PG (Atl): Raps take Hawk Two-Ah in Toronto (25/26 edition)

[mtcan]

But but...hes a black hole...

Tunnel vision...toxic asset....

You're a homer+ team mid for thinking otherwise.

RJ must be benched as a 6th man because we MUST start Jakobe.

[hype_2004]

Ingram keeps gettimg better and better. There was definitely some risk when we got him but as the season goes on....we are benefitting from that decision more and more. This team was desperate for an offensive star and we got one.

CMB - we knew he was gonna be a gritty hustling post guy with great defense. What we didn't know for sure is how other parts of his game would translate. The thing that sticks out to me even when he hasnt had a big game.....is his PASSING. That is what has me more excited about him than anything else.

The second buggesr development of this season (second to BI) is the bench. Having Mamu, Shead and CMB bodes well. Then we can alternate between Dick and walter based on what's needed for the ninth spot in the playoff rotation.

Another game where IQ sits during crunchtime in addition to some curious body language between him and Darko/scotty in places. It could end up just being a temporary thing while he's struggling. But if there's a 3rd and 4th time....i wonder if that hints towards a trade.

I kinda feel bad for IQ. My impression was that he wasn't gonna be expected to run the offense as a traditional PG. And now he's getting benched for not flourishing in that role because they changed their minds about Barnes doing it. Barnes was visibly NOT pleased with IQ's play a couple times.

Just an observation but I just don't think the chemistry is there between IQ & Scottie. There's been multiple times throughout the season where you see Scottie visibly frustrated with IQ's decision making as a PG.

wait til he plays with Trae Young, he might just ask for a trade

[Mikistan]

LMAOOOOOOOO

Relax man

Trae is a significantly better player than Poeltl

Let’s not be foolish

Not on the contract he has. I want no part of Trae, at this point in his career he is the worse player imo. Would not touch.

Trae if 5 years ago? Sure but he's not there anymore. Look at Hawks record with him in.
At this point in his career he should be a sixth man but he won't take that role.

Trae on an expiring contract is better than Poeltl’s situation of being paid 28mil for the next 3 years.

And talent wise Trae is severals tiers above Poeltl.

You continue to not know what Poeltl gets paid.

[mtcan]

Ingram keeps gettimg better and better. There was definitely some risk when we got him but as the season goes on....we are benefitting from that decision more and more. This team was desperate for an offensive star and we got one.

CMB - we knew he was gonna be a gritty hustling post guy with great defense. What we didn't know for sure is how other parts of his game would translate. The thing that sticks out to me even when he hasnt had a big game.....is his PASSING. That is what has me more excited about him than anything else.

The second buggesr development of this season (second to BI) is the bench. Having Mamu, Shead and CMB bodes well. Then we can alternate between Dick and walter based on what's needed for the ninth spot in the playoff rotation.

Another game where IQ sits during crunchtime in addition to some curious body language between him and Darko/scotty in places. It could end up just being a temporary thing while he's struggling. But if there's a 3rd and 4th time....i wonder if that hints towards a trade.

I kinda feel bad for IQ. My impression was that he wasn't gonna be expected to run the offense as a traditional PG. And now he's getting benched for not flourishing in that role because they changed their minds about Barnes doing it. Barnes was visibly NOT pleased with IQ's play a couple times.

Just an observation but I just don't think the chemistry is there between IQ & Scottie. There's been multiple times throughout the season where you see Scottie visibly frustrated with IQ's decision making as a PG.

wait til he plays with Trae Young, he might just ask for a trade

Not a fan of logo 3 point attempts with 20 seconds on the shot clock?

[mdenny]

Ingram keeps gettimg better and better. There was definitely some risk when we got him but as the season goes on....we are benefitting from that decision more and more. This team was desperate for an offensive star and we got one.

CMB - we knew he was gonna be a gritty hustling post guy with great defense. What we didn't know for sure is how other parts of his game would translate. The thing that sticks out to me even when he hasnt had a big game.....is his PASSING. That is what has me more excited about him than anything else.

The second buggesr development of this season (second to BI) is the bench. Having Mamu, Shead and CMB bodes well. Then we can alternate between Dick and walter based on what's needed for the ninth spot in the playoff rotation.

Another game where IQ sits during crunchtime in addition to some curious body language between him and Darko/scotty in places. It could end up just being a temporary thing while he's struggling. But if there's a 3rd and 4th time....i wonder if that hints towards a trade.

