The "gather step" needs to be removed from the game ASAP.

[sashaturiaf]

Just get rid of dribbling and let players carry the ball.

Joking...I think.

That would be legit hilarious to watch in a real NBA exhibition game.

Bucks games must be like stand up to you then.

[Bad Bart]

I really don't understand this mentality at all. First of all, it's not like these rules are selectively applied, so everyone is free to take advantage of them. Secondly, it seems like the underlying message is that this makes the game too easy. Please, go and try and do what Giannis did, or any other example you've shown. Good luck! I personally love the free-flowing nature of the game now and certainly don't want to go back to the old school, netball style of the game.

[The Servant]

I really don't understand this mentality at all. First of all, it's not like these rules are selectively applied, so everyone is free to take advantage of them. Secondly, it seems like the underlying message is that this makes the game too easy. Please, go and try and do what Giannis did, or any other example you've shown. Good luck! I personally love the free-flowing nature of the game now and certainly don't want to go back to the old school, netball style of the game.

Disagree. They even have a term for the selective application of rules, it's called getting superstar calls. Giannis is able to gather like this. Kostas would probably get called. The free flowing nature doesn't stem from gather step abuse, it stems from proper spacing and more players being willing passers and moving the ball.

Just my opinion though.

[Ryoga Hibiki]

I really don't understand this mentality at all. First of all, it's not like these rules are selectively applied, so everyone is free to take advantage of them. Secondly, it seems like the underlying message is that this makes the game too easy. Please, go and try and do what Giannis did, or any other example you've shown. Good luck! I personally love the free-flowing nature of the game now and certainly don't want to go back to the old school, netball style of the game.

Disagree. They even have a term for the selective application of rules, it's called getting superstar calls. Giannis is able to gather like this. Kostas would probably get called. The free flowing nature doesn't stem from gather step abuse, it stems from proper spacing and more players being willing passers and moving the ball.

Just my opinion though.

this particulat rule is being consistently applied.
it was much worse years ago, jordon was always always travelling on his first step

[Ainosterhaspie]

Y'all complaining clearly don't understand what you're complaining about. It's been very clearly explained in this thread, but you can't be bothered to understand because it's more fun to complain.

How hard is it to grasp the basic fact that you can take many steps between bounces of a ball without palming or carrying or using two hands. That's not a exploit, or rules problem. It's just how physics works. Stop crying about it.

[CROBulls]

"gather step" has been in the "mainstream" for 15+ years at least. nowadays they've combined it with euro step and the hesi *cough*carry*cough*. none of it is going away. we're all boomers.

Where does it end though? The game continues to "evolve" and by evolve I mean get worse. Its 5 steps now, but does it eventually become 6? Do we let the hand stick to 75% of the ball instead of the half way point?

7 steps and hand only 80% under the ball?

Its just becoming slop instead of sport, innit?

Eventually it's gonna turn into some kind of handball sport.

[vagelis]

The gather step(s) should be that you can throw the ball in front and you are allowed to do as many steps you want before catching the ball with one or 2 hands.
After catching the ball even with one hand you should have only 2 steps.

This was the rule and this should continue to be.
2 steps allowed after touching the ball.

3 steps is not basketball.
Even more 4 or 5 steps

[Ruma85]

People keep pointing at the wrong problem.
The issue is not how you officiate the gather *step*.
The issue is what is considered a *gather* and how much players can carry the ball while keeping the dribble live.
It's not about that half step, it's how Giannis could *legally* take two steps after his last bounce, hands on the side of the ball, with no intention of ever putting it back on the floor, and have such move consedered a live dribble.

Maybe I'm nitpicking or maybe I don't understand, but he had the intention of putting it back on the floor depending how the defence is playing him, the defence didn't adjust therefore he didn't put it back on the floor, he's hand was on the side of the ball, which makes it legal for it to be considered possibie( I'm pretty sure ) as a continued live dribble.

[kamus]

Y'all complaining clearly don't understand what you're complaining about. It's been very clearly explained in this thread, but you can't be bothered to understand because it's more fun to complain.

How hard is it to grasp the basic fact that you can take many steps between bounces of a ball without palming or carrying or using two hands. That's not a exploit, or rules problem. It's just how physics works. Stop crying about it.

I'm not understanding so a couple points to clarify.

1. I don't think anyone is talking about steps between dribbles its pretty obvious that you can take as many steps as you want between dribbles. What i don't understand is why continuing to dribble is treated the same as picking up your dribble? The steps between dribbles occur when the ball is not touching your hand. The "gather" step(s) take place when the ball is in your hand. To me these are totally different situations.

