Trade Talk (Part 18): Early Season Panic Edition

[minimus]

I still believe that this roster need a guy like Davion Mitchell at PG (Anthony Black???) and Joan Beringer with full year of development (English, not fouling and making simple reads in offense and defense) to take 10-15 mpg from aging Gobert.

Beringer-Randle-McDaniels-Edwards-Black

We don't need Ja, Trae, Fox.

[shangrila]

Do we know Powell wants to be here?

We know from the tweet that Finch wanted him, but was it reciprocal?

That’s a good point, and as I looked closer, Powell is doing even better than I thought. Sure he’s a one-way player, but he’s averaging 25.4 PPG and shooting 46.4% 3P%. Yes, he’ll be 33, but he might find teams willing to offer him $25 so he gets one last big payday.

He plays for Spoelstra he makes players look better than they really are.

To be fair, he looked great for the Clippers last season to. Was arguably an All Star snub

[shrink]

Zaps depth, but gets a dynamic PG in Trae…

To Heat: Randle/DDV

To Hawks: Herro/Dilly/Heat Filler/Heat 1st

To Wolves: Trae/2x Hawks Filler

Gobert/Reid/Beringer
Reid/McDaniels/Hawks Filler
McDaniels/Edwards/Miller
Edwards/TSJ/Hawks Filler
Trae/Conley/Bones

Trade Value:

Randle (elite play + contract) >> DDV (contract) > Trae (play?) > Dilly (upside?)

Trae is injured, a UFA,and rarely produces winning play because he is statistically one of the worst defenders in the league. It is not a surprise the Hawks are playing better without him. This is an incredibly bad return in trade value, and makes the team substantially worse on the court as well

[cmoss84]

Murray, Alvarado, and Missi
For
Naz, DDV, RD, and Miller

[minimus]

Watching Conley and DDV play, I wonder if our biggest need at PG is a big guard who can drive and finish at rim. Lack of rim pressure (not shooting) leads to stagnant offense

[Klomp]

If he was about $10 million cheaper, I would back up the Brinks truck for Jrue Holiday.

Jalen Suggs is probably the closest thing out there to Jrue Holiday. Anthony Black could be a poorer man's version. Trying to think of others.

[Klomp]

Technically, Donte and Rob for Nembhard works under the salary cap rules.....

[Neeva]

Murray, Alvarado, and Missi
For
Naz, DDV, RD, and Miller

You continue to overrate Dejounte Murray. Missi barely plays for a horrible team because he can’t play nba defense at all.

[Klomp]

Feels like selling low, but Donte and Rob for Tre Jones and Jalen Smith is an interesting concept I could get behind.

[Wolveswin]

Zaps depth, but gets a dynamic PG in Trae…

To Heat: Randle/DDV

To Hawks: Herro/Dilly/Heat Filler/Heat 1st

To Wolves: Trae/2x Hawks Filler

Gobert/Reid/Beringer
Reid/McDaniels/Hawks Filler
McDaniels/Edwards/Miller
Edwards/TSJ/Hawks Filler
Trae/Conley/Bones

Trade Value:

Randle (elite play + contract) >> DDV (contract) > Trae (play?) > Dilly (upside?)

Trae is injured, a UFA,and rarely produces winning play because he is statistically one of the worst defenders in the league. It is not a surprise the Hawks are playing better without him. This is an incredibly bad return in trade value, and makes the team substantially worse on the court as well

I agree with you other than DDV being > Trae. Not correct. Hawks won’t trade him if that is market value he really has.

[shrink]

When you guys are thinking about trades, I just thought I’d point out a couple things.

Right now, MIN’s payroll is about $3.56 mil under the second apron. However, because we’ve done no action that triggers either apron, we are not under any apron restrictions. Yet. Keep in mind that any transaction we do that trips those restrictions needs to be legal AFTER the new trade is completed. For example, if we combine salaries to match in a trade, that would immediately make us capped at the second apron, which wouldn’t be too big a deal. If we do a deal where we take back more money than we take in, or wanted to use the tMLE, that would cap us at the first apron, and it would be extremely difficult to cut that much payroll to make it legal.

Second Apron ($207,824,000)
Minnesota Timberwolves: ($204,262,013)
First Apron ($195,945,000)
Luxury Threshold ($187,895,000)

[shrink]

Feels like selling low, but Donte and Rob for Tre Jones and Jalen Smith is an interesting concept I could get behind.

You’re right about the targets, and you’re also right - overpay. I was curious what Tre would look like when Coby White came back, and to the Bulls credit, he is still getting minutes. He’s 9-for-21 .. over his last four games! At 6-1, he’s exclusively a PG, but with Giddey and Coby there, he’s not worth his $8 mil salary to the Bulls, and next year’s $8 mil is certainly a negative. If they could dump him, they might have the money to make Coby White an offer. Jalen Smith is nothing special, and he’s getting paid $9 mil this year, and $9.4 next year.