I kinda feel bad for IQ. My impression was that he wasn't gonna be expected to run the offense as a traditional PG. And now he's getting benched for not flourishing in that role because they changed their minds about Barnes doing it. Barnes was visibly NOT pleased with IQ's play a couple times.

Just an observation but I just don't think the chemistry is there between IQ & Scottie. There's been multiple times throughout the season where you see Scottie visibly frustrated with IQ's decision making as a PG.

I hadn't really noticed it before tbh. But that play with 5 minutes left when IQ got kinda shoved out of bounds under the net and turned the ball over.....scott was near center court with his hands turned out the whole time and then motioned for IQ to have used his screen earlier in the play going up the court.

Shead subbed in around 30 seconds later. But it's also easy to read too much into this stuff.

[mihaic]

Not on the contract he has. I want no part of Trae, at this point in his career he is the worse player imo. Would not touch.

Trae if 5 years ago? Sure but he's not there anymore. Look at Hawks record with him in.
At this point in his career he should be a sixth man but he won't take that role.

It's not really a bad contract. He only has a player option next season that he will surely pick up at this point.

I'm interested in Trae because of the player option and the shorter term along with either a first round pick and/or Risacher. I can care less if he leaves a free agent. But we can clean up the cap sheet by getting off of IQ and/or Jak's contracts sooner.

I disagree, it's a bad trade in my opinion. You give a C which you need against big bodies, IQ (playable but overpaid) and a prospect in Dick for a professional loser (empty stats, what he gives you on O he loses on D).

I prefer we stand pat.

[Tripod]

Walter is now -103 on the season.

Our next worse rotation guy is Ochai at -10.

Dick is +73....4th best on the team.

At some point isn't it clear that Walter is an issue and kills almost every lineup, regardless what he shoots from 3?

Don't care if it's Walter or Dick but we gotta get one of them outta here ASAP. They are never good together and to my memory, the only times either of them were good on a more consistent basis was when the other guy was a non-factor. IMO only thing they do is get in each other's way. Like today in 4th quarter, Dick's having a good game and we are in key stretch in the 4th, there's no viable reason to have Walter switched into the game. But even when one guy's playing real well, Darko's gotta put the other guy in there for obligatory 2 minutes not within flow of anything.

Just pick a guy and get the other guy out. Not like we don't have 3~4 other backup SG's to step in.

Agreed.

It's just so odd how their plus/minus is so different given Walter has a better 3pt%.

Gradey somehow wins his minutes when not with Walter. Walter seems to somehow always lose his regardless who he plays with.

[Los_29]

It's not really a bad contract. He only has a player option next season that he will surely pick up at this point.

I'm interested in Trae because of the player option and the shorter term along with either a first round pick and/or Risacher. I can care less if he leaves a free agent. But we can clean up the cap sheet by getting off of IQ and/or Jak's contracts sooner.

I disagree, it's a bad trade in my opinion. You give a C which you need against big bodies, IQ (playable but overpaid) and a prospect in Dick for a professional loser (empty stats, what he gives you on O he loses on D).

I prefer we stand pat.

Yeah it's a horrible trade because we lose so much size. You're not winning anything with Mamu as your starting C. I think Trae has little to no trade value and I wouldn't be surprised to see him get dealt for filler and a couple of highly protected picks.

[Godaddycurse]

It's not really a bad contract. He only has a player option next season that he will surely pick up at this point.

I'm interested in Trae because of the player option and the shorter term along with either a first round pick and/or Risacher. I can care less if he leaves a free agent. But we can clean up the cap sheet by getting off of IQ and/or Jak's contracts sooner.

I disagree, it's a bad trade in my opinion. You give a C which you need against big bodies, IQ (playable but overpaid) and a prospect in Dick for a professional loser (empty stats, what he gives you on O he loses on D).

I prefer we stand pat.

1000x this. We need lower usage PG and C around RJ/Ingram/Barnes. Trae aint it

[YogurtProducer]

Walter is now -103 on the season.

Our next worse rotation guy is Ochai at -10.

Dick is +73....4th best on the team.

At some point isn't it clear that Walter is an issue and kills almost every lineup, regardless what he shoots from 3?

This is why +/- is useless.

Walter is good defensively and shoots the 3 alright. He’s far from a negative in his role.

[mihaic]

Walter is now -103 on the season.

Our next worse rotation guy is Ochai at -10.

