PG: Raptors gut out a resilient win

[OakleyDokely]

Mogbo can be a difference maker in terms of rebounding and defending but he needs to find something that works on offense. My worry is that he doesn't and he runs out of chances.

[Duffman100]

Mogbo can be a difference maker in terms of rebounding and defending but he needs to find something that works on offense. My worry is that he doesn't and he runs out of chances.

I'm just not sure I see it. His defense is okay, but not good enough. His rebounding is okay, but not good enough. I feel like he's too weak to compete at the 4/5, especially after watching CMB.

[Godaddycurse]

Mogbo can be a difference maker in terms of rebounding and defending but he needs to find something that works on offense. My worry is that he doesn't and he runs out of chances.

Might be small sample size but he seems like our 2nd best screener after Poeltl.

[shmoosicle]

Three stars of the game:

1) Mamu
2) Scottie
3) Ingram

HM: Quickley

Bench needs to be a lot better moving forward.

I mean when we're healthy the bench has Mamu, Shead, CMB and Walter which isn't bad at all. Looking at the personnel on our team we'll probably never be 100% healthy but having even 2 of our 4 rotation players back would go a long way.

There is definitely a logjam between Walter/Dick/Agbaji/Battle though.

[theonlyeastcoastrapsfan]

I dont see anyting wrong from his post. The salary situation is just going to get worse unless we give up asset.

As for his point on our easy schedule, I dont think anyone can argue this. I think we can see how we play the next 10 games against the elites (I assume we will have injuries in those loses).

So far I see we are good against small lineup teams with 4 shooters spacing for Barnes at C, we shall see if that works in the long term.

I get it, it's different strokes for different folks. We all want the same thing. I do enjoy the season, and want the best for the Raps. I think some people just don't want to look under the hood. Im a hood looker. But even if I annoy you, you need people to also be willing to be constructively critical. It's healthy.

We're all on the most active and in depth Raptors forum on the internet. Which means the majority of us are diehard NBA fans. We're all looking under the hood, not just you.

The disagreement comes with looking under the hood with an of optimism or pessimism.

There are degrees of objectivity- like I’m optimistic about what I see to be optimistic about. I’m pessimistic about the things I think are not good. I don’t enjoy reading glazing pieces unless I actually believe them. And I don’t believe all raps good news and disbelieve bad news - I’m bait saying others are not objective - but it’ll say I don’t get how you don’t objectively see the same issues. The self inflicted wounds putting a ceiling on where this group can go. I’d love to talk more about what a revelation Shead has been as a 45th pick - but the lack of centre depth, glut of SG’s seems more pressing. I dont understand the downplaying of importance of a pg to the offense - nor do I understand letting teams with big frontcourts demolish us.

Very often after a bad game raps media will preach patience, and then after one good one, be like now apologize - like that level of if it’s good buy in, and if it’s bad deflect is wasted time, imo. Find the truth, Ruth. Or try to.

[TheGeneral99]

Lol check out Jamal Shead's Instagram, he posted a hilarious story of that dude on the Kings Dylan Cardwell getting the crowd hyped last night when they were down big in the 4th.

Major trolling.

[Duffman100]

I get it, it's different strokes for different folks. We all want the same thing. I do enjoy the season, and want the best for the Raps. I think some people just don't want to look under the hood. Im a hood looker. But even if I annoy you, you need people to also be willing to be constructively critical. It's healthy.

We're all on the most active and in depth Raptors forum on the internet. Which means the majority of us are diehard NBA fans. We're all looking under the hood, not just you.

The disagreement comes with looking under the hood with an of optimism or pessimism.

There are degrees of objectivity- like I’m optimistic about what I see to be optimistic about. I’m pessimistic about the things I think are not good. I don’t enjoy reading glazing pieces unless I actually believe them. And I don’t believe all raps good news and disbelieve bad news - I’m bait saying others are not objective - but it’ll say I don’t get how you don’t objectively see the same issues. The self inflicted wounds putting a ceiling on where this group can go. I’d love to talk more about what a revelation Shead has been as a 45th pick - but the lack of centre depth, glut of SG’s seems more pressing. I dont understand the downplaying of importance of a pg to the offense - nor do I understand letting teams with big frontcourts demolish us.

