Trade Talk (Part 18): Early Season Panic Edition

[Klomp]

What are the chances that Joan becomes as good or better than Kessler?

I didn't know it was illegal to have two good centers. Trading for Kessler does not mean the Timberwolves would be giving up on Beringer.

You read into my post something I never said or thought. I was simply asking the question I posted.

I think they will be both good centers, like the Mavericks have in Gafford and Lively.

[Domejandro]

If we were to trade for him what would we offer. Ju and Jaden are playing far too well for that and Naz wouldn't get it done.

This depends on how ugly things get in Memphis, but I think that “late December” line from Jon is a HUGE giveaway that my Naz framework is what Minnesota is sniffing around with (given that his trade eligibility is January 15th.

Naz Reid, Conley/Donte, Rob Dillingham, and Terrence Shannon Jr. (along with pick swaps)

That is a mediocre package that would allow Memphis to reset with some youth. I’m still hesitant on trading for Ja Morant, but the age and contract timeline makes sense.

[KGdaBom]

If we were to trade for him what would we offer. Ju and Jaden are playing far too well for that and Naz wouldn't get it done.

This depends on how ugly things get in Memphis, but I think that “late December” line from Jon is a HUGE giveaway that my Naz framework is what Minnesota is sniffing around with (given that his trade eligibility is January 15th.

Naz Reid, Conley/Donte, Rob Dillingham, and Terrence Shannon Jr. (along with pick swaps)

That is a mediocre package that would allow Memphis to reset with some youth. I’m still hesitant on trading for Ja Morant, but the age and contract timeline makes sense.

That's what it would take to match salary? I'm very hesitant about trading for Ja Morant. So hesitant I simply wouldn't do it.

[BlacJacMac]

Ja is shooting 36% overall and 15% from 3 (on almost 6/game!!). He's scoring 19 PPG on 18 FGAs.

He's a smaller guard that is often injured and almost completely reliant on athleticism and speed.

Stay far away from him.

[BlacJacMac]

Any chance to get Keon Ellis from SAC?

He'd be a nice target. He'd add a 2nd POA defender to Clark and he's a very good, low volume, shooter.

If we run offense mostly through Ant and Randle, we could have 48 minutes of bulldog defense between Clark and Ellis.

[Domejandro]

Ja is shooting 36% overall and 15% from 3 (on almost 6/game!!). He's scoring 19 PPG on 18 FGAs.

He's a smaller guard that is often injured and almost completely reliant on athleticism and speed.

Stay far away from him.

I have had criticisms about his impact for years, but if we are being real, those splits a reflection of him pulling a Jimmy Butler on Memphis.

Obviously not good (and I wouldn't trade Julius Randle or Rudy Gobert for him), but it's generally going to be toxic situations like this where Minnesota can capitalize with a lack of assets.

[BlacJacMac]

Ja is shooting 36% overall and 15% from 3 (on almost 6/game!!). He's scoring 19 PPG on 18 FGAs.

He's a smaller guard that is often injured and almost completely reliant on athleticism and speed.

Stay far away from him.

I have had criticisms about his impact for years, but if we are being real, those splits a reflection of him pulling a Jimmy Butler on Memphis.

He's still a career 31% 3pt shooter that has been at 31, 28 and 31 the past 3 years.

And that his 3PAr has gone up every year while his FTr has gone down is not a good sign for a player of his type.

[Klomp]

Ja is shooting 36% overall and 15% from 3 (on almost 6/game!!). He's scoring 19 PPG on 18 FGAs.

He's a smaller guard that is often injured and almost completely reliant on athleticism and speed.

Stay far away from him.

I have had criticisms about his impact for years, but if we are being real, those splits a reflection of him pulling a Jimmy Butler on Memphis.

Obviously not good (and I wouldn't trade Julius Randle or Rudy Gobert for him), but it's generally going to be toxic situations like this where Minnesota can capitalize with a lack of assets.

This is generally where I fall.

I don't trade Anthony Edwards, Julius Randle, or Rudy Gobert.
I probably don't trade Jaden McDaniels, but it depends on the overall package and where they feel the player values lie. For young assets, I hold on to Beringer (he is the equivalent of what Jaden McDaniels was in the Gobert trade).

I do think there are questions/concerns, and that's why it's important that Connelly does his due diligence as he has.

[Klomp]

He's still a career 31% 3pt shooter that has been at 31, 28 and 31 the past 3 years.

And that his 3PAr has gone up every year while his FTr has gone down is not a good sign for a player of his type.

What if teaming up with Anthony Edwards does for him what teaming up with Steph Curry at the Olympics did for Ant?

[Domejandro]

Assuming my framework is accurate, Minnesota's roster would look like the following...

