Official Scottie All Star Barnes Thread 9

[tsherkin]

Keep in mind that Lowry wasn't at this level at age 24.

We don't know what prime Scottie Barnes looks like.

Lowry was about a 14/4/7 player for Houston in his 5th season (where Barnes is now) in about 34 mpg. A little above league-average efficiency, had figured out 3pt shooting, but he wasn't up there in the offensive pecking order. Scola and Kevin Martin were the guys getting all the shots, and Aaron Brooks off the bench. So there was some degree of situational inhibition to his raw production. The basics of the Kyle we know from his time here were already there, though, and he was top-20 in O-EPM that season.

Just for the sake of comparison.

You're right, though. We definitely don't know what prime Barnes looks like. However, one of his impediments is his approach/attitude, and Lowry already knew who he was by this phase, and was always aggressive. He just needed to refine certain skills and find the opportunity to thrive. Barnes needs to bring a consistent approach to his game, and we need to see if this 3pt shooting is real, or just another hot streak. Historically, he's had 1 or 2 good 3pt shooting months per season, so skepticism should run high for a while.

Hopefully, though, he's found something which works as far as how to deploy his shot. And the environment around him is a lot better than the past couple seasons as well, so there's a chance that he'll be able to "weather the storm," so to speak, a little better this season.

For the first maybe 7 games, he was looking pretty assertive and aggressive, so if we can see a little more of that on a semi-regular basis, good things will come from it!

[Childs]

I mean 20 pts, 8 rebounds, and 5 assists on good efficiency is about what I have him as. I don't really have him increasing his PPG. This may be his peak, which is still a damn good player. Very impressed.

[TorontoBarneys]

Still of the opinion that he can push it to 22ppg. I see 23-24 ppg being possible in future seasons, he's still not a finished product.

[anotherhomer]

Still of the opinion that he can push it to 22ppg. I see 23-24 ppg being possible in future seasons, he's still not a finished product.

he'll prolly end up at 19.X

there's games he'll just be giving 12-14 pts because RJ and BI are cooking

[TheGeneral99]

Still of the opinion that he can push it to 22ppg. I see 23-24 ppg being possible in future seasons, he's still not a finished product.

If he averages 22, 8 and 5 on solid efficiency with great defense, he's an all-NBA level player.

So far this season he's ranked 11th in BPM, 17th in Win Shares, and 9th in VORP...that's awesome.

[sidsid]

Still of the opinion that he can push it to 22ppg. I see 23-24 ppg being possible in future seasons, he's still not a finished product.

he'll prolly end up at 19.X

there's games he'll just be giving 12-14 pts because RJ and BI are cooking

In the Lowry/Gasol mode, he's a guy who can scale down while keeping impact based on the context of the team.

Structuraly, I don't see his ppg increasing outside of pace adjustments on this team with lack of spacing and role. Basically, as long as a non-shooting Jak is on the team, modern basketball paint efficiency will be off the table. Hell the Celtics played wall-to-wall spacing lineups for years and their stars still couldn't score inside.

But his bread and butter should still eventually be the mid-range elbow offense. That's the foundation he can work with in a non-modern offense.

[tsherkin]

Looked really good last night. This environment is working out so far.

[anotherhomer]

Still of the opinion that he can push it to 22ppg. I see 23-24 ppg being possible in future seasons, he's still not a finished product.

he'll prolly end up at 19.X

there's games he'll just be giving 12-14 pts because RJ and BI are cooking

In the Lowry/Gasol mode, he's a guy who can scale down while keeping impact based on the context of the team.

Structuraly, I don't see his ppg increasing outside of pace adjustments on this team with lack of spacing and role. Basically, as long as a non-shooting Jak is on the team, modern basketball paint efficiency will be off the table. Hell the Celtics played wall-to-wall spacing lineups for years and their stars still couldn't score inside.

But his bread and butter should still eventually be the mid-range elbow offense. That's the foundation he can work with in a non-modern offense.

i don't think scottie has the ability to scale up his scoring.....if BI was gone, and teams defense focus on him, they can shut him down

[PushDaRock]

he'll prolly end up at 19.X

there's games he'll just be giving 12-14 pts because RJ and BI are cooking

In the Lowry/Gasol mode, he's a guy who can scale down while keeping impact based on the context of the team.

Structuraly, I don't see his ppg increasing outside of pace adjustments on this team with lack of spacing and role. Basically, as long as a non-shooting Jak is on the team, modern basketball paint efficiency will be off the table. Hell the Celtics played wall-to-wall spacing lineups for years and their stars still couldn't score inside.

But his bread and butter should still eventually be the mid-range elbow offense. That's the foundation he can work with in a non-modern offense.

i don't think scottie has the ability to scale up his scoring.....if BI was gone, and teams defense focus on him, they can shut him down

lol yeah we have already seen this play out, no need to revisit it.

[sidsid]

In the Lowry/Gasol mode, he's a guy who can scale down while keeping impact based on the context of the team.

Structuraly, I don't see his ppg increasing outside of pace adjustments on this team with lack of spacing and role. Basically, as long as a non-shooting Jak is on the team, modern basketball paint efficiency will be off the table. Hell the Celtics played wall-to-wall spacing lineups for years and their stars still couldn't score inside.

But his bread and butter should still eventually be the mid-range elbow offense. That's the foundation he can work with in a non-modern offense.

i don't think scottie has the ability to scale up his scoring.....if BI was gone, and teams defense focus on him, they can shut him down

lol yeah we have already seen this play out, no need to revisit it.

Scaling up with better players who generate more gravity, and of course crucially in a modern offense. Right now guys like RJ are just the beneficiaries of the offense without providing much in terms of that value.

The clear example is the one you think about when the GSW/Siakam trade options were floating around. Barnes or Siakam taking over the Draymond role while the opposing defense sells out on Curry with spacing is the type of ideal scenario which is an automatic one where the offense scales up efficiently.

[dTox]

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[Raps in 4]

Still of the opinion that he can push it to 22ppg. I see 23-24 ppg being possible in future seasons, he's still not a finished product.

he'll prolly end up at 19.X

there's games he'll just be giving 12-14 pts because RJ and BI are cooking

In the Lowry/Gasol mode, he's a guy who can scale down while keeping impact based on the context of the team.

Structuraly, I don't see his ppg increasing outside of pace adjustments on this team with lack of spacing and role. Basically, as long as a non-shooting Jak is on the team, modern basketball paint efficiency will be off the table. Hell the Celtics played wall-to-wall spacing lineups for years and their stars still couldn't score inside.

But his bread and butter should still eventually be the mid-range elbow offense. That's the foundation he can work with in a non-modern offense.

Yeah, Lowry/Gasol is a good comp for him. I never liked the Draymond comparisons because Draymond couldn't score if his life depended on it.

[tsherkin]

Yeah, Lowry/Gasol is a good comp for him. I never liked the Draymond comparisons because Draymond couldn't score if his life depended on it.

Yeah, Scottie has a little more in him in terms of scoring chops than Draymond has shown to date, for sure.

[MoneyBall]

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