Randolph/Balkman or Haslem/Wright

[Rockmaninoff]

Hey everybody. I'm kind of a newbie around here, but I had what I think is a good trade idea in another thread, and would like to know what you guys think about it in relation to the Z-Bo rumor.

Posted this in the other Z-Bo thread:

Everything said about Randolph's faults in this thread are pretty much true. However, I still do this deal.

Randolph, for whatever reason, is usually a beast against Detroit. If we're lucky enough to make it this year or next, I know that he'll help us against the Pistons.

CV, Simmons, Gadz? Small price.

I'm ascribing to the point of view that since we're already terrible, why not give Z-Bo a shot. On the bright side, at least we know that we'd have a guy that wants to put up shots down low "every" night. He'd also take shots away from the chucking backcourt that's a source of discontent for many posters here.

Why dont we just get rid of part of our backcourt?

Do that, and we get the rebounding and high post shooting of Zach Randolph, but in the form of a role player. Who also has championship/big game experience. We also get our 22 minute per game back up small forward. Then move Mason to backup shooting guard, and let the season play out.

Ivey/Bell
Redd/Mason
Simmons/Wright
Haslem/Yi
Bogut/Yi

Then call up Sessions to see what he has got, keep Noel, Voskuhl and Ruffin for inexpensive injury protection/occasional matchups. That lets Yi come off the bench this year. We look to draft a 4/5 like Devon Hardin to replace Haslem, so that Yi can start next year and a Hardin like player would cover the 4/5. Then move Haslem, because a player like him, at that reasonable of a contract, will always have value. Ricky Davis gets cut and goes back to the Heat.

Ivey is Rondo. Look at Ivey's per 36 compared to Rondo's 2007-2008 averages. And, that is exactly the type of point guard we need with Redd, Yi, and Bogut as our Big 3. Bell is the jack of all trades backup combo guard. Simmons is our shooter/entry passer (3/4). Wright is our athletic defensive specialist, who can score a little, on the wing (a true 3). As is Mason (2/3). Haslem is our rebounder/high post shooter. Redd scores. Bogut scores, rebounds and plays post defense. Yi scores and plays post and perimeter defense. We win games. Balance. Harmony. It is possible.

So, what do you guys think? Would you rather do the Z-Bo trade, or would you rather do something like the one I presented? If neither, then please do make a suggestion to spur the discussion.

[blkout]

Haslem would be such a better fit for this team than Randolph. Low, usage, high production, plays D, no attitude problems, has played on winning teams, decent contract, has blocked more shots than Michael Redd this year.. perfect.

[xTitan]

I voted for neither because the Bucks need improvement most at either the 3,2, or 1 and this doesn't get answered................I want a deal that would land the Bucks Josh Childress and then break up the starting backcourt....IMO, this is the quickest way to getting a winning team.

[RayRayJones]

I would do neither. My Zach reasons are listed in his thread, so I won't clutter them up and start another thread about him here. Balkman with him is tempting, but I stll say no.

As for Haslem/Wright, I just don't see them making a big enough difference with that lineup.

[REDDzone]

I voted for neither because the Bucks need improvement most at either the 3,2, or 1 and this doesn't get answered................I want a deal that would land the Bucks Josh Childress and then break up the starting backcourt....IMO, this is the quickest way to getting a winning team.

Childress has been my number one choice for over a year now. Does everything, unselfish, D's it up, and extremely efficient. Ideal 3 for our backcourt, and if we break them up, even better.

I'd also like a guy like Nocioni to back-up the 3/4 position, but Chill would be my number one choice.

I wonder how much he will make this summer? If it is 5-6 million dollars it will make me so mad that Dez is already making that from us.

[paulpressey25]

I don't like either deal......

Couldn't we send that same package to Atlanta for Marvin Williams?

Or to Philly for Andre Miller and something else?

Or to Minny for Craig Smith and Jaric?