Dick is +73....4th best on the team.

At some point isn't it clear that Walter is an issue and kills almost every lineup, regardless what he shoots from 3?

Don't care if it's Walter or Dick but we gotta get one of them outta here ASAP. They are never good together and to my memory, the only times either of them were good on a more consistent basis was when the other guy was a non-factor. IMO only thing they do is get in each other's way. Like today in 4th quarter, Dick's having a good game and we are in key stretch in the 4th, there's no viable reason to have Walter switched into the game. But even when one guy's playing real well, Darko's gotta put the other guy in there for obligatory 2 minutes not within flow of anything.

Just pick a guy and get the other guy out. Not like we don't have 3~4 other backup SG's to step in.

Might be my bad memory but when they're both on the floor it's disaster. Perhaps they'll use one of them and a pick as trade sweetener. Perhaps they wait till summer to see if they can lowball Ochai the offload one of them.

[YogurtProducer]

LMAOOOOOOOO

Relax man

Trae is a significantly better player than Poeltl

Let’s not be foolish

Not on the contract he has. I want no part of Trae, at this point in his career he is the worse player imo. Would not touch.

Trae if 5 years ago? Sure but he's not there anymore. Look at Hawks record with him in.
At this point in his career he should be a sixth man but he won't take that role.

Trae on an expiring contract is better than Poeltl’s situation of being paid 28mil for the next 3 years.

And talent wise Trae is severals tiers above Poeltl.

lol and then you’ll go back to complaining we don’t have a 5.

[PushDaRock]

It's not really a bad contract. He only has a player option next season that he will surely pick up at this point.

I'm interested in Trae because of the player option and the shorter term along with either a first round pick and/or Risacher. I can care less if he leaves a free agent. But we can clean up the cap sheet by getting off of IQ and/or Jak's contracts sooner.

I disagree, it's a bad trade in my opinion. You give a C which you need against big bodies, IQ (playable but overpaid) and a prospect in Dick for a professional loser (empty stats, what he gives you on O he loses on D).

I prefer we stand pat.

Only deal I'd consider is IQ, Ochai, Gradey + SRP Compensation

[YogurtProducer]

We started the game playing IQ off ball and had Barnes running the point. Of course as usual Barnes was passive trying to score but the offense ran night and day better than it does with IQ.

The shots IQ took, you need him to take, but man he needs to be accurate. That’s his only skill.

Yeah IQ wasn’t really initiating tonight and people are losing their minds over the assist #.

[YogurtProducer]

Ingram keeps gettimg better and better. There was definitely some risk when we got him but as the season goes on....we are benefitting from that decision more and more. This team was desperate for an offensive star and we got one.

CMB - we knew he was gonna be a gritty hustling post guy with great defense. What we didn't know for sure is how other parts of his game would translate. The thing that sticks out to me even when he hasnt had a big game.....is his PASSING. That is what has me more excited about him than anything else.

The second buggesr development of this season (second to BI) is the bench. Having Mamu, Shead and CMB bodes well. Then we can alternate between Dick and walter based on what's needed for the ninth spot in the playoff rotation.

Another game where IQ sits during crunchtime in addition to some curious body language between him and Darko/scotty in places. It could end up just being a temporary thing while he's struggling. But if there's a 3rd and 4th time....i wonder if that hints towards a trade.

I kinda feel bad for IQ. My impression was that he wasn't gonna be expected to run the offense as a traditional PG. And now he's getting benched for not flourishing in that role because they changed their minds about Barnes doing it. Barnes was visibly NOT pleased with IQ's play a couple times.

Just an observation but I just don't think the chemistry is there between IQ & Scottie. There's been multiple times throughout the season where you see Scottie visibly frustrated with IQ's decision making as a PG.

wait til he plays with Trae Young, he might just ask for a trade

And Scottie gets frustrating with everyone tbh

[mihaic]

Not on the contract he has. I want no part of Trae, at this point in his career he is the worse player imo. Would not touch.

Trae if 5 years ago? Sure but he's not there anymore. Look at Hawks record with him in.
At this point in his career he should be a sixth man but he won't take that role.

Trae on an expiring contract is better than Poeltl’s situation of being paid 28mil for the next 3 years.

And talent wise Trae is severals tiers above Poeltl.

lol and then you’ll go back to complaining we don’t have a 5.

Exactly.

[PushDaRock]

Walter is now -103 on the season.