Very often after a bad game raps media will preach patience, and then after one good one, be like now apologize - like that level of if it’s good buy in, and if it’s bad deflect is wasted time, imo. Find the truth, Ruth. Or try to.

Of course you should have patience after a bad game... it's a single game. You should always have the Macro view of the team. And so far this season, the macro view is we're doing quite well.

I see the issue around Poeltl, it was a weird extension to make. It's definitely hurting us now and hopefully he can make it back to giving us production. But I don't see the 'we only have this year and next'. A lot changes in the NBA quickly.

[kalel123]

Mogbo can be a difference maker in terms of rebounding and defending but he needs to find something that works on offense. My worry is that he doesn't and he runs out of chances.

I'm just not sure I see it. His defense is okay, but not good enough. His rebounding is okay, but not good enough. I feel like he's too weak to compete at the 4/5, especially after watching CMB.

Feel like dude lacks the bulk to play the 4/5, lacks the athleticism to make up for it, and lacks the skills to play any other position. He looked regressed defensively especially earlier in the game.

[TheGeneral99]

We're all on the most active and in depth Raptors forum on the internet. Which means the majority of us are diehard NBA fans. We're all looking under the hood, not just you.

The disagreement comes with looking under the hood with an of optimism or pessimism.

There are degrees of objectivity- like I’m optimistic about what I see to be optimistic about. I’m pessimistic about the things I think are not good. I don’t enjoy reading glazing pieces unless I actually believe them. And I don’t believe all raps good news and disbelieve bad news - I’m bait saying others are not objective - but it’ll say I don’t get how you don’t objectively see the same issues. The self inflicted wounds putting a ceiling on where this group can go. I’d love to talk more about what a revelation Shead has been as a 45th pick - but the lack of centre depth, glut of SG’s seems more pressing. I dont understand the downplaying of importance of a pg to the offense - nor do I understand letting teams with big frontcourts demolish us.

Very often after a bad game raps media will preach patience, and then after one good one, be like now apologize - like that level of if it’s good buy in, and if it’s bad deflect is wasted time, imo. Find the truth, Ruth. Or try to.

Of course you should have patience after a bad game... it's a single game. You should always have the Macro view of the team. And so far this season, the macro view is we're doing quite well.

I see the issue around Poeltl, it was a weird extension to make. It's definitely hurting us now and hopefully he can make it back to giving us production. But I don't see the 'we only have this year and next'. A lot changes in the NBA quickly.

Poeltl was relatively healthy his entire career until the last couple seasons.

He played 69 games in 2021, 68 in 2022 and 72 in 2023...there was no reason to think he would suddenly have a chronic back injury plaguing him.

[PushDaRock]

That Kings lineup man. They looked at .500 bulls teams and said we need some of that and let's sprinkle in 45 year old Westbrook. Sitting through that as a Kings fan has to be a form of torture.

Westbrook is hardly at fault lol. He’s a minimum contract player that leads them in total rebounds, assists and steals.

They were doomed the moment they got Demar.

The fact people saw Demar fail time after time and still thought "maybe he won't with us" is wild.

The guy should have been a bench gunner for a contender and experienced some success. Instead he chose to just make an extra few million on top of his $300M+ and be a starter instead of winning 6MOTY or something on a good team.

Ring Chasing vs Padding his Scoring Totals, I don't know that either option would be looked at too fondly.

[Duffman100]

There are degrees of objectivity- like I’m optimistic about what I see to be optimistic about. I’m pessimistic about the things I think are not good. I don’t enjoy reading glazing pieces unless I actually believe them. And I don’t believe all raps good news and disbelieve bad news - I’m bait saying others are not objective - but it’ll say I don’t get how you don’t objectively see the same issues. The self inflicted wounds putting a ceiling on where this group can go. I’d love to talk more about what a revelation Shead has been as a 45th pick - but the lack of centre depth, glut of SG’s seems more pressing. I dont understand the downplaying of importance of a pg to the offense - nor do I understand letting teams with big frontcourts demolish us.

Very often after a bad game raps media will preach patience, and then after one good one, be like now apologize - like that level of if it’s good buy in, and if it’s bad deflect is wasted time, imo. Find the truth, Ruth. Or try to.

Of course you should have patience after a bad game... it's a single game. You should always have the Macro view of the team. And so far this season, the macro view is we're doing quite well.

