Trade Talk (Part 18): Early Season Panic Edition

[minimus]

DAL IN: Gobert, Zach Collins (exp)
DAL OUT: AD

Why for DAL: get starting C, trade AD contract, go under luxury tax(???),

CHI IN: AD, Miller
CHI OUT: Vucevic(exp), Collins, Dalen Terry (exp), Jalen Smith, CHI 2026 FRP

Why for CHI: Chicago is hometown for AD

MIN IN: Vucevic(exp), Dalen Terry (exp), Jalen Smith, CHI 2026 FRP
MIN OUT: Gobert, Miller

Why for MIN: go under luxury tax(???), create some room to re-sign Clark next summer.

Next year:

Smith/Beringer + Zikarsky
Randle/Reid/McDaniels
McDaniels/TJ + Juzang
Edwards/Clark/DDV
DDV/Dillingham/???

+ 2026 MIN FRP
+ 2026 CHI FRP

[Klomp]

Keyonte George would be sweet. Dude can hoop.

He looks like dlo-light whenever I’ve seen him.

Does that mean he move faster/quicker than DLo

He is one of Wolves' pick too. Why do we keep wanting all our pick guys back anyway - Walker, Keynote, Markkanen, and Kuminga. They aren't great players for the value. Is there a deeper psychological reason ?

Keyonte was taken with a pick we traded them, but was not technically a Timberwolves draft pick. He was the first pick we traded Utah from the Gobert trade. Same with Kuminga in Golden State, of course, selected with the pick from the Russell trade.

[Neeva]

Wolves need to take a chance on a young but flawed player like Cavs did with Deandre Hunter. Mathurin?? I think he and Ant may work together.

Kuminga? If wolves can get the warriors 2026 lightly protected pock in a trade for Naz wolves would get similar offense off the bench.
Quickley has suddenly upped his play which sucks for the wolves , thought he may have come cheap and with picks with his bloated contract.

[minimus]

Read on Twitter

[Klomp]

One thought about Ja Morant...

There is currently an overwhelming majority of the fan base that is against the idea of Ja Morant. And if I'm being honest, that's probably where I fall as well. However, this morning I began to think about the entire discussion in a new way.

Over the last three-plus seasons, Memphis went from a team that was one of the league leaders in pick and rolls to the literal league basement. And I wonder if that's affecting Morant more than we might realize. The Grizzlies clearly don't cater their decisions around Ja Morant, so that's obviously not what was going on. While being pick and roll reliant isn't ideal and we don't exactly lead the league ourselves, it is also something that I think we might be equipped to handle.

One of the most important aspects Finch wants for his offense is for guys to touch the paint and then go from there. When he was in his right mind, I'd contend that Morant was one of the best in the league at this ability. I think people are quick to assume that his change in Morant's game has been willingly, but I would argue the trend speaks more to how the coaching staff and front office have been trying to tweak things on the fly and the results really haven't been great.

He is still only 26 years old. I think oftentimes we speak of him like he is 30. At that point, I agree that we need to take a longer look at his play style at his age. But for now, I think he still has a 3-5 year runway where he can still be a top performer on a contending team.

One other thing I was thinking. How much have things really changed in a year-plus?
Say you woke up on September 29, 2024, to a notification from Shams saying "the Timberwolves have traded Karl-Anthony Towns for Ja Morant", how would you feel? Say you woke up on October 5, 2024, to a notification from Shams saying "the Timberwolves have traded Julius Randle and Donte DiVincenzo for Ja Morant", how would you feel?

[Note30]

Keyonte George would be sweet. Dude can hoop.

Ironic.

[frankenwolf]

One thought about Ja Morant...

There is currently an overwhelming majority of the fan base that is against the idea of Ja Morant. And if I'm being honest, that's probably where I fall as well. However, this morning I began to think about the entire discussion in a new way.

