Paxson, make a move

[Rerisen]

But if this team remains healthy and continues to play as they have been under Boylan, then I expect them to be hitting their stride come playoff time and be a real threat in the East just like I thought they would be prior to the season commencing.

I'm still trying to get over that anyone thinks we could actually beat Detroit in the playoffs. A team that is 25-7, won 10 straight and beat Boston in Boston.

I would think we would have learned by now (and from last year) that regular season success against a team means nothing in the playoffs. Detroit is so far ahead of us right now its not even funny. Beating good teams in the playoffs takes poise, experience, willpower, execution down the stretch, and good coaching. We are dubious or lacking in all those areas.

At no point will I root for losses for this team, but at the same time we have to face reality. We are 12-19, and obviously a worse team than last year. Not just a supremely talented team off to a bad start. If we don't get honest about this team were starting to sound like last year's Knick fans talking about the best 30 win team in history or something.

The quality of this team is exactly what I thought it was. The record is just worse. The Bulls were always going to get "knocked out" of the playoffs.

The Bulls by many predictions, were supposed to be leading or fighting for the lead of the Eastern Conference right now. You really think the quality you see in this team right now is equal to that, but just for some unluckiness or I don't even know what the gap between here and there would be called, but its not logical.

[Sinistar6]

[quote="coldfish"][/quote]

We got Jalen Rose because JR had his arse in a sling. JR was giving him crap because he and the rest of the bulls fan base are and were spoiled. I remember a Jalen that totally dominated the Lakers in the finals not to long before he was a Bull. I also remember the first game that Jalen played and made Curry and Chandler look like Moses and Kareem. Krause's last few years were band-aids to try to stop the bleeding.

Krause made a huge pitch for McGrady. I don't blame Krause for striking out , I put a lot more of the blame on MJ. Who could live up to being the next MJ,? Who would want too (besides Kobe). Then there is MJ and the public misquoting Krumbs with the whole "orginization wins championship thing". Krause then reached with the contract to T. Thomas (who at the time looked like an athletic Sam Perkin- and Eddie Robinson, who I guarantee a lot of GMs liked after his domination in the playoffs. The there was Ron Mercer.

Another poster mentioned all the picks that Krause made that are not NBA material. It didn't matter. We were winning championships. Krause also implemented Phil Jackson as coach, traded Polynice for Pippen, drafted Grant, drafted Kuckoc, signed Rodman. I think his good for the franchise far outways the bad. In fact I wish he was our GM right now.

Curry and Chandler was a reach, but not a bad one. Chandler was destined for NBA stardom since the 8th grade. Curry had the post game of a hall of famer. I think looking at their games now they really compliment each other. I don't think Gasol is a championship answer, do you?

However all that is in the past. The fact of the matter is we need an overhall, anything to aquire a bonifide star. Personally I would like to take my chances with 2 picks in the top 7 of this years draft, and I wouldn't mind a little advice from Krause.

[JeremyB0001]

All of you wanted a better team than Krause was giving us so you called for his head. However Krause is smarter than you. He knew that the worst place you can be is a middle of the road team. Right know we are the Cavs of the 80s, and this is what you wanted. All of you that called for Krause's head deserve this.

I disagree. The end of the Krause years were worse than any time Pax has been in charge, with the exception of this season. This season isn't bad because we're middle of the road, it's bad because we have a ton of talent and we're awful.

[coldfish]

Sinistar:

If you look at Krause's teams, he put together some nice complementary pieces that were capable of winning 50+ games at their peak and going to the second round of the playoffs. That's EXACTLY what Paxson has done.

The difference was that Krause was handed a team with Michael Jordan on it.

Tell me that:
Hinrich / Gordon
Michael Jeffrey Freakin Jordan in his prime / Gordon
Deng / Nocioni
Smith / Tyrus
Wallace / Noah

wouldn't be favorites in the NBA.

[Sinistar6]

Sinistar:

If you look at Krause's teams, he put together some nice complementary pieces that were capable of winning 50+ games at their peak and going to the second round of the playoffs. That's EXACTLY what Paxson has done.

The difference was that Krause was handed a team with Michael Jordan on it.

Tell me that:
Hinrich / Gordon
Michael Jeffrey Freakin Jordan in his prime / Gordon
Deng / Nocioni
Smith / Tyrus
Wallace / Noah

wouldn't be favorites in the NBA.

Yes Krause was handed Jordan (Id love if Rod Thorn was also our GM) but the point I am trying to make is we will never get a Jordan without either A. Tanking and getting lucky in the lottery
B. Kobe really wants to be Mike

We can no longer bank on Kobe.