Ja Morant / Bones Hyland
Anthony Edwards / Donte DiVincenzo
Jaden McDaniels / Jaylen Clark
Julius Randle / Leonard Miller / Joe Ingles
Rudy Gobert / Joan Beringer

(In theory, Mike Conley and Terrence Shannon Jr. could be swapped for Donte DiVincenzo, and the salaries would still work. I am just assuming that Memphis would want Terrence Shannon Jr., given how mediocre the package is, but worth noting for depth reasons.)

I would feel significantly more comfortable with this is Kyle Anderson ends up being bought out, but obviously that would not be known until after the Trade Deadline, which makes it tough.

Going into next season, this would be Minnesota's salary situation (Green is Player Option, Red is Team Option)

$48,924,624 | $52,298,736 | $55,672,848 - Anthony Edwards
$42,166,510 | $44,886,930 - Ja Morant
$36,500,000 | $38,000,000 - Rudy Gobert
$33,333,334 | $35,802,468 - Julius Randle
$26,200,000 | $28,006,898 | $29,813,790 - Jaden McDaniels
$12,535,000 - Donte DiVincenzo
Rookies and stuff

Effectively, this gives Minnesota a two-year timespan with Morant/Gobert/Randle, with the ability to reload the following year (if it doesn't work well) with Anthony Edwards and Jaden McDaniels both under contract.

[BlacJacMac]

He's still a career 31% 3pt shooter that has been at 31, 28 and 31 the past 3 years.

And that his 3PAr has gone up every year while his FTr has gone down is not a good sign for a player of his type.

What if teaming up with Anthony Edwards does for him what teaming up with Steph Curry at the Olympics did for Ant?

Healthier and less of an idiot?

[minimus]

I would feel significantly more comfortable with this is Kyle Anderson ends up being bought out, but obviously that would not be known until after the Trade Deadline, which makes it tough.

Well, this is where exactly IMO lies problem with Ja: once you trade for him, you need mtiple guys like Kyle Anderson Cooper o cover his weaknesses while playing for bargain contracts. I also don't believe that he is willing to give 100% of effort which is very concerning since he is not big nor physical enough. At this point of roster development MIN need a completely different type of PG: big, unselfish, physical and consistent. And more importantly low profile, I would not risk current foundation to make Ja happy.

[shangrila]

Assuming my framework is accurate, Minnesota's roster would look like the following...

Ja Morant / Bones Hyland
Anthony Edwards / Donte DiVincenzo
Jaden McDaniels / Jaylen Clark
Julius Randle / Leonard Miller / Joe Ingles
Rudy Gobert / Joan Beringer

(In theory, Mike Conley and Terrence Shannon Jr. could be swapped for Donte DiVincenzo, and the salaries would still work. I am just assuming that Memphis would want Terrence Shannon Jr., given how mediocre the package is, but worth noting for depth reasons.)

I would feel significantly more comfortable with this is Kyle Anderson ends up being bought out, but obviously that would not be known until after the Trade Deadline, which makes it tough.

Going into next season, this would be Minnesota's salary situation (Green is Player Option, Red is Team Option)

$48,924,624 | $52,298,736 | $55,672,848 - Anthony Edwards
$42,166,510 | $44,886,930 - Ja Morant
$36,500,000 | $38,000,000 - Rudy Gobert
$33,333,334 | $35,802,468 - Julius Randle
$26,200,000 | $28,006,898 | $29,813,790 - Jaden McDaniels
$12,535,000 - Donte DiVincenzo
Rookies and stuff

Effectively, this gives Minnesota a two-year timespan with Morant/Gobert/Randle, with the ability to reload the following year (if it doesn't work well) with Anthony Edwards and Jaden McDaniels both under contract.

This deal would require Memphis to waive 2 players as well, so that might cause a separate issue. We'd also need to sign I believe 3 guys to get to the minimum roster. If Anderson was one of them that would be great, but in the short term you'd be relying on Miller and/or Beringer as the backup bigs.

I suppose the team could convert Juzang to a full contract, since he's got some NBA experience from Utah and would be familiar with the system. Then maybe someone like Cam Payne as a backup PG? Or see if there's interest from Beasley to continue leaning into our identity as one of the best 3pt shooting teams in the league.

Like some other people here I'm souring a bit on Morant. I can see the vision for how it might work but it really relies on threading a needle and I worry about the health moving forward

[BlacJacMac]

I would feel significantly more comfortable with this is Kyle Anderson ends up being bought out, but obviously that would not be known until after the Trade Deadline, which makes it tough.

Well, this is where exactly IMO lies problem with Ja: once you trade for him, you need mtiple guys like Kyle Anderson Cooper o cover his weaknesses while playing for bargain contracts. I also don't believe that he is willing to give 100% of effort which is very concerning since he is not big nor physical enough. At this point of roster development MIN need a completely different type of PG: big, unselfish, physical and consistent. And more importantly low profile, I would not risk current foundation to make Ja happy.

