Moderators: Marcus, Duke4life831
JMAC3 wrote:Laughing at seeing people suggest he should go as 5th to the Clippers now. What could go wrong picking a guy that was ranked 10th-25th a week ago based purely on positional need....
Upperclass wrote:I would draft him before Wagler, Mikel Brown, Ament, Burries, Yaxel.. Would draft him after Kingston, Philon, Steinbach depending on team needs. He's an impact starting center for someone.
King Ken wrote:Upperclass wrote:I would draft him before Wagler, Mikel Brown, Ament, Burries, Yaxel.. Would draft him after Kingston, Philon, Steinbach depending on team needs. He's an impact starting center for someone.
How?
Upperclass wrote:King Ken wrote:Upperclass wrote:I would draft him before Wagler, Mikel Brown, Ament, Burries, Yaxel.. Would draft him after Kingston, Philon, Steinbach depending on team needs. He's an impact starting center for someone.
How?
He thinks faster than the player guarding him on O, moves well enough to slow drives on D
JMAC3 wrote:It is funny someone posts a random video of him doing a drill and it is positioned that he did well in it.
24 inch no-step vert 71/71 participants
28 inch max vert 71/71 participants
3.36 Shuttle Run 70/71 participants
3.61 3/4 sprint 71/71 participants
11.47 Pro Lane 62/70 participants
BigGargamel wrote:I'm seeing top ten talk. I really thought the league got smarter, when it came to drafting tall stiffs way too early. But I guess the league just can't help itself. The temptation is always too big, no pun intended.
Like, I think he would make sense for Charlotte at 14. They have two picks in the first round, a lot of scorers, Diabate is an energy big. Mara can provide a few things as a backup/change of pace with Kalkbrenner. But you put in in the top ten, you are expecting way more than I think he is capable of. He's been at this for three years. He's a backup. I don't understand it, but I don't run an NBA team.
FarBeyondDriven wrote:BigGargamel wrote:I'm seeing top ten talk. I really thought the league got smarter, when it came to drafting tall stiffs way too early. But I guess the league just can't help itself. The temptation is always too big, no pun intended.
Like, I think he would make sense for Charlotte at 14. They have two picks in the first round, a lot of scorers, Diabate is an energy big. Mara can provide a few things as a backup/change of pace with Kalkbrenner. But you put in in the top ten, you are expecting way more than I think he is capable of. He's been at this for three years. He's a backup. I don't understand it, but I don't run an NBA team.
it's because you can run the offense through him since he's such a great passer. This brings centers out to defend him and he's able to deliver the ball to guys cutting off screens. There's not a lot of centers that can do that while also being a shot-blocking presence and also able to adequately defend on switches.
tmorgan wrote:FarBeyondDriven wrote:BigGargamel wrote:I'm seeing top ten talk. I really thought the league got smarter, when it came to drafting tall stiffs way too early. But I guess the league just can't help itself. The temptation is always too big, no pun intended.
Like, I think he would make sense for Charlotte at 14. They have two picks in the first round, a lot of scorers, Diabate is an energy big. Mara can provide a few things as a backup/change of pace with Kalkbrenner. But you put in in the top ten, you are expecting way more than I think he is capable of. He's been at this for three years. He's a backup. I don't understand it, but I don't run an NBA team.
it's because you can run the offense through him since he's such a great passer. This brings centers out to defend him and he's able to deliver the ball to guys cutting off screens. There's not a lot of centers that can do that while also being a shot-blocking presence and also able to adequately defend on switches.
So I’m reading this as you think Mara can defend on switches? Are we watching the same player here?
Believe me, I hope I’m wrong. More successful Wolverines in the NBA is nothing but positive for me. But I sure don’t see it.
BigGargamel wrote:I'm seeing top ten talk. I really thought the league got smarter, when it came to drafting tall stiffs way too early. But I guess the league just can't help itself. The temptation is always too big, no pun intended.
Like, I think he would make sense for Charlotte at 14. They have two picks in the first round, a lot of scorers, Diabate is an energy big. Mara can provide a few things as a backup/change of pace with Kalkbrenner. But you put in in the top ten, you are expecting way more than I think he is capable of. He's been at this for three years. He's a backup. I don't understand it, but I don't run an NBA team.
FarBeyondDriven wrote:tmorgan wrote:FarBeyondDriven wrote:
it's because you can run the offense through him since he's such a great passer. This brings centers out to defend him and he's able to deliver the ball to guys cutting off screens. There's not a lot of centers that can do that while also being a shot-blocking presence and also able to adequately defend on switches.
