Teams that may want Wallace (injury update pg 4)

[Fenix]

I'd absolutely do a deal that somebody already reccomended: Wallace for Nesterovic, Garbajosa and Dixon. Toronto would do it, because they would get toughness and rebounding they most certainly lack, he doesn't have long enough contract to hurt them long term, will be a huge expiring in a couple of years (when and if Bargnani becomes a decent starter) and you can always sell him as someone who will teach Bargnani how to play like a true centre (at least on defense). He also fits their system much better than our, considering he'll play next to an All-Star PF in Bosh.

Why for the Bulls? They would:
- get rid of an old man who takes away time from their young big men (Tyrus, Noah and Gray) and replace him with someone who is still a formidable defensive presence and not a total liability on the offensive end. He's a very good role player who knows his limitations and doesn't pout if he doesn't get playing time and an all-around good guy with championship experience. He's also a legit 7 footer and if you haven't noticed yet, we lack those.
- trade a big and long contract for three shorter ones, which gives them more flexiblity to make trades and an opportunity to make them sooner.
- get another 6'1 chucker in Dixon and that alway puts a smile on my face.

[jax98]

I still think a Los Angeles deal for Wallace would be the best to pull off for both teams.

Ben Wallace

For

Kwame Brown
Vladimir Radmanovic

We buy out Vladimir immediately if possible. If not, we intentionally lose a trade to get shorter and smaller deals in for him. It will be tough to find a team who will take him, though.

We then follow that deal up by trading with Memphis for Mike Miller.

Andres Nocioni
Thabo Sefolosha
Viktor Khryapa

For

Mike Miller
Andre Brown
Casey Jacobsen

C Joakim Noah/Aaron Gray/Kwame Brown
F Joe Smith/Tyrus Thomas/Kwame Brown
F Luol Deng/Mike Miller
G Mike Miller/Ben Gordon
G Kirk Hinrich/Ben Gordon

[ice9]

Wallace's defense is atrocious.
Dalembert 21/20
Curry 29/8
Miller 22/13
were awful games. But That's been happening all season.
Aldridge put up 14/13. he had 2/5 going into the 4th (Smith was guarding him), and then we switched and put Wallace on him. 12/8 in the 4th and OT.
Howard went for 17/22 (as opossed to 22.5/15)
Bogut put up 15/11
Dalembert put up 14/11 in our first meeting.
Camby went for 12/20 (in only 30 minutes).


Here are his problems.
1) He doesn't guard people away from the basket. At all. He ignores them and won't close out on shots. If the opossing big can hit a 15 foot shot, we're screwed, cause he's gonna be wide open all night long.
2) His help defense is bleh. He still gets some blocks and steals, but he has 0 intimidation factor anymore.
3) His post defense is bleh. Even at his best this wasn't his strength.
4) Jump
5) He doesn't box out well or position himself for rebounds.
6) Grab the ****in ball. O wait, he can't. Rodman was the master at tipping balls and had a super quick second jump. Wallace just tips the balls cause he can't actually grab the board. His indiscriminate smacking of the ball gives the opponent as much of a chance at getting the lose ball as us.

So many of his rebounds and steals are freebies. So often it has nothing to do with his positioning or defense, rather, the ball just lands right in his lap. Tyrus gets rebounds he has no business getting cause he'll use his athleticism. Gray uses his size and great positioning/boxing out to grab boards. Noah uses mainly athleticism and good timing. These 3 guys get rebounds that are actually difference makers. Wallace gets the boards Duhon could get.

The whole defense is just ****ed up right now. Why don't we front the post all the time? We used to do that and then have the weak side guy come from behind. Everyone had time to rotate and cover the shooters (noch wouldn't anyway, but we still had the best defense). Now we don't front the post, and just have our strong side guard come down for the double, and even the most incompetent passing big man could easily kick it back out for a wide open 3. This is just stupid.

When there are so many problems with the defense of a defensive specialist, you gotta wonder, wtf? His offense leaves me speechless.
It turns out Wallace is ranked 408/425 in points/48 minutes. Jason Collins is the only regular player lower than Wallace, but he shoots 13% better from the field.

(side note bashing the drunkard: Duhon is 71/83 of pgs, with only 3 regulars below him (anthony Johnson, Knight, McInnis). All 3 shoot better from the field and line and average more ap48 (Knight, Johnson also have better a/to ratios).)

We lose in large part because Wallace/Duhon combine for 54 minutes a night, shoot 35% from the field, and combined average under 10 ppg. This is the most incompetent offensive duo in the league, it is almost literally trying to play 3 on 5.

The trading Wallace pipe-dream is just one of 3 pipe-dreams necessary for us to get good again. We have to get a complete overhaul of the coaching staff (we need all new sets and schemes, better rotations, and people that can develop players). We need to replace Duhon, even if it's just Thabo.

My favorite deal is the Kwame/Vlad one. It actually seems like a deal LA could get desperate and do at the deadline.

[Tommy Udo 6]

With Bynum's injury, Los Angeles may now be a little more receptive to taking on Wallace.

Both Brown & Mihm are hobbled also.

Bynum is to have MRI on Monday

[fudgie]

I wasn't a big fan of the Kwame/Vlad trade when it first started popping up. Kwame's just a salary dump and Radman's a bit of a moron.

I've warmed up to it since then. If we can get LA to bite, I'd pull the trigger.

[Sebastian]

Is it wrong that when I saw the parenthetical added to the thread title I became foolishly giddy for about a minute?

[Mr. Kite]

With Bynum's injury, Los Angeles may now be a little more receptive to taking on Wallace.

Both Brown & Mihm are hobbled also.