[Rockmaninoff]

I voted for neither because the Bucks need improvement most at either the 3,2, or 1 and this doesn't get answered................I want a deal that would land the Bucks Josh Childress and then break up the starting backcourt....IMO, this is the quickest way to getting a winning team.

I don't really get what Childress would do for us, but, fair enough. Do you think that Redd, Yi, and Bogut have Big 3 potential (together scoring around 60 points a game, consistantly)? Maybe not this year, but next?

[Rockmaninoff]

I would do neither. My Zach reasons are listed in his thread, so I won't clutter them up and start another thread about him here. Balkman with him is tempting, but I stll say no.

As for Haslem/Wright, I just don't see them making a big enough difference with that lineup.

What would you do then, and why?

[Rockmaninoff]

I don't like either deal......

Couldn't we sent that same package to Atlanta for Marvin Williams?

Or to Philly for Andre Miller and something else?

Or to Minny for Craig Smith and Jaric?

Atlanta doesn't want to give up Williams or Childress. They have a good thing going with those players.

Philly doesn't want to add salary/long contracts (Gadz/Mo).

Minny might actually be a team that would want all three of Mo, CV, and Gadz. But, maybe not if they want the #1 pick and/or salary cap room.

The Heat are a team that would want quasi veterans in an attempt to turn it around this year. I think they would want all of those players (Mo, CV, and Gadz). This type of deal clears salary for Bogut's extension, while adding good/great role players around our Big 3. Do you guys think that Redd, Yi, and Bogut can form a Big 3 (together scoring around 60 points a game, consistantly and efficiently)? If you guys don't like it, you don't like it, though.

[REDDzone]

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Atlanta doesn't want to give up Williams or Childress. They have a good thing going with those players.

Who knows though. Atlanta has that whole budget problem where they can't exceed it, and I have heard that Josh Smith is looking for a max type deal.

If that is truly the case, do they want to spend the 5-8 million dollars per year on Childress who has NO future in their starting 5? Does Childress even want to stay there knowing he has no chance of starting there with Johnson/Williams/Smith?

I don't know the answer to these questions, just asking them based on my (limited) understanding of the situation down in Atlanta.

[Rockmaninoff]

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Who knows though. Atlanta has that whole budget problem where they can't exceed it, and I have heard that Josh Smith is looking for a max type deal.

If that is truly the case, do they want to spend the 5-8 million dollars per year on Childress who has NO future in their starting 5? Does Childress even want to stay there knowing he has no chance of starting there with Johnson/Williams/Smith?

I don't know the answer to these questions, just asking them based on my (limited) understanding of the situation down in Atlanta.

I don't know, but to my eyes Atlanta looks to be in great shape salary wise. Why wouldn't they resign those guys?

[xTitan]

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I don't really get what Childress would do for us, but, fair enough. Do you think that Redd, Yi, and Bogut have Big 3 potential (together scoring around 60 points a game, consistantly)? Maybe not this year, but next?

I am not a Redd guy, I would deal him in the offseason. I have always believed in Bogut and still think he has more to offer once he gets his confidence back in his mid-range jumpshot. I think Yi has beeen very solid and has a big ceiling, together they will also defend, block shots, and rebound. Without Redd I think I can live with Mo because he seems to have some chemistry with his teammmates and does some things very well, his terrible defense always scares me though. The key will be what the Bucks can get back for Redd I would rather have 4 guys who can score consistently and then find a scorer off the bench. As far as what Childress adds, someone above posted exactly what he adds...he can score, pass, defend....plays with a high basketball IQ. If I am the GM, the majority of the guys I sign must have a high basketball IQ, dumb, selfish players equal losses.....but it might not hurt to have a player with a big scoring mentality coming off your bench.....say a Jerry Stackhouse type.

[RayRayJones]

My first line of action would be to get a passing PG.

Trade Simmons and 2nd round (give 1st round if need be) for Jamaal Tinsley.

