[Stein] - Hawks More Open To Trading Trae Young; Would Include Zaccharie Risacher In Right Deal

[PushDaRock]

I think there's some legit durability concerns with him. He's still never cracked 30 mpg before and he's at 234 games played over almost 4.5 ish years. Having a great season in the mins he does play though this year.

I don’t think he can be durable. He plays too hard lol, beyond reckless with his body.

He is compensating for lackadaisical D from Franz, Paolo etc. Alongside Scottie, CMB, BI, Yak, Shead, etc he'd put us legit in the top defensive teams in my opinion.

lol lumping Franz in there is weird

[Madvillainy2004]

I don’t think he can be durable. He plays too hard lol, beyond reckless with his body.

He is compensating for lackadaisical D from Franz, Paolo etc. Alongside Scottie, CMB, BI, Yak, Shead, etc he'd put us legit in the top defensive teams in my opinion.

lol lumping Franz in there is weird

Its not that he just plays too hard and his body might not be built for the NBA. Saying hes just compensating and would be healthy with us is just cope. He wont be on the court until mid-February

[HumbleRen]

I mean health is a pretty big thing here. IQ playing games is better than Suggs sitting on the bench.

I mean sure IQ leads us in touches, but he is actually 4th in front court touches. A lot of IQ's "touches" are him simply dribbling the ball up and passing it to get us into our actual action. Front court touches are:

Ingram - 39.3
Barnes - 37.5
RJ - 29.5
IQ - 28.5

Sure, but why is this put on IQ's shoulders? The bottom 3 offence has a lot more to do with us having 40% of our starting lineup missing for pretty much the entire month and our team (including IQ) just going ice cold from 3.

To me it feels like IQ is getting held to some weirdly high bar. I think people see "$32.5M" and are stuck in 2010 and think that is all-star money.

It’s only an issue because he’s just not simply good at being a PG lmao. His touches are basically empty touches, it doesn’t lead to anything.

But what is the issue exactly? Our offence for the most part is not initiated or ran by IQ because we have players like Ingram and Barnes at the 3 and 4 who are pretty good initiators and playmakers for their positions.

But his deficiencies as a PG are vastly overstated on this board. What PG are you getting to replace IQ that is going to "be good at being a PG" that makes a difference? Oh yeah, and don't forget he also is our best shooter and is still a solid defender at the 1.

You literally are just complaining he is not an all-star caliber player. Because if you get an upgrade on IQ that is what you are asking for.

I mean he’s a good player, just not what we need from our guard.

He has less than 10 assists when he’s touched the paint this year. You know how bad that is for an offence that barely has any rim pressure? It’s not really his fault but on a team that has BI and Scottie, we need any semblance of rim pressure and IQ just doesn’t provide that.

It’s why Shead looks so much better when that his numbers show because he can create an advantage by getting past his defender and touch the paint despite being an abysmal rim finisher and shooter.

We’ve been bottom 3 in offence when RJ has been out, it’s not because RJ is an offensive god but because he’s our only guard that can consistently apply rim pressure.

[MessiahUjiri]

It’s only an issue because he’s just not simply good at being a PG lmao. His touches are basically empty touches, it doesn’t lead to anything.

But what is the issue exactly? Our offence for the most part is not initiated or ran by IQ because we have players like Ingram and Barnes at the 3 and 4 who are pretty good initiators and playmakers for their positions.

But his deficiencies as a PG are vastly overstated on this board. What PG are you getting to replace IQ that is going to "be good at being a PG" that makes a difference? Oh yeah, and don't forget he also is our best shooter and is still a solid defender at the 1.

You literally are just complaining he is not an all-star caliber player. Because if you get an upgrade on IQ that is what you are asking for.

I mean he’s a good player, just not what we need from our guard.

He has less than 10 assists when he’s touched the paint this year. You know how bad that is for an offence that barely has any rim pressure? It’s not really his fault but on a team that has BI and Scottie, we need any semblance of rim pressure and IQ just doesn’t provide that.

It’s why Shead looks so much better when that his numbers show because he can create an advantage by getting past his defender and touch the paint despite being an abysmal rim finisher and shooter.

We’ve been bottom 3 in offence when RJ has been out, it’s not because RJ is an offensive god but because he’s our only guard that can consistently apply rim pressure.