So I’m reading this as you think Mara can defend on switches? Are we watching the same player here?
Believe me, I hope I’m wrong. More successful Wolverines in the NBA is nothing but positive for me. But I sure don’t see it.
I think his ability to defend on switches was proven by watching this past season. Obviously pros is a different level but the agility drill backs that up. Remember, he's 7'3" with a 7'6" WS at 260 lbs. He doesn't need mirror step for step as his length will make up some lost distance. He's no worse than any of the aforementioned bigs taken recently so it shouldn't be considered a negative. His negatives are his lack of athleticism and conditioning mostly in regards to transition but with both he's made progress steadily so far so they might not be negatives for too much longer.
King Ken wrote:FarBeyondDriven wrote:tmorgan wrote:
So I’m reading this as you think Mara can defend on switches? Are we watching the same player here?
Believe me, I hope I’m wrong. More successful Wolverines in the NBA is nothing but positive for me. But I sure don’t see it.
I think his ability to defend on switches was proven by watching this past season. Obviously pros is a different level but the agility drill backs that up. Remember, he's 7'3" with a 7'6" WS at 260 lbs. He doesn't need mirror step for step as his length will make up some lost distance. He's no worse than any of the aforementioned bigs taken recently so it shouldn't be considered a negative. His negatives are his lack of athleticism and conditioning mostly in regards to transition but with both he's made progress steadily so far so they might not be negatives for too much longer.
Ya'll really gotta watch film better. There is nothing on film that gives me confidence about his ability to switch. Transition on switches, yes because of his tremendous fluidity for his size but he's slow. If he's on me as a quality perimeter NBA guard, I am stopping everything and doing straight up iso right then and there as he's food for even the Gleague guards who get 10 days on isos. He simply lacks too much athleticism and he has a weaker base than his peers that some have mentioned like Clingan much less the Eastern Europeans and his own country man, Marc Gasol. His body type is similar to Santi Aldama. He just doesn't have a body you want from a NBA center. Too many people are confusing that he's the most fluid super big since Wemby with he's athletic for his size when he's not. Then you add the lack of core and physical strength and there are major issues here for a player being considered by some as a lottery pick.
NBA players are smart. You saw how Naz Reid attacked Wemby base on that drive last night. This is Wemby, easily the goat defensively in NBA history even at this stage because no one has his ability, agility, length, size, athleticism, and feel in a package of one. I really think people are confusing Mara being a smooth mover with a natural gait with this is a good athlete. Look how natural he moves. He's not clunky like Clingan and he's not extremely clunky like Edey. He's smooth type like Gobert when people miss that Gobert is a tremendous athlete for his size. His lateral movements have always been rare. It was just his body and core strength catching up to his ability as a prospect that was the issue.
Mara is like Shelden Williams for me. They have obvious games that are clear if you have good scouting eyes. If your idea is an eventual backup big playing 12-15 mpg and you want rim rolling paint protector who's not impactful but can produce, this is your guy. Some teams need that.
If you need him to be a true rotation piece or an impact player even in limited minutes, you better pass on him.
Too many red flags on film for NBA translation. Especially on defense. Offensively, most of this translates based on film. I really don't have any issues on that end but I also don't think he's worth a lottery pick based on that end as well.
His base and his core is my biggest issue. You can't be slow and a weaker big. It doesn't work no matter how good your brain is.
Upperclass wrote:King Ken wrote:FarBeyondDriven wrote:
I think his ability to defend on switches was proven by watching this past season. Obviously pros is a different level but the agility drill backs that up. Remember, he's 7'3" with a 7'6" WS at 260 lbs. He doesn't need mirror step for step as his length will make up some lost distance. He's no worse than any of the aforementioned bigs taken recently so it shouldn't be considered a negative. His negatives are his lack of athleticism and conditioning mostly in regards to transition but with both he's made progress steadily so far so they might not be negatives for too much longer.
Ya'll really gotta watch film better. There is nothing on film that gives me confidence about his ability to switch. Transition on switches, yes because of his tremendous fluidity for his size but he's slow. If he's on me as a quality perimeter NBA guard, I am stopping everything and doing straight up iso right then and there as he's food for even the Gleague guards who get 10 days on isos. He simply lacks too much athleticism and he has a weaker base than his peers that some have mentioned like Clingan much less the Eastern Europeans and his own country man, Marc Gasol. His body type is similar to Santi Aldama. He just doesn't have a body you want from a NBA center. Too many people are confusing that he's the most fluid super big since Wemby with he's athletic for his size when he's not. Then you add the lack of core and physical strength and there are major issues here for a player being considered by some as a lottery pick.
