Offer from MN

MN Die Hard · Post #1 » by **MN Die Hard** » Mon Jan 7, 2008 6:28 pm

Hi guys, just wanted to post this offer I posted on our board, hoping to get some feedback from you. Any thoughts on this as a way to add four productive players to your bench? Jaric is long term money, but Walker has a team-option after next season. Smith and Gomes both expire after this season.

I would LOVE to get Julilan Wright here; I thought he had a lot of potential as a "do-everything" type player coming out of Kansas last year.

How about something like this. MN is giving up lots of production, so if its even possible, this year's team might even get worse. But we're dumping Jaric's long term deal. Over the long term, the money is actually pretty similar, but instead of paying Marko in 2009 and 2010, we're spending similar money to get a look at youngsters Wright and Armstrong.

Gomes, Smith, Jaric, Walker

for

Armstrong, Wright, Jackson, Butler

NO immediatly adds four guys who will contribute in exchange for two guys allegedly in the doghouse (Jax and Butler) and two guys contributing little to nothing (Armstrong and Wright).

MN takes another (painful) step toward rebuilding.

shrink · Post #2 » by **shrink** » Mon Jan 7, 2008 8:36 pm

BTW, Change in Team Outlook for the Hornets: +22.1 ppg, +7.1 rpg, and +3.5 apg.

Walker is an expiring contract next season you could trade for other needs, but it breaks down like this financially for the Hornets:

2007-08: -$3.1
2008-09: -$2.0
2009-10: +$1.6
2010-11: -$0.9
--------------------
OVERALL COST TO HORNETS: $4.4 mil more over 4 years.

As you can see, the cost isn't financial, the costs is two young prospects.

2poor · Post #3 » by **2poor** » Mon Jan 7, 2008 8:41 pm

I don't know, as a fan, I'd say no. I'm still pretty high on Wright and Hilton, and would look to see them develop with this franchise. Jackson and Butler, I'm not terribly attached to.

Coming back, Gomes and Smith are cool with me. Not a big fan of Jaric and I dislike Walker (to say the least). I could see Byron getting pretty fed up with both of them fairly quickly (Jaric/Toine).

So I guess it comes down to what the FO's feelings are about Hilton/Julian's future. I don't know what that is. If I were in charge I'd say no, but not because the value is particularly bad. I like the young guys we got here and dislike the vets we'd getting back.

BobbySura · Post #4 » by **BobbySura** » Tue Jan 8, 2008 2:07 pm

gomes prolly bolts in the summer

shrink · Post #5 » by **shrink** » Tue Jan 8, 2008 3:05 pm

My guess would be that NO resigns one, probably both of Craig Smith and Gomes. I think they are great fits, and have a lot of room for development. They are used to little money, so I don't think they'd be expensive -- maybe both for the MLE. I should note though that I forgot to put their new extensions in my salary numbers in the previous post. Conversely, even if you didn't like what you got from them during the rest of the season and the play-offs, you aren't committed financially.

I expect you'd use Walker the rest of the season (he's been a decent 10 PPG, 4 RPG, 1 three for MIN), and then deal him in the off-season as an expiring for someone you like better. As a $9 mil expiring, he'll have trade value somewhere.

To me, Jaric is the question mark for you. Other New Orleans posters have said his skill-set is a nice fit. His back-court size and defense helps when he pairs with Chris Paul or Pargo. If you need offense, he'll never be the right guy, but the best way I have of explaining his game is that he often seems to get the key rebound, steal, or pass in the fourth quarter, and he makes the players around him better. His numbers will rarely impress anyone (through he had a near triple-double earlier this season), but if he can make Chris Paul 20% better, your team wins more games, and he might be closer to justifying his salary.

I think he's clearly a better player than Bobby Jackson, who's paid the same the first two years. I think the question for Jaric isn't swapping those salaries -- its whether you think he'll be a good fit for a while, and how committed the Hornets are to success this year and the next.

2poor · Post #6 » by **2poor** » Tue Jan 8, 2008 3:51 pm

Agreed, I'd rather have Jaric than Jackson (or Butler) at this point. Hell, maybe playing in a more "competitive" environment where less is expected of him (so to speak) will be a shot in the arm.

Gomes, I like. Smith, definitely a fan of; but...I still don't want to see Hilton/Julian go anywhere. For me, I guess thats what it comes down to.

edit: I'll vomit if I see 'Toine in a NO uni though.

MN Die Hard · Post #7 » by **MN Die Hard** » Tue Jan 8, 2008 4:04 pm

2poor wrote:Agreed, I'd rather have Jaric than Jackson (or Butler) at this point. Hell, maybe playing in a more "competitive" environment where less is expected of him (so to speak) will be a shot in the arm.

Gomes, I like. Smith, definitely a fan of; but...I still don't want to see Hilton/Julian go anywhere. For me, I guess thats what it comes down to.

edit: I'll vomit if I see 'Toine in a NO uni though.

I used to think the same thing about Walker, but I've got to be honest, he's been a model teammate/mentor to MN's young team. I was shocked....I didnt picture him as being a good fit for a young team at all, but he's been great with the youngsters.

Having said that I cant blame you for wanting to keep Wright and Armstrong. So what about taking the young guys out of the trade?

B Jax and Butler for Jaric and one of (they all work financially):

Doleac
Green
Buckner

Doleac is a big and he is expiring.
Green has potential if you want to give him a look and he's expiring.
Butler is a good vet to have around; a good defender and I was surprised to see he's a decent shooter. Not expiring but I believe he has a team option in a year or two.

2poor · Post #8 » by **2poor** » Tue Jan 8, 2008 6:13 pm

From that, I'd like Green. However I don't think Scott would get along with Green (JR-like), so I guess I'd say either Doleac or Buckner. I guess at that point though, I wouldn't really care.

shrink · Post #9 » by **shrink** » Tue Jan 8, 2008 7:46 pm

I wouldn't do the second deal for MIN. Jaric's expensive, but he's dang useful. I wouldn't take on the less useful Jackson, and then take on salary in the other half of the deal. If the deal doesn't bring MIN prospects or better cap relief, I'd stick with Jaric.

2poor · Post #10 » by **2poor** » Tue Jan 8, 2008 8:02 pm

You guys want Marcus Vinicius?

shrink · Post #11 » by **shrink** » Thu Jan 17, 2008 3:16 pm

How about taking out Walker and Gomes?
What fills in the blanks here for the Hornets?

Craig Smith + Jaric for Bobby Jackson + _________

2poor · Post #12 » by **2poor** » Thu Jan 17, 2008 4:27 pm

I'd say take your pick from: Bowen, Vinicius, Butler, Ely

Protected 1st round and/or unconditional 2nd round picks are okay too. Hornets figure to unload their 08 (and maybe 09) picks anyways...don't really need them, especially if the return is a young asset.

I'm really hoping they make a move with Portland to get Webster or Jones, but I won't bet the farm yet. Smith and Jaric could probably help out...for the right price.