Actually your stat proves the opposite, and shows precisely why Trae would be good. We don’t need him to touch the paint. He is a floor stretcher all the way to mid court. Let Scottie / BI / CMB do the damage by making it easier on them.


The only drawback on Trae will be his contract status. If we can guarantee to have him opt in, then we atleast have him for 2 years, and it’s worth the trade because he’s a top 10 offensive guard.


BI has played a significant amount of mins at SG, so try him there. Run something like:


Trae / BI / Scottie / CMB / Mamu


I think that would be the plan for a significant chunk of mins. CMB+Scottie covers the defensive side.

[YogurtProducer]

I mean he’s a good player, just not what we need from our guard.

He has less than 10 assists when he’s touched the paint this year. You know how bad that is for an offence that barely has any rim pressure? It’s not really his fault but on a team that has BI and Scottie, we need any semblance of rim pressure and IQ just doesn’t provide that.

Can you send me a link to that? Interested to play around there.

We’ve been bottom 3 in offence when RJ has been out, it’s not because RJ is an offensive god but because he’s our only guard that can consistently apply rim pressure.

Sure - but again this is not a solely an IQ issue. Why isn't BI or Barnes getting us paint touches?

[PushDaRock]

It’s only an issue because he’s just not simply good at being a PG lmao. His touches are basically empty touches, it doesn’t lead to anything.

But what is the issue exactly? Our offence for the most part is not initiated or ran by IQ because we have players like Ingram and Barnes at the 3 and 4 who are pretty good initiators and playmakers for their positions.

But his deficiencies as a PG are vastly overstated on this board. What PG are you getting to replace IQ that is going to "be good at being a PG" that makes a difference? Oh yeah, and don't forget he also is our best shooter and is still a solid defender at the 1.

You literally are just complaining he is not an all-star caliber player. Because if you get an upgrade on IQ that is what you are asking for.

I mean he’s a good player, just not what we need from our guard.

He has less than 10 assists when he’s touched the paint this year. You know how bad that is for an offence that barely has any rim pressure? It’s not really his fault but on a team that has BI and Scottie, we need any semblance of rim pressure and IQ just doesn’t provide that.

It’s why Shead looks so much better when that his numbers show because he can create an advantage by getting past his defender and touch the paint despite being an abysmal rim finisher and shooter.

We’ve been bottom 3 in offence when RJ has been out, it’s not because RJ is an offensive god but because he’s our only guard that can consistently apply rim pressure.

It's hard to have it all from one player. If you have a PG that can generate rim pressure and make 3's on high volume, what caliber player are we talking about there?

[YogurtProducer]

But what is the issue exactly? Our offence for the most part is not initiated or ran by IQ because we have players like Ingram and Barnes at the 3 and 4 who are pretty good initiators and playmakers for their positions.

But his deficiencies as a PG are vastly overstated on this board. What PG are you getting to replace IQ that is going to "be good at being a PG" that makes a difference? Oh yeah, and don't forget he also is our best shooter and is still a solid defender at the 1.

You literally are just complaining he is not an all-star caliber player. Because if you get an upgrade on IQ that is what you are asking for.

I mean he’s a good player, just not what we need from our guard.

He has less than 10 assists when he’s touched the paint this year. You know how bad that is for an offence that barely has any rim pressure? It’s not really his fault but on a team that has BI and Scottie, we need any semblance of rim pressure and IQ just doesn’t provide that.

It’s why Shead looks so much better when that his numbers show because he can create an advantage by getting past his defender and touch the paint despite being an abysmal rim finisher and shooter.

We’ve been bottom 3 in offence when RJ has been out, it’s not because RJ is an offensive god but because he’s our only guard that can consistently apply rim pressure.

It's hard to have it all from one player. If you have a PG that can generate rim pressure and make 3's on high volume, what caliber player are we talking about there?

Which is exactly my point.

That is damn near an all-nba quality player who is making $50M a year.

I know its unpopular, but IQ's ability to shoot the 3 is more important than anything else. And then you got Shead who is a perfect compliment because they do other things well than the other. But you need both. Without IQ, Shead will be completely exposed when he is playing 32mpg and he no longer can be the bulldog defender who gets into the paint a ton because the human body can only do so much.

[sbsat]

But what is the issue exactly? Our offence for the most part is not initiated or ran by IQ because we have players like Ingram and Barnes at the 3 and 4 who are pretty good initiators and playmakers for their positions.

