For Those Who Think Redd & Mo Together Is A Problem

[europa]

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Still don't understand why you would rather trade Simmons than Gadzuric, or why you think we need Jason Williams, but otherwise I totally agree.

I wouldn't rather trade Simmons than Gadz; it's just in the proposal I suggest Simmons fits perfectly and we know the Heat have already expressed interest in him at one time this season and it's possible they may still have some interest. Plus moving Simmons allows the Bucks to bring back Williams and his expiring deal.

[InsideOut]

I also think it is wrong to target 2011 as the next time we can realistically compete. The team will be in Las Vegas by then. We aren't that far away.

What is your definition of compete? Can you think of a way we can realistically get by Boston or Detroit before 2010? All these trade ideas of trading our overpaid garbage for another team

[Rockmaninoff]

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I wouldn't rather trade Simmons than Gadz; it's just in the proposal I suggest Simmons fits perfectly and we know the Heat have already expressed interest in him at one time this season and it's possible they may still have some interest. Plus moving Simmons allows the Bucks to bring back Williams and his expiring deal.

Right, but we could also get Ricky Davis back for Gadz, cut Davis so that he can go back to the Heat, and make cap room that way. Then the deal is really 3 players for 2, and that is what makes it fair.

Jason Williams just doesn't add anything that we need, and he takes away shots. I like having good/great defense at the point of attack.

[europa]

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Right, but we could also get Ricky Davis back for Gadz, cut Davis so that he can go back to the Heat, and make cap room that way. Then the deal is really 3 players for 2, and that is what makes it fair.

I'm not sure the Heat would trade Haslem, Wright and Davis. That doesn't make much sense for them given how they're only getting one decent player in return and that's Mo. Gadz is awful and Villanueva isn't very good either. That's a pretty poor trade for Miami in my opinion. With my proposal, it gives them two players we know they've had interest for in the past. JWill isn't a great player by any means but he'll be serviceable and has the added benefit of an expiring contract.

Frankly, I'm not sure the Heat would even go for my proposal given how Haslem is the best player in the deal in my opinion and Wright is the superior young player over Villanueva. I'm banking on the hope they still like Mo and maybe Simmons and would be looking to try and make a big move to save their season (not that they will in all probability but it doesn't sound like they want to give up just yet).

[raferfenix]

The problem with the Heat scenarios is that Riley has promised thier owner that he will cut $6 million in cap to get under the luxuary tax.

Hopefully it's bull, as they were willing to sign Mo Williams this offseason. However, giving up talent to add him at a much higher salary than they were offering is hardly appealing to the guys paying the bills right now. Unless they think it'd get them back into heavy playoff contention I don't see them making that kind of deal, especially considering they'd be paying double since they're over the tax.

[Rockmaninoff]

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What is your definition of compete? Can you think of a way we can realistically get by Boston or Detroit before 2010? All these trade ideas of trading our overpaid garbage for another team

[Rockmaninoff]

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I'm not sure the Heat would trade Haslem, Wright and Davis. That doesn't make much sense for them given how they're only getting one decent player in return and that's Mo. Gadz is awful and Villanueva isn't very good either. That's a pretty poor trade for Miami in my opinion. With my proposal, it gives them two players we know they've had interest for in the past. JWill isn't a great player by any means but he'll be serviceable and has the added benefit of an expiring contract.

Frankly, I'm not sure the Heat would even go for my proposal given how Haslem is the best player in the deal in my opinion and Wright is the superior young player over Villanueva. I'm banking on the hope they still like Mo and maybe Simmons and would be looking to try and make a big move to save their season (not that they will in all probability but it doesn't sound like they want to give up just yet).

Yes, but like I said, they would get Davis back. And, like I said, if they had to have Simmons to make it work, then I would do it. I just have no interest in either Jason Williams or Ricky Davis playing here.

[Debit One]

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Frankly, I'm not sure the Heat would even go for my proposal given how Haslem is the best player in the deal in my opinion

Think about that statement for a minute.

Let it sink in.

You might not agree (I do agree, BTW), but it isn't laughable, right?

We would be giving up the PG who we signed as a free agent this summer to a big contract, our big free agent signing from two years ago, and the PF who was a recent top 10 pick and for whom we gave up our own top 10 pick.

All of that, and yet the relatively non-descript PF, Udonis Haslem, is the best player in the deal. If that isn't a screaming indictment of Bucks management I don't know what it takes.

[paulpressey25]

All of that, and yet the relatively non-descript PF, Udonis Haslem, is the best player in the deal. If that isn't a screaming indictment of Bucks management I don't know what it takes.

I don't know if I entirely agree with that. Take Bobby out of it, since he's an injury casualty. I think with the other three guys it depends on what your team wants to determine who is the best guy.

CV's obviously the weakest of the three, but if I'm an expansion team, I might want him to just take a flyer.

If I'm Cleveland, Miami or the Lakers, Mo Williams might be a key piece for me.