Agreed. Ideally I want a guy who can be a good POA defender, can bring the ball up-court against pressure and hit the 3 at a high enough clip to demand some defensive attention.

I'd rather have a young PatBev type than a Ja, Coby or Trae.

[Klomp]

I would feel significantly more comfortable with this is Kyle Anderson ends up being bought out, but obviously that would not be known until after the Trade Deadline, which makes it tough.

Well, this is where exactly IMO lies problem with Ja: once you trade for him, you need mtiple guys like Kyle Anderson Cooper o cover his weaknesses while playing for bargain contracts. I also don't believe that he is willing to give 100% of effort which is very concerning since he is not big nor physical enough. At this point of roster development MIN need a completely different type of PG: big, unselfish, physical and consistent. And more importantly low profile, I would not risk current foundation to make Ja happy.

This is honestly the biggest question-mark and key to any potential trade discussions.

[Baseline81]

This depends on how ugly things get in Memphis, but I think that “late December” line from Jon is a HUGE giveaway that my Naz framework is what Minnesota is sniffing around with (given that his trade eligibility is January 15th.

Naz Reid, Conley/Donte, Rob Dillingham, and Terrence Shannon Jr. (along with pick swaps)

That is a mediocre package that would allow Memphis to reset with some youth. I’m still hesitant on trading for Ja Morant, but the age and contract timeline makes sense.

Unless there are no other interested teams, I don't see how such a framework wins out.

Why would Memphis want Reid when it has a better PF in JJJ?

[Klomp]

This depends on how ugly things get in Memphis, but I think that “late December” line from Jon is a HUGE giveaway that my Naz framework is what Minnesota is sniffing around with (given that his trade eligibility is January 15th.

Naz Reid, Conley/Donte, Rob Dillingham, and Terrence Shannon Jr. (along with pick swaps)

That is a mediocre package that would allow Memphis to reset with some youth. I’m still hesitant on trading for Ja Morant, but the age and contract timeline makes sense.

Unless there are no other interested teams, I don't see how such a framework wins out.

And that's fine if that's the case. Good catch, Dome.

[Domejandro]

This depends on how ugly things get in Memphis, but I think that “late December” line from Jon is a HUGE giveaway that my Naz framework is what Minnesota is sniffing around with (given that his trade eligibility is January 15th.

Naz Reid, Conley/Donte, Rob Dillingham, and Terrence Shannon Jr. (along with pick swaps)

That is a mediocre package that would allow Memphis to reset with some youth. I’m still hesitant on trading for Ja Morant, but the age and contract timeline makes sense.

Unless there are no other interested teams, I don't see how such a framework wins out.

Why would Memphis want Reid when it has a better PF in JJJ?

It mostly depends on whether or not the situation deteriorates, but being a bit more clear, that is more-so a general framework than a two-team swap that I am suggesting.

[BlacJacMac]

This depends on how ugly things get in Memphis, but I think that “late December” line from Jon is a HUGE giveaway that my Naz framework is what Minnesota is sniffing around with (given that his trade eligibility is January 15th.

Naz Reid, Conley/Donte, Rob Dillingham, and Terrence Shannon Jr. (along with pick swaps)

That is a mediocre package that would allow Memphis to reset with some youth. I’m still hesitant on trading for Ja Morant, but the age and contract timeline makes sense.

Unless there are no other interested teams, I don't see how such a framework wins out.

Why would Memphis want Reid when it has a better PF in JJJ?

JJJ would not be a bad player to put next to Reid.

And if you believe BBREF's Line-up data. JJJ still plays much more Center than PF. He's only played 95 of his 315 minutes with another Center.

[Domejandro]

This depends on how ugly things get in Memphis, but I think that “late December” line from Jon is a HUGE giveaway that my Naz framework is what Minnesota is sniffing around with (given that his trade eligibility is January 15th.

Naz Reid, Conley/Donte, Rob Dillingham, and Terrence Shannon Jr. (along with pick swaps)

That is a mediocre package that would allow Memphis to reset with some youth. I’m still hesitant on trading for Ja Morant, but the age and contract timeline makes sense.

Unless there are no other interested teams, I don't see how such a framework wins out.

Why would Memphis want Reid when it has a better PF in JJJ?

JJJ would not be a bad player to put next to Reid.

And if you believe BBREF's Line-up data. JJJ still plays much more Center than PF. He's only played 95 of his 315 minutes with another Center.

Big concern with that pairing is that neither can rebound. Defensively and offensively the fit is great, but that rebounding situation would be BRUTAL.