2. Someone earlier stated that if the ball is spinning in your hand or "floating" in your hand your dribble is still live. I strongly disagree with this. If you combine that interpretation with the NBA allowing to carry the ball by placing your hand underneath it it allows the player to seemingly take as many steps as they want after their last dribble. This is exactly what Giannis did. He takes 5! full steps after his last dribble.

3. These plays might be legal the way the rule is written in the NBA but I strongly believe if the "Giannis play" becomes used by most players the game will be unwatchable.

[Lalouie]

how can anyone possibly like the gather

,,,,or is it just a %of a % who care??

but does social media care? remember,,,this is the group silver wants to embrace

[Gusto1903]

Just call the blatant travels, and there is no problem with the gather

[Tofubeque]

2. Someone earlier stated that if the ball is spinning in your hand or "floating" in your hand your dribble is still live. I strongly disagree with this. If you combine that interpretation with the NBA allowing to carry the ball by placing your hand underneath it it allows the player to seemingly take as many steps as they want after their last dribble. This is exactly what Giannis did. He takes 5! full steps after his last dribble.

The ball touches your hand when you dribble, potentially for several steps at a time. That is not traveling, because it isn't picking up or palming the ball. If it is palmed, it is no longer spinning or falling due to gravity. If your hand goes underneath the ball, that *is* a carry and is supposed to be called. But your hand touching the top of the ball is literally nothing, it has no relevance to any rule. There is no rule at any level of basketball about what your feet can do while your hand touches the top of a spinning ball. That ball isn't secured, it can't be shot and could be knocked away by anyone (against Giannis, good luck).

Otherwise, you'd be "picking up" the ball to do every dribble. The live dribble isn't over until the ball is secured, it doesn't matter if it's touching your hand or when it last hit the floor.

[Lalouie]

Just call the blatant travels, and there is no problem with the gather

that giannis move is text book gather and since the gather is exactly defined, giannis's move is acceptable, so the gather RULE has to be eliminated or amended

the steps allowed after a gather is 2STEPS which is utterly ridiculous

but this is about THE GATHER. the window for subjective opinion, seems to me,,,is where does the phrase "gaining control of the ball" start. it's the "gaining control of the ball" part that ENDS the gather. so i think they have to redefine "gaining control of the ball". i think when you are dribbling you have control - after that 1 1/2 steps. i think that was the old way, YES?


lol smh... today's players would be lost if the played 70s rules

[theforumblue]

Please, go and try and do what Giannis did, or any other example you've shown. Good luck!

are you seriously saying what giannis did was difficult? that's not even high school level stuff, from decades ago.

[Mephariel]

I think they should call the violations more consistently but it is not that big of a deal. 70% of the time, when people complain about the gather step, they are looking at it slow motion. Everything looks like a travel in slow motion. Everything looks like palming in slow motion. Nobody in the world dribbles the ball only top down.

[prophet_of_rage]

You cannot. It's already baked into the next generation because schoolkids are doing it.

I was going to ref in the local rec league for fun and a way to stay in the game (I'm 63) and then realized the game I knew would get me killed if I called anything.

There's a rulebook for referees. If you all read the rulebook you wpuld understand what is going on and how to interpret it.

Sent from my SM-S9080 using RealGM mobile app

[prophet_of_rage]

The criticism you could have is lifting the pivot foot

that's what i mean. Lifting the pivot foot while the other foot is still down is, to me, switching the pivot foot. I get it that the rules are using different terminology.

So you hate layup and believe it is a travel?

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[floppymoose]

reading is fundamental

[og15]

The criticism you could have is lifting the pivot foot

that's what i mean. Lifting the pivot foot while the other foot is still down is, to me, switching the pivot foot. I get it that the rules are using different terminology.

So you hate layup and believe it is a travel?

Sent from my SM-S9080 using RealGM mobile app

Many times we aren't fully aware of what rules really mean. I know I never thought about the fact that (1) a layup is a progressing pivot, non-pivot, lift pivot, (2) so is a one legged floater, (3) so is a one legged running jumper. (4) That a post fadeaway is the same move, if you turn to your right shoulder, it is right foot pivot, left foot non pivot, lift right foot first, then jump to shoot.

Now I could say you shouldn't be able to lift your pivot foot, but then I need to be consistent and that becomes crazy.

All those plays are the same concept in different ways, but many times we are officiating (especially in pickup, seen some wild made up rules in pickup thhat people swear by) based on what we feel is correct vs what is by the rules.

I don't think floppymoose is alone in that, but what does confuse me is when we get the updated information and the illustrations (eg showing how all these moves are the same concept) and then some people are like, "la, la, la, la, I just don't like this one so it is wrong", that's when it is a weird, but if we're saying what we think, getting more information and then learning and updating, that's what life is about, no problem.

[floppymoose]

I am consistent. And prophet_of_rage is mischaracterizing my desired ruleset. Both things can be true.