Our next worse rotation guy is Ochai at -10.

Dick is +73....4th best on the team.

At some point isn't it clear that Walter is an issue and kills almost every lineup, regardless what he shoots from 3?

Don't care if it's Walter or Dick but we gotta get one of them outta here ASAP. They are never good together and to my memory, the only times either of them were good on a more consistent basis was when the other guy was a non-factor. IMO only thing they do is get in each other's way. Like today in 4th quarter, Dick's having a good game and we are in key stretch in the 4th, there's no viable reason to have Walter switched into the game. But even when one guy's playing real well, Darko's gotta put the other guy in there for obligatory 2 minutes not within flow of anything.

Just pick a guy and get the other guy out. Not like we don't have 3~4 other backup SG's to step in.

Agreed.

It's just so odd how their plus/minus is so different given Walter has a better 3pt%.

Gradey somehow wins his minutes when not with Walter. Walter seems to somehow always lose his regardless who he plays with.

Probably some reversion to the mean as well, last year Walter was pretty bad but still had some decent on court and on/off splits for a really bad team.

[Jerry Lucas]

It ends tonight when we sweep the hawks.

Doubling down on the jinx...insanity.

If we lose tonight it's going to be 100% your fault NinjaBro. Just like the Nuggets game the other day.

Pipe down.

https://forums.realgm.com/boards/viewtopic.php?p=119945038#p119945038

Going to be a tough decision tonight. Watch the Jays win the World Series for the first time in 32 years with a bunch of likeable underdog blue collar players that never gives up? Or watch the no defense, no pressure, lost and confused Raptors get blown out again tonight. Tough choice.

You are never going to be able to wash all this blood off your hands NinjaBro.

[YogurtProducer]

Ingram keeps gettimg better and better. There was definitely some risk when we got him but as the season goes on....we are benefitting from that decision more and more. This team was desperate for an offensive star and we got one.

CMB - we knew he was gonna be a gritty hustling post guy with great defense. What we didn't know for sure is how other parts of his game would translate. The thing that sticks out to me even when he hasnt had a big game.....is his PASSING. That is what has me more excited about him than anything else.

The second buggesr development of this season (second to BI) is the bench. Having Mamu, Shead and CMB bodes well. Then we can alternate between Dick and walter based on what's needed for the ninth spot in the playoff rotation.

Another game where IQ sits during crunchtime in addition to some curious body language between him and Darko/scotty in places. It could end up just being a temporary thing while he's struggling. But if there's a 3rd and 4th time....i wonder if that hints towards a trade.

I kinda feel bad for IQ. My impression was that he wasn't gonna be expected to run the offense as a traditional PG. And now he's getting benched for not flourishing in that role because they changed their minds about Barnes doing it. Barnes was visibly NOT pleased with IQ's play a couple times.

Just an observation but I just don't think the chemistry is there between IQ & Scottie. There's been multiple times throughout the season where you see Scottie visibly frustrated with IQ's decision making as a PG.

I hadn't really noticed it before tbh. But that play with 5 minutes left when IQ got kinda shoved out of bounds under the net and turned the ball over.....scott was near center court with his hands turned out the whole time and then motioned for IQ to have used his screen earlier in the play going up the court.

Shead subbed in around 30 seconds later. But it's also easy to read too much into this stuff.

id like to see the play again. I remember watching it thinking whoever was the close corner didn’t help the situation at all by not moving or cutting.

IQ kept his dribble alive but got kind of trapped due to that. But like I said, I haven’t been able to see a replay so I could be wrong

[PushDaRock]

I'm interested in Trae because of the player option and the shorter term along with either a first round pick and/or Risacher. I can care less if he leaves a free agent. But we can clean up the cap sheet by getting off of IQ and/or Jak's contracts sooner.

I disagree, it's a bad trade in my opinion. You give a C which you need against big bodies, IQ (playable but overpaid) and a prospect in Dick for a professional loser (empty stats, what he gives you on O he loses on D).

I prefer we stand pat.

Yeah it's a horrible trade because we lose so much size. You're not winning anything with Mamu as your starting C. I think Trae has little to no trade value and I wouldn't be surprised to see him get dealt for filler and a couple of highly protected picks.

I don't know why people would include Jak in any hypothetical trade, it would be IQ and our depth wings (Gradey and Ochai) IMO and then it comes down to draft comp. I would not include a FRP or pick swaps.