But his deficiencies as a PG are vastly overstated on this board. What PG are you getting to replace IQ that is going to "be good at being a PG" that makes a difference? Oh yeah, and don't forget he also is our best shooter and is still a solid defender at the 1.

You literally are just complaining he is not an all-star caliber player. Because if you get an upgrade on IQ that is what you are asking for.

I mean he’s a good player, just not what we need from our guard.

He has less than 10 assists when he’s touched the paint this year. You know how bad that is for an offence that barely has any rim pressure? It’s not really his fault but on a team that has BI and Scottie, we need any semblance of rim pressure and IQ just doesn’t provide that.

It’s why Shead looks so much better when that his numbers show because he can create an advantage by getting past his defender and touch the paint despite being an abysmal rim finisher and shooter.

We’ve been bottom 3 in offence when RJ has been out, it’s not because RJ is an offensive god but because he’s our only guard that can consistently apply rim pressure.

Actually your stat proves the opposite, and shows precisely why Trae would be good. We don’t need him to touch the paint. He is a floor stretcher all the way to mid court. Let Scottie / BI / CMB do the damage by making it easier on them.


The only drawback on Trae will be his contract status. If we can guarantee to have him opt in, then we atleast have him for 2 years, and it’s worth the trade because he’s a top 10 offensive guard.


BI has played a significant amount of mins at SG, so try him there. Run something like:


Trae / BI / Scottie / CMB / Mamu


I think that would be the plan for a significant chunk of mins. CMB+Scottie covers the defensive side.

Trae's flailing numbers + player option really depresses his value. Could be a BI-esque cheap get. If IQ + Ochai + a FRP or 2 SRPs gets it done, maybe you do it. ATL will be motivated because it seems he'll walk end of the year

[YogurtProducer]

I mean he’s a good player, just not what we need from our guard.

He has less than 10 assists when he’s touched the paint this year. You know how bad that is for an offence that barely has any rim pressure? It’s not really his fault but on a team that has BI and Scottie, we need any semblance of rim pressure and IQ just doesn’t provide that.

It’s why Shead looks so much better when that his numbers show because he can create an advantage by getting past his defender and touch the paint despite being an abysmal rim finisher and shooter.

We’ve been bottom 3 in offence when RJ has been out, it’s not because RJ is an offensive god but because he’s our only guard that can consistently apply rim pressure.

Actually your stat proves the opposite, and shows precisely why Trae would be good. We don’t need him to touch the paint. He is a floor stretcher all the way to mid court. Let Scottie / BI / CMB do the damage by making it easier on them.


The only drawback on Trae will be his contract status. If we can guarantee to have him opt in, then we atleast have him for 2 years, and it’s worth the trade because he’s a top 10 offensive guard.


BI has played a significant amount of mins at SG, so try him there. Run something like:


Trae / BI / Scottie / CMB / Mamu


I think that would be the plan for a significant chunk of mins. CMB+Scottie covers the defensive side.

Trae's flailing numbers + player option really depresses his value. Could be a BI-esque cheap get. If IQ + Ochai + a FRP or 2 SRPs gets it done, maybe you do it. ATL will be motivated because it seems he'll walk end of the year

I mean I can kind of get behind Trae just because in theory that is some untapped potential that MIGHT break out.

But I also worry about the cost because if it is IQ, you need to add Ochai and Dick as salary, so you kind of thin out your rotation pretty quickly there.

Trae/Shead
RJ/Walter
Ingram/Battle
Barnes/CMB
Poeltl/Mamu

But any injuries and now you are looking to guys like Hepburn or Mogbo to play more minutes which is not preferable.


Not to mention, Trae's playstyle doesn't fit with the 0.5 offence we run. Could he adapt to be more off-ball in some situations and spam catch and shoot 3's? Not to mention, he becomes a huge target defensively for other teams to attack.

[FOB]

I want absolutely no part of Trae. To me it's a classic grass is greener situation, right now Trae is the (somewhat) shiny new toy that can be had for a moderate price. Once he's here it's all "he's a turnstile!", "he's a chucker!", "he dribbles the air out of the ball!", "he's overpaid!".

Give me IQ and that first any day of the week over Trae. Small, no-defense, ball-dominant guards that are paid like stars have no place in the current NBA, and I'd be shocked if our FO saw it differently.