Over the last three-plus seasons, Memphis went from a team that was one of the league leaders in pick and rolls to the literal league basement. And I wonder if that's affecting Morant more than we might realize. The Grizzlies clearly don't cater their decisions around Ja Morant, so that's obviously not what was going on. While being pick and roll reliant isn't ideal and we don't exactly lead the league ourselves, it is also something that I think we might be equipped to handle.

One of the most important aspects Finch wants for his offense is for guys to touch the paint and then go from there. When he was in his right mind, I'd contend that Morant was one of the best in the league at this ability. I think people are quick to assume that his change in Morant's game has been willingly, but I would argue the trend speaks more to how the coaching staff and front office have been trying to tweak things on the fly and the results really haven't been great.

He is still only 26 years old. I think oftentimes we speak of him like he is 30. At that point, I agree that we need to take a longer look at his play style at his age. But for now, I think he still has a 3-5 year runway where he can still be a top performer on a contending team.

One other thing I was thinking. How much have things really changed in a year-plus?
Say you woke up on September 29, 2024, to a notification from Shams saying "the Timberwolves have traded Karl-Anthony Towns for Ja Morant", how would you feel? Say you woke up on October 5, 2024, to a notification from Shams saying "the Timberwolves have traded Julius Randle and Donte DiVincenzo for Ja Morant", how would you feel?

IDK, I have never really liked his game. I thought it was based too much on getting a whistle (right SGA, gotta love those whistles) and he is not a good 3pt shooter. This team needs to keep up it's 3pt shooting and Ja would just allow for more opponents getting out quickly with those misses.

[shangrila]

One thought about Ja Morant...

There is currently an overwhelming majority of the fan base that is against the idea of Ja Morant. And if I'm being honest, that's probably where I fall as well. However, this morning I began to think about the entire discussion in a new way.

Over the last three-plus seasons, Memphis went from a team that was one of the league leaders in pick and rolls to the literal league basement. And I wonder if that's affecting Morant more than we might realize. The Grizzlies clearly don't cater their decisions around Ja Morant, so that's obviously not what was going on. While being pick and roll reliant isn't ideal and we don't exactly lead the league ourselves, it is also something that I think we might be equipped to handle.

One of the most important aspects Finch wants for his offense is for guys to touch the paint and then go from there. When he was in his right mind, I'd contend that Morant was one of the best in the league at this ability. I think people are quick to assume that his change in Morant's game has been willingly, but I would argue the trend speaks more to how the coaching staff and front office have been trying to tweak things on the fly and the results really haven't been great.

He is still only 26 years old. I think oftentimes we speak of him like he is 30. At that point, I agree that we need to take a longer look at his play style at his age. But for now, I think he still has a 3-5 year runway where he can still be a top performer on a contending team.

One other thing I was thinking. How much have things really changed in a year-plus?
Say you woke up on September 29, 2024, to a notification from Shams saying "the Timberwolves have traded Karl-Anthony Towns for Ja Morant", how would you feel? Say you woke up on October 5, 2024, to a notification from Shams saying "the Timberwolves have traded Julius Randle and Donte DiVincenzo for Ja Morant", how would you feel?

IDK, I have never really liked his game. I thought it was based too much on getting a whistle (right SGA, gotta love those whistles) and he is not a good 3pt shooter. This team needs to keep up it's 3pt shooting and Ja would just allow for more opponents getting out quickly with those misses.

I think you could clean up some of that with shot selection. His 3pa rate has increased over the last few seasons while his rim/floater shot rate has decreased, while his efficiency in both areas has roughly stayed the same (this season notwithstanding). He's also been a capable corner 3pt shooter at times in his career, so in theory you could build something a little more around that (I wouldn't plant him in the corner, obviously, but there might be some potential there in a drive and kick then relocate to the corner for a pass back type of situation).

[BlacJacMac]

One thought about Ja Morant...

There is currently an overwhelming majority of the fan base that is against the idea of Ja Morant. And if I'm being honest, that's probably where I fall as well. However, this morning I began to think about the entire discussion in a new way.

