CLE/MIA/SAC

rpa · Post #21 » by **rpa** » Mon Jan 14, 2008 12:00 am

SportsBoy wrote:Cavs will not take Thomas unless Hughes is in the Trade.

maybe its best to take Cleveland out of the mix.

And the Kings won't be taking back Hughes (and sending out Bibby) unless Lebron is coming to Sacramento or the Cavs' 1st rounder every other year 'til 2020.

Smills91 · Post #22 » by **Smills91** » Mon Jan 14, 2008 12:04 am

SportsBoy wrote:Cavs will not take Thomas unless Hughes is in the Trade.

maybe its best to take Cleveland out of the mix.

Fine by me.

Post #23 » by **loserX** » Mon Jan 14, 2008 12:37 am

Smills91 wrote:Why is it speculative? For Nene, yes absolutely. Oden, sure. But Kenny THomas has actually put up 10/10 for an entire season and then some. I'm not saying he's great, he's not. But the fact is he's done it before and it's not like it's age/injuries that are preventing him from doing it now. It's fit/location/team dynamics etc which change in a trade. He definitely has no positive value, but you're painting him as a Jerome James level player and the fact is, he's actually accomplished something for a sustained period of time in the NBA. Kenny Thomas is much close to Mike Dunleavy than Jerome James in the spectrum of overpaid scrubs.

How do you know that? He hasn't hit double figures in scoring since 2005, and hasn't hit double digits in rebounding since 2004. Both stats have gone down every year since those points. I don't think it's difficult to speculate that he's declining precisely because of his age, which will be 33 when his contract expires.

Is he better than Jerome James? Sure he is, I wouldn't dream of arguing it. But he's terrible this year, and his contract is more per year, and one year longer. A healthy KT is barely outperforming an injured Jerome, and is getting paid more to do it. The difference in trade value isn't all that great right now. The Kings should be feeding Kenny the ball on every possession and hoping he scores so he doesn't completely torpedo the value of whatever asset they try to tie him to

Bac2Basics · Post #24 » by **Bac2Basics** » Mon Jan 14, 2008 12:48 am

Maybe now we can finally close the whole Bibby to Cleveland idea

thethrill23 · Post #25 » by **thethrill23** » Mon Jan 14, 2008 12:50 am

i'm stating the obvious here, but if you people from SAC want so much for bibby, then stop talking about adding kenny thomas because once you do that your bibby value falls.

Bac2Basics · Post #26 » by **Bac2Basics** » Mon Jan 14, 2008 12:59 am

^^

Most Kings fans figure on putting KT with Artest rather than Bibby for total salary reason but the thing is that CLE doesn't have the pieces to get Bibby so theirs no real point in debating the KT point or not.

SacKingZZZ · Post #27 » by **SacKingZZZ** » Mon Jan 14, 2008 3:59 am

Bac2Basics wrote:^^

Most Kings fans figure on putting KT with Artest rather than Bibby for total salary reason but the thing is that CLE doesn't have the pieces to get Bibby so theirs no real point in debating the KT point or not.

Thats what I have been thinking all along, it's just easier to move 14 million than 20+ million in a single deal. The Cavs are capable of taking on Bibby/Kenny if Petrie is willing to take their package of Goodon/filler/1st. He hasn't yet though.

The idea that the Cavs can't take on Bibby/Kenny for salary reasons is horse**** too. They have a measley little 3 million dollars in expring money this year so if there cap would be "screwed up" after the deal, it's just as screwed up now.

SportsBoy · Post #28 » by **SportsBoy** » Mon Jan 14, 2008 4:04 am

Bac2Basics wrote:Maybe now we can finally close the whole Bibby to Cleveland idea

Fine by me!

SportsBoy · Post #29 » by **SportsBoy** » Mon Jan 14, 2008 4:09 am

SacKingZZZ wrote:-= original quote snipped =-

Thats what I have been thinking all along, it's just easier to move 14 million than 20+ million in a single deal. The Cavs are capable of taking on Bibby/Kenny if Petrie is willing to take their package of Goodon/filler/1st. He hasn't yet though.

The idea that the Cavs can't take on Bibby/Kenny for salary reasons is horse**** too. They have a measley little 3 million dollars in expring money this year so if there cap would be "screwed up" after the deal, it's just as screwed up now.

Cavs wont take Kenny!...
If Gooden,Filler, and a 1st wont get the job done, then it wont happen.

REALGM is just trying to start something!

Smills91 · Post #30 » by **Smills91** » Mon Jan 14, 2008 4:15 am

SportsBoy wrote:-= original quote snipped =-

Cavs wont take Kenny!...
If Gooden,Filler, and a 1st wont get the job done, then it wont happen.

REALGM is just trying to start something!

Ahhh

Something Kings and Cavs fans can finally AGREE on.

SacKingZZZ · Post #31 » by **SacKingZZZ** » Mon Jan 14, 2008 4:17 am

SportsBoy wrote:-= original quote snipped =-

Cavs wont take Kenny!...
If Gooden,Filler, and a 1st wont get the job done, then it wont happen.

REALGM is just trying to start something!

Maybe but if Ferry turned down this supposed Bibby deal because of Jackie Butler, it doesn't make him stubborn, it makes him (Please Use More Appropriate Word).

For the reasons I stated above I really don't see much of a reason for Kenny to be a deal breaker, and the idea that the late 1st round pick is going to get the Cavs any closer to a championship is pretty idealistic too.

I still think it's Petrie holding off on the deal and I think if it's the one I stated, Gooden/Snow/filler/1st for Bibby/Kenny he should take it. Sure, not the greatest value for Bibby (but fair overall I think) but that means we can get closer to full value for Artest because we don't have to include Kenny with him.

Post #32 » by **loserX** » Mon Jan 14, 2008 4:32 am

SacKingZZZ wrote:For the reasons I stated above I really don't see much of a reason for Kenny to be a deal breaker, and the idea that the late 1st round pick is going to get the Cavs any closer to a championship is pretty idealistic too.

You don't?

Post #33 » by **TheOUTLAW** » Mon Jan 14, 2008 4:36 am

Bac2Basics wrote:^^

Most Kings fans figure on putting KT with Artest rather than Bibby for total salary reason but the thing is that CLE doesn't have the pieces to get Bibby so theirs no real point in debating the KT point or not.

You guys love to say this but the fact is that the Cavs and Kings did have a deal in place this summer. The idea that the Cavs take on Thomas and add a first is downright silly.

Post #34 » by **KF10** » Mon Jan 14, 2008 4:42 am

SportsBoy wrote:-= original quote snipped =-

Cavs wont take Kenny!...
If Gooden,Filler, and a 1st wont get the job done, then it wont happen.

REALGM is just trying to start something!

We rejected a better deal from Miami months ago. So, your proposed deal is simply not enough...

Darkstar · Post #35 » by **Darkstar** » Mon Jan 14, 2008 5:02 am

I don't see how anyone (Sacto fans included) can see KT as anything but a huge negative. You lose most if not all of the value of Bibby when you package them together. Yes, KT is that lousy.

Oh and, no smills we don't wanna hear what KT might be capable of or was capable of at one point.

If you have to give away Bibby to get rid of KT then you should be glad if you end up taking nothing bad in return. If you think your going to get a good player or lots of value back in return for Bibby/KT then you are going to be taking a contract that just a lousy back.