[PushDaRock]

Actually your stat proves the opposite, and shows precisely why Trae would be good. We don’t need him to touch the paint. He is a floor stretcher all the way to mid court. Let Scottie / BI / CMB do the damage by making it easier on them.


The only drawback on Trae will be his contract status. If we can guarantee to have him opt in, then we atleast have him for 2 years, and it’s worth the trade because he’s a top 10 offensive guard.


BI has played a significant amount of mins at SG, so try him there. Run something like:


Trae / BI / Scottie / CMB / Mamu


I think that would be the plan for a significant chunk of mins. CMB+Scottie covers the defensive side.

Trae's flailing numbers + player option really depresses his value. Could be a BI-esque cheap get. If IQ + Ochai + a FRP or 2 SRPs gets it done, maybe you do it. ATL will be motivated because it seems he'll walk end of the year

I mean I can kind of get behind Trae just because in theory that is some untapped potential that MIGHT break out.

But I also worry about the cost because if it is IQ, you need to add Ochai and Dick as salary, so you kind of thin out your rotation pretty quickly there.

Trae/Shead
RJ/Walter
Ingram/Battle
Barnes/CMB
Poeltl/Mamu

But any injuries and now you are looking to guys like Hepburn or Mogbo to play more minutes which is not preferable.


Not to mention, Trae's playstyle doesn't fit with the 0.5 offence we run. Could he adapt to be more off-ball in some situations and spam catch and shoot 3's? Not to mention, he becomes a huge target defensively for other teams to attack.

It's a talent upgrade, but not the most ideal fit. I would consider the deal if it's that iteration and no FRP's or pick swaps going out, but I really don't like the ones that include RJ or Jak in them, losing 2 starters and getting back one doesn't make too much sense to me in a move like this.

[LoveMyRaps]

Do Bucks have the expiring contracts to trade for Trae?

Trae + Giannis is a pretty nice combo

[HumbleRen]

I mean he’s a good player, just not what we need from our guard.

He has less than 10 assists when he’s touched the paint this year. You know how bad that is for an offence that barely has any rim pressure? It’s not really his fault but on a team that has BI and Scottie, we need any semblance of rim pressure and IQ just doesn’t provide that.

Can you send me a link to that? Interested to play around there.

We’ve been bottom 3 in offence when RJ has been out, it’s not because RJ is an offensive god but because he’s our only guard that can consistently apply rim pressure.

Sure - but again this is not a solely an IQ issue. Why isn't BI or Barnes getting us paint touches?

Sure, lemme go get the Samson Folk article, he quoted it in there. As for Bi and Scottie? Well they’re just simply not good at it. Again, that’s why I’m not saying it’s IQ’s fault, he just happens to be more replaceable than BI and Scottie.

[YogurtProducer]

I mean he’s a good player, just not what we need from our guard.

He has less than 10 assists when he’s touched the paint this year. You know how bad that is for an offence that barely has any rim pressure? It’s not really his fault but on a team that has BI and Scottie, we need any semblance of rim pressure and IQ just doesn’t provide that.

Can you send me a link to that? Interested to play around there.

We’ve been bottom 3 in offence when RJ has been out, it’s not because RJ is an offensive god but because he’s our only guard that can consistently apply rim pressure.

Sure - but again this is not a solely an IQ issue. Why isn't BI or Barnes getting us paint touches?

Sure, lemme go get the Samson Folk article, he quoted it in there. As for Bi and Scottie? Well they’re just simply not good at it. Again, that’s why I’m not saying it’s IQ’s fault, he just happens to be more replaceable than BI and Scottie.

Fair enough yeah. I wonder if Samson has synergy and that’s not publicly available info

[HumbleRen]

But what is the issue exactly? Our offence for the most part is not initiated or ran by IQ because we have players like Ingram and Barnes at the 3 and 4 who are pretty good initiators and playmakers for their positions.

But his deficiencies as a PG are vastly overstated on this board. What PG are you getting to replace IQ that is going to "be good at being a PG" that makes a difference? Oh yeah, and don't forget he also is our best shooter and is still a solid defender at the 1.

You literally are just complaining he is not an all-star caliber player. Because if you get an upgrade on IQ that is what you are asking for.

I mean he’s a good player, just not what we need from our guard.

