The idea there is that you're stepping as the ball floats. I know those are quicker little steps, but wouldn't that technically contrast with saying that only one step is allowed after the last dribble when coming to a gather?

Where I think definitions can be adjusted is what constitutes "control". I think maybe more in the thought of making it that after the hand comes in contact with the ball we consider it control, vs saying "only until you are unable to dribble anymore". This is where a lot of gather step complaints intersect with what is permitted dribbling wise and what is considered a carry.

I dont even really know what gather step really is, but that Giannis clip is not it, it is just a travel they didnt call, you can not take 5 steps in basketball, I dont care what rules you are using.

And if we are speaking about rules, 10 second free throw shooting limit is a rule, right? So why its allowed to be broken every tine same Giannis shoots fts?

No one knows what is or isn't a gather step, that is the point. Its a grey area that leaves the game completely up to interpretation and makes for a product you cant really understand at times. I hope below helps:

https://youtube.com/shorts/d3eFNyRO9rI?si=LIrvxtGRAjVWgYP0

Disagree there. Gather step is the step taken as the player gains control of the ball. What is making it confusing is the lag that players are using in getting control of the ball, delayed pickups, and not as much the gather step itself. What happens is that people are counting every step as soon as the last dribble is taken, and even counting steps when the player does not have control of the ball.

The example you show, the issue with those kinds of plays is that, sure, maybe it can be legal in the rules, but in a game, who is trying to do all that, and are you actually gaining any advantage? You probably aren't, so it's pretty pointless. Now, there are other ways you can use the gather step to gain advantages, though that's probably not one.

Some videos from 2019/2020

Gather step:

Watch on YouTube