I see the issue around Poeltl, it was a weird extension to make. It's definitely hurting us now and hopefully he can make it back to giving us production. But I don't see the 'we only have this year and next'. A lot changes in the NBA quickly.

Poeltl was relatively healthy his entire career until the last couple seasons.

He played 69 games in 2021, 68 in 2022 and 72 in 2023...there was no reason to think he would suddenly have a chronic back injury plaguing him.

Yup, let's hope that's the case. I still find the early extension strange, curious what the story is there.

The other possibility is it is a chronic back injury that ends his career early. What happens then, does his contract come off our books cap wise with insurance paying it?

[theonlyeastcoastrapsfan]

There are degrees of objectivity- like I’m optimistic about what I see to be optimistic about. I’m pessimistic about the things I think are not good. I don’t enjoy reading glazing pieces unless I actually believe them. And I don’t believe all raps good news and disbelieve bad news - I’m bait saying others are not objective - but it’ll say I don’t get how you don’t objectively see the same issues. The self inflicted wounds putting a ceiling on where this group can go. I’d love to talk more about what a revelation Shead has been as a 45th pick - but the lack of centre depth, glut of SG’s seems more pressing. I dont understand the downplaying of importance of a pg to the offense - nor do I understand letting teams with big frontcourts demolish us.

Very often after a bad game raps media will preach patience, and then after one good one, be like now apologize - like that level of if it’s good buy in, and if it’s bad deflect is wasted time, imo. Find the truth, Ruth. Or try to.

Of course you should have patience after a bad game... it's a single game. You should always have the Macro view of the team. And so far this season, the macro view is we're doing quite well.

I see the issue around Poeltl, it was a weird extension to make. It's definitely hurting us now and hopefully he can make it back to giving us production. But I don't see the 'we only have this year and next'. A lot changes in the NBA quickly.

Poeltl was relatively healthy his entire career until the last couple seasons.

He played 69 games in 2021, 68 in 2022 and 72 in 2023...there was no reason to think he would suddenly have a chronic back injury plaguing him.

Except he likely had it when we signed the deal. think of the timeframe Or he got in playing for Austria, which perhaps the early extension enabled. If there was report of a freak collision and now Jacob is hurt, I could understand - but there was never any event that I remember. I recall talks of an illness, issues with a mask from training camp and pre-seaon - seemed like he didnt take part in a lot of that. Now that seems like not wanting to talk about back. then he came out and looked like ass, and we're like wth? then they say there's some back issues, he's just not himself today, just needs two weeks rest. then when they had two weeks to rest him over NBA cup tourney they didnt. since then he's played 6 min since mid December with no update. He's not with the team and they aren't saying much about it. It does feel like the media around the team don't actually expect him back and when they ask for updates team just says no.

It is a very important factor as the only true C and 7 footer on the roster - and we don't have the flexibility to get another. I don't get why with that the timeline, people just say, well fluke accident - when A) he was under contract to us and we should have known more than anyone what his health was. and B) we did not need to give him that extension, it was actually a two years early. You bet against injury risk by doing that- and we were burnt before the ink was dry. As good as the seasons been, that decision making is horrendous. But that and Mamu are the only things - since Bobby took over, to point to, and the long term drag of Poeltl is not erased by giving Mamu a one year deal. Still points to hurting this team more than helping it despite our current place in the standings.

[NinjaBro]

Won back to back games with a ton of injuries, not too shabby

[YogurtProducer]

Westbrook is hardly at fault lol. He’s a minimum contract player that leads them in total rebounds, assists and steals.

They were doomed the moment they got Demar.

The fact people saw Demar fail time after time and still thought "maybe he won't with us" is wild.

The guy should have been a bench gunner for a contender and experienced some success. Instead he chose to just make an extra few million on top of his $300M+ and be a starter instead of winning 6MOTY or something on a good team.

Ring Chasing vs Padding his Scoring Totals, I don't know that either option would be looked at too fondly.

I don't think if Demar signed a $15M deal with someone to come of the bench would be looked at poorly.

Everyone knows he isn't a star. Does anyone look down at any vet who eventually takes a lesser role?

IMO - his legacy would have been improved had he won a ring as a key rotational piece. Look at Iggy. Sure he still started, but he took a massive reduced role to win. And his legacy is way better now than had he just stayed somewhere else and scored 17ppg for the rest of his career on bad teams

[YogurtProducer]

Except he likely had it when we signed the deal. .