NBA players are smart. You saw how Naz Reid attacked Wemby base on that drive last night. This is Wemby, easily the goat defensively in NBA history even at this stage because no one has his ability, agility, length, size, athleticism, and feel in a package of one. I really think people are confusing Mara being a smooth mover with a natural gait with this is a good athlete. Look how natural he moves. He's not clunky like Clingan and he's not extremely clunky like Edey. He's smooth type like Gobert when people miss that Gobert is a tremendous athlete for his size. His lateral movements have always been rare. It was just his body and core strength catching up to his ability as a prospect that was the issue.
Mara is like Shelden Williams for me. They have obvious games that are clear if you have good scouting eyes. If your idea is an eventual backup big playing 12-15 mpg and you want rim rolling paint protector who's not impactful but can produce, this is your guy. Some teams need that.
If you need him to be a true rotation piece or an impact player even in limited minutes, you better pass on him.
Too many red flags on film for NBA translation. Especially on defense. Offensively, most of this translates based on film. I really don't have any issues on that end but I also don't think he's worth a lottery pick based on that end as well.
His base and his core is my biggest issue. You can't be slow and a weaker big. It doesn't work no matter how good your brain is.
We clearly watch "film" differently but the way I watch basketball players play basketball told me that Ben Simmons wasnt as good as his numbers and would be a problem for the sixers..That Maxey was a top 3 player in his draft.. that Lonzo Ball sucked on ball and would only be an offball player.. that Kon was extremely underrated as a prospect, scorer and distributor.. Mara may be no good.. we'll see but conflating one "process" over another when both will lead to the same mixed results is illogical.
King Ken wrote:Upperclass wrote:King Ken wrote:Ya'll really gotta watch film better. There is nothing on film that gives me confidence about his ability to switch. Transition on switches, yes because of his tremendous fluidity for his size but he's slow. If he's on me as a quality perimeter NBA guard, I am stopping everything and doing straight up iso right then and there as he's food for even the Gleague guards who get 10 days on isos. He simply lacks too much athleticism and he has a weaker base than his peers that some have mentioned like Clingan much less the Eastern Europeans and his own country man, Marc Gasol. His body type is similar to Santi Aldama. He just doesn't have a body you want from a NBA center. Too many people are confusing that he's the most fluid super big since Wemby with he's athletic for his size when he's not. Then you add the lack of core and physical strength and there are major issues here for a player being considered by some as a lottery pick.
NBA players are smart. You saw how Naz Reid attacked Wemby base on that drive last night. This is Wemby, easily the goat defensively in NBA history even at this stage because no one has his ability, agility, length, size, athleticism, and feel in a package of one. I really think people are confusing Mara being a smooth mover with a natural gait with this is a good athlete. Look how natural he moves. He's not clunky like Clingan and he's not extremely clunky like Edey. He's smooth type like Gobert when people miss that Gobert is a tremendous athlete for his size. His lateral movements have always been rare. It was just his body and core strength catching up to his ability as a prospect that was the issue.
Mara is like Shelden Williams for me. They have obvious games that are clear if you have good scouting eyes. If your idea is an eventual backup big playing 12-15 mpg and you want rim rolling paint protector who's not impactful but can produce, this is your guy. Some teams need that.
If you need him to be a true rotation piece or an impact player even in limited minutes, you better pass on him.
Too many red flags on film for NBA translation. Especially on defense. Offensively, most of this translates based on film. I really don't have any issues on that end but I also don't think he's worth a lottery pick based on that end as well.
His base and his core is my biggest issue. You can't be slow and a weaker big. It doesn't work no matter how good your brain is.
We clearly watch "film" differently but the way I watch basketball players play basketball told me that Ben Simmons wasnt as good as his numbers and would be a problem for the sixers..That Maxey was a top 3 player in his draft.. that Lonzo Ball sucked on ball and would only be an offball player.. that Kon was extremely underrated as a prospect, scorer and distributor.. Mara may be no good.. we'll see but conflating one "process" over another when both will lead to the same mixed results is illogical.
You haven't given me a statement on Mara that really defines your take that he's an impact starter. I asked you how. You gave a simple answer which even that statement, I questioned.
For those who like Mara, I haven't seen one person really definite if defending him. Tell me, you really haven't dug in which I have.
Watching differently is a lot different than just doing it wrong. If we are going 2+2=4. How we do it doesn't matter, it's the outcome. In this case, the outcome is completely different so watching differently is not a tangible statement.