Maybe we get lucky and Wade wants to play in his hometown after the Heat are has-beens. I just really think right now we are in the worst possible situation. I would much rather be Minnesota or the Sonics. Would you guys?

Oh, and Im not saying I always knew this. I have just realized this after our horrible start, before now, I was totally on the side of the direction of this team. So when I say you deserve this, I am pointing at myself also.

[JackFinn]

Look at the past 9 years. Ya have winning as a prerequisite to enjoy yourself, ya gonna hurt. I'm looking out for youse: dismiss winning or choose a different object of entertainment, like coitus or throwing stuff at short people.

[coldfish]

-= original quote snipped =-



Yes Krause was handed Jordan (Id love if Rod Thorn was also our GM) but the point I am trying to make is we will never get a Jordan without either A. Tanking and getting lucky in the lottery
B. Kobe really wants to be Mike

We can no longer bank on Kobe.

Maybe we get lucky and Wade wants to play in his hometown after the Heat are has-beens. I just really think right now we are in the worst possible situation. I would much rather be Minnesota or the Sonics. Would you guys?

Oh, and Im not saying I always knew this. I have just realized this after our horrible start, before now, I was totally on the side of the direction of this team. So when I say you deserve this, I am pointing at myself also.

Fair enough. Now, take a step back for a second and think rationally. There have been two true superstars available to Paxson in either draft or trade in his entire tenure. Garnett and Kobe. Everyone else is a false star.

Garnett: Paxson reportedly offered Chandler, Deng and the pick that became Aldridge for Garnett last year and was turned down. That was idiotic of Minnesota. This year, many reports had him again offering a ton, but McHale going with Boston out of loyalty.

Kobe: Paxson went after Kobe HARD as a free agent and almost got him then, even when Chicago wasn't a positive destination and Kobe was in the middle of a trial. Kobe decided to go back to LA. Then again, Kobe tried to force his way to Chicago. Again, reportedly, Paxson actually agreed on a trade for Kobe with LA, but KOBE vetoed it because Paxson gave up too much.

So, essentially by many reports, Paxson has gone on to great lengths to get a superstar. The reasons for his failure were outside of his control (Kobe's no trade clause, McHale's idiocy).

[Kneepad]

If you look at Krause's teams, he put together some nice complementary pieces that were capable of winning 50+ games at their peak and going to the second round of the playoffs. That's EXACTLY what Paxson has done.

The difference was that Krause was handed a team with Michael Jordan on it.

Tell me that:
Hinrich / Gordon
Michael Jeffrey Freakin Jordan in his prime / Gordon
Deng / Nocioni
Smith / Tyrus
Wallace / Noah

wouldn't be favorites in the NBA.

Of course another difference is this: because Krause inherited a team with Michael Jordan on it, I don't believe the Bulls ever had a single natural lottery pick the entire time Jordan was here. The only lottery picks Krause had were those he acquired through trades.

If effect, Krause started from that dreaded "no-man's land" of being not good enough to truly contend and just good enough not to get any elite lottery picks.

Conversely, Paxson has had several lottery picks fall into his lap. In other words, if Paxson had MJ, no Gordon, no Deng, no Hinrich, no Tyrus, no Noah.

Also, I would consider Scottie Pippen to be significantly more than a "nice complementary piece". He was named one of the 50 greatest players in NBA history. The fact that his MJ-less team won just 55 games is due in large part to the monumental adjustment that team had to make after losing the GOAT on the eve of training camp. And, of course, we all know what happened in the playoffs that year...

[Clint Eastwood]

how does a retread unreadable first post to this thread reach 9 pages and my deja vu original thread fall off the page?

[coldfish]

how does a retread unreadable first post to this thread reach 9 pages and my deja vu original thread fall off the page?

I hate that. Seriously. I am one of the mods that likes to merge stuff because a lot of good threads never get read due to redundant threads being created too quickly taking up spots on the first page.

[Bulldog23]

There is no quick fix the problem the Bulls have: They must find a point guard that can complement either Hinrich or Gordon which ever will lead them to the championship.

[Clint Eastwood]

There is no quick fix the problem the Bulls have: They must find a point guard that can complement either Hinrich or Gordon which ever will lead them to the championship.

i came to read coldfish response to mine, but i cant let this go. we need a 2 guard to complement gordon or hinrich. if it is to complement gordon, he better be able to handle the ball. if its for hinrich, he better be able to score and get to the basket.