Over the last three-plus seasons, Memphis went from a team that was one of the league leaders in pick and rolls to the literal league basement. And I wonder if that's affecting Morant more than we might realize. The Grizzlies clearly don't cater their decisions around Ja Morant, so that's obviously not what was going on. While being pick and roll reliant isn't ideal and we don't exactly lead the league ourselves, it is also something that I think we might be equipped to handle.

One of the most important aspects Finch wants for his offense is for guys to touch the paint and then go from there. When he was in his right mind, I'd contend that Morant was one of the best in the league at this ability. I think people are quick to assume that his change in Morant's game has been willingly, but I would argue the trend speaks more to how the coaching staff and front office have been trying to tweak things on the fly and the results really haven't been great.

He is still only 26 years old. I think oftentimes we speak of him like he is 30. At that point, I agree that we need to take a longer look at his play style at his age. But for now, I think he still has a 3-5 year runway where he can still be a top performer on a contending team.

One other thing I was thinking. How much have things really changed in a year-plus?
Say you woke up on September 29, 2024, to a notification from Shams saying "the Timberwolves have traded Karl-Anthony Towns for Ja Morant", how would you feel? Say you woke up on October 5, 2024, to a notification from Shams saying "the Timberwolves have traded Julius Randle and Donte DiVincenzo for Ja Morant", how would you feel?

IDK, I have never really liked his game. I thought it was based too much on getting a whistle (right SGA, gotta love those whistles) and he is not a good 3pt shooter. This team needs to keep up it's 3pt shooting and Ja would just allow for more opponents getting out quickly with those misses.

I think you could clean up some of that with shot selection. His 3pa rate has increased over the last few seasons while his rim/floater shot rate has decreased, while his efficiency in both areas has roughly stayed the same (this season notwithstanding). He's also been a capable corner 3pt shooter at times in his career, so in theory you could build something a little more around that (I wouldn't plant him in the corner, obviously, but there might be some potential there in a drive and kick then relocate to the corner for a pass back type of situation).

Unfortunately he's not a good shooter from anywhere else. He's just an OK finisher and pretty bad from 3' out. And the corner 3 is apparently the only one he can hit.

Shai's whistle is pretty ridiculous, but its only part of what makes him dangerous. He's a true 3-level scorer that can hurt you from anywhere. And he's not nearly as reliant on his athleticism as Ja is.

[shrink]

Over the last three-plus seasons, Memphis went from a team that was one of the league leaders in pick and rolls to the literal league basement. And I wonder if that's affecting Morant more than we might realize.

Good eye. From what I’ve read, Morant is angry with the coach for not running a pick-and-roll offense that suits his game. He’s also angry with the organization for not offering him an extension, like they did JJJ. He feels the team is no longer building around him, and he’s probably right.

[Klomp]

IDK, I have never really liked his game. I thought it was based too much on getting a whistle (right SGA, gotta love those whistles) and he is not a good 3pt shooter. This team needs to keep up it's 3pt shooting and Ja would just allow for more opponents getting out quickly with those misses.

I think you could clean up some of that with shot selection. His 3pa rate has increased over the last few seasons while his rim/floater shot rate has decreased, while his efficiency in both areas has roughly stayed the same (this season notwithstanding). He's also been a capable corner 3pt shooter at times in his career, so in theory you could build something a little more around that (I wouldn't plant him in the corner, obviously, but there might be some potential there in a drive and kick then relocate to the corner for a pass back type of situation).

This is what I'm wondering as well. It might not guarantee he returns to his 2021-22 and prior form, but it gives him a chance. I also think it's worth remembering that Julius Randle had 3-point shooting concerns before we traded for him as well.

I'm not saying that I would do the trade for certain (especially without knowing outgoing pieces), but I do think there would be valid reasons behind a belief that it would work.

[Klomp]

Over the last three-plus seasons, Memphis went from a team that was one of the league leaders in pick and rolls to the literal league basement. And I wonder if that's affecting Morant more than we might realize.