I like Haslem, but you need to put him on the right team as well. We could obviously use him badly since he works hard on D and rebounding. For the Bulls he's redundant.

[europa]

Think about that statement for a minute.

Let it sink in.

You might not agree (I do agree, BTW), but it isn't laughable, right?

We would be giving up the PG who we signed as a free agent this summer to a big contract, our big free agent signing from two years ago, and the PF who was a recent top 10 pick and for whom we gave up our own top 10 pick.

All of that, and yet the relatively non-descript PF, Udonis Haslem, is the best player in the deal. If that isn't a screaming indictment of Bucks management I don't know what it takes.

I disagree Haslem is a non-descript PF. I think he is a rock-solid PF who can be a strong piece on a contending team. He rebounds, defends and he's a reliable offensive player. He's certainly a much better PF at the present time than anybody the Bucks have on their roster. I think he's very similar to the player Joe Smith was in his best seasons. I think he is a better player at his position than Mo is at his (and it shouldn't even be questioned whether he's better than Villanueva and Simmons - he clearly is now). So yes, I would view him as the best player in this trade with Wright the best prospect in the deal.

I'd say he's the exact type of player a good team could always use. So if your point is the Bucks don't have the slightest clue how to acquire such players I would agree with that.

[showtimesam]

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I'd go to Miami today and offer Mo/Villanueva/Simmons for Williams/Haslem and Wright and see if the Heat have any interest. Wright would be a good young player to step in at SF; Haslem brings so much of what the Bucks need in the frontcourt alongside Bogut and Williams could man the point until his contract expires at the end of the season. My other option would be to keep working on Atlanta to see if there's any way to get Marvin Williams in a trade.

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The heat trade is similar to what I've been posting for the last couple weeks.

I think an offer like that isn't exciting but its the move the team has to make. It's an opportunity to admit their mistake of locking up mo and redd together by bringing in williams expiring contract for mo.

From there, Haslem is a great fit as a role player in our big man rotation and allows us to dump bobby and his horrible deal.

Finally, Dorrel Wright gives us one young piece to work with and hopefully develop into the athletic three we need.

That trade also makes us worse possibly this season and we can add a high lotto pick to that mix as well. I think it makes for a fast turn around, and a much better defensive squad for next year depending on how they use that draft pick.

[europa]

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The heat trade is similar to what I've been posting for the last couple weeks.

I think an offer like that isn't exciting but its the move the team has to make. It's an opportunity to admit their mistake of locking up mo and redd together by bringing in williams expiring contract for mo.

From there, Haslem is a great fit as a role player in our big man rotation and allows us to dump bobby and his horrible deal.

Finally, Dorrel Wright gives us one young piece to work with and hopefully develop into the athletic three we need.

That trade also makes us worse possibly this season and we can add a high lotto pick to that mix as well. I think it makes for a fast turn around, and a much better defensive squad for next year depending on how they use that draft pick.

I actually think it makes the Bucks better both now and in the future. Haslem would be a major upgrade at PF over Yi and Villanueva. He's just a better player at this time. If Yi develops as hoped, then Haslem becomes a strong backup, making the bench stronger. Wright would be a major upgrade at SF both now and in the future, so you've improved there. I think those two improvements are more than enough to offset the downgrade of going from Mo to Williams at PG.

So the team is better now and you have added two good pieces for the future as well. I agree it's not a sexy trade; it just happens to be one where you remove players who don't fit or don't appear to fit and bring in ones who should. To me, that's the smart approach to take to try and fix the mess this team is in.

[Debit One]

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I'd say he's the exact type of player a good team could always use. So if your point is the Bucks don't have the slightest clue how to acquire such players I would agree with that.

Precisely my point.

My post wasn't intended to be a jab at Haslem. He's a solid NBA starting PF. My point is that when a "solid NBA starting PF" is better than our newly enriched starting PG, our starting SF who was recently our big FA signing, and a PF who was a top 10 pick and for whom we gave up our own top 10 pick, you have to question the people making the personnel decisions.

[LUKE23]

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Precisely my point.

My post wasn't intended to be a jab at Haslem. He's a solid NBA starting PF. My point is that when a "solid NBA starting PF" is better than our newly enriched starting PG, our starting SF who was recently our big FA signing, and a PF who was a top 10 pick and for whom we gave up our own top 10 pick, you have to question the people making the personnel decisions.

I don't know if I'm reading this right, but are you saying Haslem is better than Mo? If so, I'm going to have to disagree big time.

[Rockmaninoff]

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I don't know if I'm reading this right, but are you saying Haslem is better than Mo? If so, I'm going to have to disagree big time.

It's all relative. Mo is better as an individual basketball player. But, Haslem is better as a role playing power forward, then Mo is as a starting point guard. At least for the Bucks. On the Heat, Mo might be more valuable then Haslem, because they really need scoring, and D-Wade plays good/great defense.