Trade Redd and CV for Jermaine O'Neal.

Lineup
Tinsley
Mo
Yi
O'Neal
Bogut

Depending on what could happen/evolve come draft night and/or deadline time, I could see trading for a better SF, as I'm not too sure (nor is anyone really) how Yi would do at the 3.

[REDDzone]

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I don't know, but to my eyes Atlanta looks to be in great shape salary wise. Why wouldn't they resign those guys?

Having two max guys changes everything. And as I said, I am pretty sure ATL GM has a certain budget due to controversy in the Hawks' ownership group.

Other people probably know more than me about this though (and no need to rip me if I'm off).

[paulpressey25]

What about sending Redd/CV to the Lakers for Odom/Farmar?

Or sending Mo/Simmons to the Lakers for Odom assuming you could work the BYC issues?

[L&H_05]

For whatever reason ?? Wise has a weird fetish for Webber and Randolph...Two morons that have failed a whole helluva lot more than they succeeded..

If I was making the deal, I'd go with Haslem and Wright..

[Rockmaninoff]

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I am not a Redd guy, I would deal him in the offseason. I have always believed in Bogut and still think he has more to offer once he gets his confidence back in his mid-range jumpshot. I think Yi has beeen very solid and has a big ceiling, together they will also defend, block shots, and rebound. Without Redd I think I can live with Mo because he seems to have some chemistry with his teammmates and does some things very well, his terrible defense always scares me though. The key will be what the Bucks can get back for Redd I would rather have 4 guys who can score consistently and then find a scorer off the bench. As far as what Childress adds, someone above posted exactly what he adds...he can score, pass, defend....plays with a high basketball IQ. If I am the GM, the majority of the guys I sign must have a high basketball IQ, dumb, selfish players equal losses.....but it might not hurt to have a player with a big scoring mentality coming off your bench.....say a Jerry Stackhouse type.

See, but I just don't think that Mo works as our starting point guard. The defense is THAT BAD. And, I don't think he can be our long term scoring guard. I'm not a Mo guy or a Redd guy or a Bogut guy. I'm a Bucks guy, and as that I know that Redd can score and play average defense. I believe he can do it in the flow, and that he can learn when to force a shot (the end of the shot clock). It doesn't matter what he is paid, because the guys who should be the other part of the Big 3 (Bogut and Yi) are paid very little. But, Bogut will need an extension soon and we need to make a little room for that.

Put Mo next to Wade, and everything is fine. Mo next to Redd is a nightmare. And, Royal Ivey is Rajon Rondo. We are 4-1 in games that he starts.

I guess it comes down to whether you think Redd, Yi, and Bogut can be a Big 3 (together scoring around 60 points a game, consistantly and efficiently). Maybe not this year, but next. If you do think they can, then we only need role players who can give us the extra 30-40 points a game that we will need to win. Because, the proposed lineup gives us steller size, athleticism, defense and rebounding. I think Ivey, Bell, Simmons, and Haslem can give us the extra 30, with Mason and Wright contributing the other 10.

As far as Childress goes, I just think that Bobby Simmons can do the things that he does if we have some patience, and let the guy get all the way back.

[Rockmaninoff]

What about sending Redd/CV to the Lakers for Odom/Farmar?

Or sending Mo/Simmons to the Lakers for Odom assuming you could work the BYC issues?

The Lakers are not going to make any more changes this year. They are set when Bynum comes back.

[Rockmaninoff]

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Having two max guys changes everything. And as I said, I am pretty sure ATL GM has a certain budget due to controversy in the Hawks' ownership group.

Other people probably know more than me about this though (and no need to rip me if I'm off).

I'm not going to rip you man. You're right, there is a lot of unknown in that situation. It is hard to predict what the Hawks are going to do.

[blkout]

What about sending Redd/CV to the Lakers for Odom/Farmar?

Where is that drooling smiley...