He has less than 10 assists when he’s touched the paint this year. You know how bad that is for an offence that barely has any rim pressure? It’s not really his fault but on a team that has BI and Scottie, we need any semblance of rim pressure and IQ just doesn’t provide that.

It’s why Shead looks so much better when that his numbers show because he can create an advantage by getting past his defender and touch the paint despite being an abysmal rim finisher and shooter.

We’ve been bottom 3 in offence when RJ has been out, it’s not because RJ is an offensive god but because he’s our only guard that can consistently apply rim pressure.

It's hard to have it all from one player. If you have a PG that can generate rim pressure and make 3's on high volume, what caliber player are we talking about there?

I agree but I think a guard who gets to the paint at will and have a high FTR is more beneficial to our offence than what IQ provides.

IQ on paper is great but he barely even shoots enough 3’s for it to mask his limitations as a lead guard.

I think what we gain with Trae on offence dwarfs what we lose from IQ being gone.

[HumbleRen]

Can you send me a link to that? Interested to play around there.

Sure - but again this is not a solely an IQ issue. Why isn't BI or Barnes getting us paint touches?

Sure, lemme go get the Samson Folk article, he quoted it in there. As for Bi and Scottie? Well they’re just simply not good at it. Again, that’s why I’m not saying it’s IQ’s fault, he just happens to be more replaceable than BI and Scottie.

Fair enough yeah. I wonder if Samson has synergy and that’s not publicly available info

Yeah he has access to synergy. It’s kinda why he’s very low on IQ. He constantly talks about how bad synergy paints him to be as a lead guard.

[YogurtProducer]

I agree but I think a guard who gets to the paint at will and have a high FTR is more beneficial to our offence than what IQ provides.

I kind of disagree there. With BI/Barnes/Poeltl as your 3/4/5 you NEED a great shooter at the 1, especially when RJ at the 2 is not great himself. 3 point shooting is arguably the most important skill we need our 1 to have.

IQ on paper is great but he barely even shoots enough 3’s for it to mask his limitations as a lead guard.

He is 36th in the league in 3 point volume and was even higher last year. He has even been trending upwards lately.

[MEDIC]

Trae is definitely not the direction this franchise needs to go.

The only reasons I would do this trade:

1. Get out of IQ's contract & start looking for our future PG
2. It would be fun/ entertaining

I think 2 years of Young could buy time for Shead's development as well. If Shead doesn't progress, then you look for a new lead guard. Young's contract will be a massive expiring, so it may help you find that new lead PG.

And of course, there is the chance that Young is "that guy". I don't think he is.......there is only one ball & a lot of mouths to feed.......and of course there's the defense.

I think the perfect PG for this team is one that doesn't need a lot of shots, plays high calible defense & can get paint touches. Basically a slightly taller version of Shead....that can shoot 3's a little better. If Shead can become a 36% shooter......maybe he becomes that guy.

If IQ could get his own paint touches or play elite on ball defense, I would be a much bigger fan.

[ArthurVandelay]

I want absolutely no part of Trae. To me it's a classic grass is greener situation, right now Trae is the (somewhat) shiny new toy that can be had for a moderate price. Once he's here it's all "he's a turnstile!", "he's a chucker!", "he dribbles the air out of the ball!", "he's overpaid!".

Give me IQ and that first any day of the week over Trae. Small, no-defense, ball-dominant guards that are paid like stars have no place in the current NBA, and I'd be shocked if our FO saw it differently.

Don't forget RJ and BI came here as higher usage players with flaws in their game.

I think there is a better, more efficient version of Trae young than we have seen. Whatever team gets him is going to have the extension locked up. Trae is going to have a lot of doubters to prove wrong.

He'd be pretty exciting on this team. No more Barnes and 4 subs. Someone who gets to the line 8 times per game. A threat to shoot from anywhere. Someone who can get to wherever they want on the floor.

If you're getting him and shedding poorly aging contracts or guys who aren't in long term plans and no firsts, it is a gamble worth taking in my opinion. It is a move right up there with BI.

[God Squad]

It'll be interesting to see if our name pops up in the whole Trae saga within the next 24 hours.
Hawks FO was in Toronto for the past 72+ hours. Talks must've taken place, and if the interest is legit, it'll be revealed.

If Stein (or heck even his disciple Fischer) links the Raps to Trae - it's very legit.

I thought the Trae and Toronto were another smoke screen. But after seeing Scottie and Trae, I'm not so sure.