So you think we didnt do a physical?

[HumbleRen]

The fact people saw Demar fail time after time and still thought "maybe he won't with us" is wild.

The guy should have been a bench gunner for a contender and experienced some success. Instead he chose to just make an extra few million on top of his $300M+ and be a starter instead of winning 6MOTY or something on a good team.

Ring Chasing vs Padding his Scoring Totals, I don't know that either option would be looked at too fondly.

I don't think if Demar signed a $15M deal with someone to come of the bench would be looked at poorly.

Everyone knows he isn't a star. Does anyone look down at any vet who eventually takes a lesser role?

IMO - his legacy would have been improved had he won a ring as a key rotational piece. Look at Iggy. Sure he still started, but he took a massive reduced role to win. And his legacy is way better now than had he just stayed somewhere else and scored 17ppg for the rest of his career on bad teams

I think you guys overestimate how much interest contenders have for Demar.

I don’t think a single one would sign him for 15M a year lol.

[PushDaRock]

The fact people saw Demar fail time after time and still thought "maybe he won't with us" is wild.

The guy should have been a bench gunner for a contender and experienced some success. Instead he chose to just make an extra few million on top of his $300M+ and be a starter instead of winning 6MOTY or something on a good team.

Ring Chasing vs Padding his Scoring Totals, I don't know that either option would be looked at too fondly.

I don't think if Demar signed a $15M deal with someone to come of the bench would be looked at poorly.

Everyone knows he isn't a star. Does anyone look down at any vet who eventually takes a lesser role?

IMO - his legacy would have been improved had he won a ring as a key rotational piece.

What good team can really afford to pay him 15m to come off the bench?

Would he have been a key rotational piece for anyone?

[theonlyeastcoastrapsfan]

?
How do people think Bobby spends his day, after he watches his buddy Shultz on Flagrant, does he just admire where we are in the standings or does he work his ass off trying to think of how we can improve. I hope he's doing the latter and putting himself through hell trying to fix the mixtakes in order to provide a higher ceiling.

There is evidence they are still trying hard to make a big trade. I think it's clear it's the latter. They trying to go for Ja, AD, Sabonis, thet tried Trae too.

It worries me they may go hard after Sabonis. I have seen Darko talking to him and embracing him after the game. His salary is like IQ's: overpaid. Perhaps I am wrong but I think trading for him doesn’t make us much better, and we are stuck with him after, I hope Kings don't like our trade package.

Im sure they are trying, but who's gonna want what were offering with out alot of draft capital and whose worth it that's available? And its not rocket science that they are having a hard time. While many here don't see it the IQ and Poeltl deals were said to be headscratchers at the time. I mean its been said, but IQ's deal created a cascade of impacts for other RFA's and GM's being such an overpay that it messed up the market, and according to a recent Darko interview, they are asking him to do something he's never done before which is to play PG. its no wonder he's stuggling. We gave a 30 year old big a two year extension two years too early - where is the benfiet to the the raps in that? Im not against IQ, we should feature him more at what he's good at. Im against not having good pg play, so I like Shead playing more often. They have to figure out what to do with RJ, Gradey Walter, because if were trying to win, Shead will only play more, not less.

[PushDaRock]

Ring Chasing vs Padding his Scoring Totals, I don't know that either option would be looked at too fondly.

I don't think if Demar signed a $15M deal with someone to come of the bench would be looked at poorly.

Everyone knows he isn't a star. Does anyone look down at any vet who eventually takes a lesser role?

IMO - his legacy would have been improved had he won a ring as a key rotational piece. Look at Iggy. Sure he still started, but he took a massive reduced role to win. And his legacy is way better now than had he just stayed somewhere else and scored 17ppg for the rest of his career on bad teams

I think you guys overestimate how much interest contenders have for Demar.

I don’t think a single one would sign him for 15M a year lol.

I think they would take him on a vet min or low level exception.

[theonlyeastcoastrapsfan]

Except he likely had it when we signed the deal. .

So you think we didnt do a physical?

If they did, they didnt check his back. or they signed him anyway. When did he hurt himself? was it one time thing or wear and tear over years. Sounds like wear and tear, but Im all ears for anyone who knows when he got hurt.