——

This trade illustrates how Tim Connelly’s hands are tied. He’s been a good GM with his contracts, and our top six players have the top six contracts. None of those are bad deals; (semicolon!) all provide the bulk of our team’s production and identity. While many multi-year contenders end up only able to continue to afford a few guys over the years, we have six, and they are locked up for the future too.

However, as this trade illustrates, if you have all your salary locked up in players you need, you don’t have disposable matching salary to trade for role players unless they are well under market price. I think that part of the reason for the Towns’ trade was to free up salary for future moves, but we ended up keeping Randle and Naz with our flexibility (the right call, btw). To solve a problem like this, a team needs to sell one of its expensive players for a (lesser) cheaper player, plus other, tradable or useful, contracts. For our team specifically, DDV shouldn’t be traded - he helps solve this problem. Ant is untradable, of course. So while it would hurt and leave new holes to fill, the Wolves might need to consider trading Julius, Rudy, McDaniels or Naz, for a future star (likely on 2nd or 3rd year rookie scale) plus deadweight contracts, (likely expirings or two year deals).

It’s painful to make trades like these, and fans always love their promising rookies. And we would likely take a step back this year towards contending, when many fans think the season is a failure if we don’t return to the WCF. However, a trade like this would untie Connelly’s hands, and allow him to make more trades, which he has shown he can do successfully.

[cmoss84]

Murray, Alvarado, and Missi
For
Naz, DDV, RD, and Miller

You continue to overrate Dejounte Murray. Missi barely plays for a horrible team because he can’t play nba defense at all.

Admittedly I don't follow all teams in the league nearly enough. I just remember last year people were saying Missi was nearly untouchable for them. I haven't really mentioned Murray a whole lot, but I probably overrate Alvarado.
This one is a roll of the dice, but balances our roster a bit better. One of Julius or Naz has to go.

[Burgs_Burgi]

If he was about $10 million cheaper, I would back up the Brinks truck for Jrue Holiday.

Jalen Suggs is probably the closest thing out there to Jrue Holiday. Anthony Black could be a poorer man's version. Trying to think of others.

Ayo Dosunmu! Thats who I've been saying for ages... don't think the Bulls let him go but worth a shot

[Slim Tubby]

I'm not endorsing this idea but with Ryan Rollins becoming a revelation for MIL, Kevin Porter Jr might be available. He's due back from injury in the next two (2) weeks, makes $5M this season and a PO for next year.

KPJ has plenty of baggage but just throwing it out there as we all agonize over our dismal options at PG.

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[Slim Tubby]

If he was about $10 million cheaper, I would back up the Brinks truck for Jrue Holiday.

Jalen Suggs is probably the closest thing out there to Jrue Holiday. Anthony Black could be a poorer man's version. Trying to think of others.

I still contend that Jrue and Derrick White would be our best case scenario. They would both provide our offense with the distribution, stability and late game poise we desperately miss.

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[Klomp]

If he was about $10 million cheaper, I would back up the Brinks truck for Jrue Holiday.

Jalen Suggs is probably the closest thing out there to Jrue Holiday. Anthony Black could be a poorer man's version. Trying to think of others.

I still contend that Jrue and Derrick White would be our best case scenario. They would both provide our offense with the distribution, stability and late game poise we desperately miss.

Sent from my G54 using RealGM mobile app

Yeah White would probably be the other one....but I fear what the asking price would be.

[Slim Tubby]

If he was about $10 million cheaper, I would back up the Brinks truck for Jrue Holiday.

Jalen Suggs is probably the closest thing out there to Jrue Holiday. Anthony Black could be a poorer man's version. Trying to think of others.

I still contend that Jrue and Derrick White would be our best case scenario. They would both provide our offense with the distribution, stability and late game poise we desperately miss.

Sent from my G54 using RealGM mobile app

Yeah White would probably be the other one....but I fear what the asking price would be.

If POR wasn't contending for a Playoff spot, Holiday might've been reasonably attainable but it's good to see that team have some success.

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[minimus]

Feels like selling low, but Donte and Rob for Tre Jones and Jalen Smith is an interesting concept I could get behind.

You’re right about the targets, and you’re also right - overpay.

I wish there were more PGs on descending contract such as Suggs, it look like this is the only realistic (in terms of financial) trade target.

[winforlose]

Feels like selling low, but Donte and Rob for Tre Jones and Jalen Smith is an interesting concept I could get behind.

You’re right about the targets, and you’re also right - overpay.

I wish there were more PGs on descending contract such as Suggs, it look like this is the only realistic (in terms of financial) trade target.

Denver had a a few years after the chip where their bench took a step back and they struggled as a result. We had high expectations of TSJ that are not working out at the moment. We have high hopes for Joan but he needs a couple of years. Clark might improve his 3 point shooting and judgement given time. Miller is probably a bust, but as far as cheap 3rd string he is probably fine. We really are only a backup C and a starting PG away from contention, and time is on our side.