Good eye. From what I’ve read, Morant is angry with the coach for not running a pick-and-roll offense that suits his game. He’s also angry with the organization for not offering him an extension, like they did JJJ. He feels the team is no longer building around him, and he’s probably right.

And there is certainly merit to why the franchise made that shift. But I think it's important to contextualize any big situation like that, understanding that things won't necessarily carry over from one franchise to another.

[winforlose]

Over the last three-plus seasons, Memphis went from a team that was one of the league leaders in pick and rolls to the literal league basement. And I wonder if that's affecting Morant more than we might realize.

Good eye. From what I’ve read, Morant is angry with the coach for not running a pick-and-roll offense that suits his game. He’s also angry with the organization for not offering him an extension, like they did JJJ. He feels the team is no longer building around him, and he’s probably right.

And there is certainly merit to why the franchise made that shift. But I think it's important to contextualize any big situation like that, understanding that things won't necessarily carry over from one franchise to another.

If he joins a team with Ant or another alpha, he will need to accept that he is a #2 when playing with them. Same way anybody who plays with Giannis, or Luka, or SGA must make that same adjustment.

[Loaf_of_bread]

Who in the nba world was a headcase with a ton of talent (while showing recent decline) at 26 years old......

And turned it all around and lived up to their potential while also being a team-based player/calmed their ego?

Any examples? Just seems like way too high of a risk for the small chance he grows up.

[BlacJacMac]

Who in the nba world was a headcase with a ton of talent (while showing recent decline) at 26 years old......

And turned it all around and lived up to their potential while also being a team-based player/calmed their ego?

Any examples? Just seems like way too high of a risk for the small chance he grows up.

Let's also not forget that he's a smaller guy that plays a very physical game and is hurt all the time.

[Klomp]

Who in the nba world was a headcase with a ton of talent (while showing recent decline) at 26 years old......

And turned it all around and lived up to their potential while also being a team-based player/calmed their ego?

Any examples? Just seems like way too high of a risk for the small chance he grows up.

Does it help his case if I say Jimmy was 27 when we traded for him?

[Loaf_of_bread]

Who in the nba world was a headcase with a ton of talent (while showing recent decline) at 26 years old......

And turned it all around and lived up to their potential while also being a team-based player/calmed their ego?

Any examples? Just seems like way too high of a risk for the small chance he grows up.

Does it help his case if I say Jimmy was 27 when we traded for him?

Jimmy wasn't labeled as 'THAT' problematic then, and he was a late bloomer. Anyone else you can think of?

[shangrila]

Who in the nba world was a headcase with a ton of talent (while showing recent decline) at 26 years old......

And turned it all around and lived up to their potential while also being a team-based player/calmed their ego?

Any examples? Just seems like way too high of a risk for the small chance he grows up.

People are different. You can't use history to determine if Ja can turn things around, especially since the answer is something we can't know as fans. We're not behind the scenes so we can only speculate on the motives. Is he upset about the team not building around him, and could that be an issue with Edwards? Maybe. Could he want an exorbitant extension and play like crap until he gets it? Also maybe. Could he just be physically declining without the skill growth to compensate, who's taking that frustration out on the world around him? A possibility too.

Ultimately the answer to your question is one that we can't know but the front office would hopefully be able to determine, so I'll defer to them on that.

[cmoss84]

Mia in: Julius
SAC in: DDV, Rozier, RD, FRP
MN in: Lavine, Raynaud, FRP

Lavine/Ant/Jaden/Naz/Rudy
Mike/Clark/TSJ/Miller/Raynaud/JB

[winforlose]

Mia in: Julius
SAC in: DDV, Rozier, RD, FRP
MN in: Lavine, Raynaud, FRP

Lavine/Ant/Jaden/Naz/Rudy
Mike/Clark/TSJ/Miller/Raynaud/JB

I would rather have DDV than Lavine, I would rather have Randle than a FRP, and I don’t need Raynaud when I have both Joan and Rocco. I see this trade as a major step backward.