Bynum is to have MRI on Monday

Bulls could trade Wallace for Brown + Ariza (maybe a 3 way with Charlotte or Milwaukee to dump Ariza) as Ariza's trade restriction is lifted next week.

Or the Bulls could do Wallace for Brown + Mihm + filler.

[bullzman23]

I still think Dallas could be a desitination. According to their fans, they still own the rights to KVH's contract and can sign and trade him. Cuban's the type of guy that won't have trouble paying tax. I'd be happy with a KVH, Diop, and 1st round pick return.

[Tommy Udo 6]

I still think Dallas could be a desitination. According to their fans, they still own the rights to KVH's contract and can sign and trade him. Cuban's the type of guy that won't have trouble paying tax. I'd be happy with a KVH, Diop, and 1st round pick return.

Wasn't KVH's last season 2005-06?

If that is true, they only have the right to sign & trade him until June 30, 2007. A team only retains rights to a player for one year after their last professional contract

So you can tell all those Dallas fans that the ship has sailed.

[Johnston797]

Why in Sam Hill would Dallas want the historically worst shooting playing in NBA history (bad attitude as a bonus) when they get similar but better stuff out of Dampier, Diop & Bass.

[Ben]

With Bynum's injury, Los Angeles may now be a little more receptive to taking on Wallace.

Both Brown & Mihm are hobbled also.

Bynum is to have MRI on Monday

They should have thought about it before and they should definitely think about it now. It's such an obvious move.

And if Bynum's injury might trouble him even a little bit for the rest of the season, maybe LA would be interested enough that we wouldn't have to take on Vlad Rad. If, in addition to Brown, we could get Ariza (as Mr. Kite suggested) and Mihm for Wallace I would be absolutely jumping for joy.

But that's probably way too much to hope for. Maybe Brown, Ariza & Vujacic (sounds like an international law firm)? Naw, LA has no reason to want to trade Ariza. Maybe Brown, Mihm & Vujacic? Heck, I would still do Wallace for Brown and Vlad if that's the most we could get.

[dougthonus]

Ben Wallace

For

Kwame Brown
Vladimir Radmanovic

Vlad's extra year in the deal is a killer for us if we want a chance at pursuing LeBron in FA in a couple years. That may seem like a stupid reason to hold up the deal, but what are we really getting out of this one?

We could send Ben Wallace home and not be any worse off than doing the Kwame + Vlade deal and not have to worry about losing any cap flexibility.

[Tommy Udo 6]

doug, we would have 2 years to unload Vlad for a shorter deal.

Or we can trade one of our other players (Nocioni, Thabo, etc) for expirings in the meantime.

I dont think the $7 million in the last season is a deal breaker

[dougthonus]

doug, we would have 2 years to unload Vlad for a shorter deal.

Or we can trade one of our other players (Nocioni, Thabo, etc) for expirings in the meantime.

I dont think the $7 million in the last season is a deal breaker

I think it will be increasingly difficult to trade deals that extend pass the magic FA year as the deals that expire then will become more valuable which will in turn make it more difficult to unload Vlade.

What does this deal really gain us that sending Wallace home wouldn't?

[Jordan45822]

Lakers would definitly try to get a big man now through trade or free agency. Either go after Webber, or trade for Wallace or JO.

[BigUps]

I'd be willing to lose a trade to get rid of Wallace. He's that bad IMO. He's the result of so many of our issues, including some of Hinrichs.

Wallace is simply an awful fit for our offense, is exploited on defense with his lack of size (since he's lost his quickness) and isn't a leader at all. I'd even say he's a negative influence on some of our younger players.

I'd pretty much accept Wallace for anyone at this point.

[Sonny_D1]

But that's probably way too much to hope for. Maybe Brown, Ariza & Vujacic (sounds like an international law firm)? Naw, LA has no reason to want to trade Ariza.

No, but if LA has any interest in Wallace at all, I think by throwing in Thabo they'd go for it.

Wallace, Thabo for
Kwame, Ariza, Vujacic

Chicago gets 2 expirings in Kwame and Vujacic. Ariza is signed for 1 more year at $3.1m, and quite frankly he might be a bargain to sign to an extension in 2009 if we decide to keep him. Thabo's team option in 2009 is for $2.8m anyway, so we might not be too far off with Ariza. Plus I happen to like what Ariza could bring to the Bulls.

LA gets Wallace, again if they really want him, but in addition they get Thabo who would give them a defensive minded 2/3 to help out Kobe and the crew.

Sounds like a win/win proposition to me.

Trade Checker
Trade ID #4408817

[Red Larrivee]

They really don't need Wallace, and he'd be a waste of time next to Andrew Bynum, who's doing all the dirty work with no sweat.

And plus Ariza is playing really well for the Lakers, why would they give him up after just acquiring him.

[Ben]

They really don't need Wallace, and he'd be a waste of time next to Andrew Bynum, who's doing all the dirty work with no sweat.

Um, should I bother referring you to bulls6's post just 1 page ago about Bynum's injury? Or my own post on this page that quotes bulls6's post? Or the thread title, which includes an injury update b/c of Bynum?

Even if Bynum weren't injured, the Lakers would not NEED Wallace but could probably get him for an expiring and a bad contract (Brown & Vlad), and he could back up Bynum, and/or play alongside Bynum to let Odom play the 3 more often. It hurts us to play 4 on 5 offensively b/c our players are not that great offensively and are very streaky. But Kobe changes that, plus Odom and Bynum are both very good offensively.

Lakers probably aren't going to challenge the WC elite right now. Wallace might give them that little extra boost.

But anyway, the bottom line is that Bynum is getting an MRI today and that's why we've been talking about Wallace to LA just recently.

RIF.

[Ben]

Doug, why do you write that sending Wallace home would be the same as getting an expiring contract worth $7 million?