GSW-LAL-MIN

[shrink]

I'd like more opinions on this variation:

GSW GIVES: Pietrus, Barnes, Bellini, O'Bryant, Perovic
GSW GETS: Odom, Coby Karl

GSW gets Odom, a great fit for their style, with minor parts. Add in a TPE for VladRad. Bellini needs to be in, and even then, it barely matches financially with Pietrus BYC. I took out the 1st.

LAL GETS: Ratliff, Barnes, Craig Smith, Gomes, Gerald Green
LAL GIVES: Odom, Sasha, Coby Karl, 1st

All expirings and +20.9 ppg, +9.4 rpg, and +2.2 apg. A little less when Vlad Rad goes out for the TPE. With all this production and cap space, Lakers should chuck in a 1st. LAL becomes a player in free agency this summer.

MIN GIVES: Ratliff, Barnes, Craig Smith, Gomes, Gerald Green
MIN GETS: Sasha, Pietrus, Bellini, O'Bryant, Perovic, LAL 1st

MIN eats some salary and loses a ton of production, but gets some future prospects for next season.

[gswhoops]

As much as I like Odom, we can't do this deal. It leaves us with Croshere as the only backup PF and costs us too much money, especially since we have to throw in VladRad for the TPE.

[loserX]

(Minor note: you have Barnes in MIN'S outgoing instead of their incoming. I assume they'd buy out Doleac and ? for the 4-for-6 trade?)

[dockingsched]

LAL GETS: Ratliff, Barnes, Craig Smith, Gomes, Gerald Green
LAL GIVES: Odom, Sasha, Coby Karl, 1st

All expirings and +20.9 ppg, +9.4 rpg, and +2.2 apg. A little less when Vlad Rad goes out for the TPE. With all this production and cap space, Lakers should chuck in a 1st. LAL becomes a player in free agency this summer.

lol, are u including theo ratliff, who has played a total of 6 games this yr over two months ago, in those stats? i hope you're not.

[hermes]

looks decent from the la side of it

[mistatwo mayn]

I think GSW has no choice BUT TO DO this trade

[FlawlessVictory]

L.A. passes because the FA class this off-season is weak, and it sends the wrong message to Bryant.

[GopherIt!]

Yikes! This is an easy no for the Wolves

Shrink buddy did you hit your head? lol

I usually like your trade ideas but this one seems really out there. The only benefit I see here for MN is the pick from the Lakers. Not a fan of Sasha, Pietrus, POB or Perovic at all. Bellini should become a solid outside shooter but I'd still take McCants over him. Golden State seems like a poor trade partner for us at this point.

If Minnesota is moving Smith we need a 6-10+ FC type that can block shots for us (not a stiff like POB.) As for the Lakers, Smith for Turiaf that is about the only thing I can see Minnesota considering with them.

I'm a big Gomes fan. He's too valuable of a piece to give up. He's been playing very well of late, just today 35 pts and 11 boards today against who else? Golden State. I think Minnesota will resign him. We can do that and not go into Lux. territory for next season or jeopardize cap space for a potential FA move in 2009-10. Id rather resign him and Craigers and risk being able to trade Smith later than do a deal like this. That's just me.

Goph

[shrink]

To be honest, I haven't really given this trade a lot of thought, except to flesh out the finances of an LAL poster who had the interesting idea of trying to get the Lakers into the 2008 free agency.

With Odom's handles, he seems like there'd be no better fit than GSW, and MIN seemed able to financially make the deal happen between two teams who both have play-off ambitions. I don't have a feel for how valuable GSW's prospects are, and I'd especially like to hear from MIN posters. I posted at the time that I felt it would need some tinkering to make rosters work, and perhaps to fix value, so I thank everyone for giving me their comments.

[gswhoops]

I'd rather just make a deal directly with LA, Al + Pietrus for Odom (or something along those lines).

[shrink]

Does GSW want to give up Al Harrington, or the less productive future pieces? Harrington of course, ruins the OP's dream of getting expirings to jump in front of so many teams that will also have contract room for free agents in the Summer of 2009.

If Craig Smith swung to GSW, does that meet your concerns about a back-up PF (at least for low post scoring), but GSW incentives would need to increase though. I understand your concerns about money. I think if LAL can get out of Odom's deal and move Vlad with it, getting expirigns for all of them, they should be happy. I'd also note that I would prefer to not have POB in the trade. MIN should focus on players that would be under contract in 2008-09.

[old rem]

Wow...resorting to oldrem tactics...

Unfortunately...We're trading 2 usefl players for 4 useful players. They're not going to get the time to show off their +20.9 ppg.
Lakers pass.

oldrem tactics....???? Y'mean kick 'em in the nads and run off with the guy's wallet and wife/ That's the OLD old rem.

The Warriors won't ship out ALL their backup c's...even if they are underused+ give 2 rotation gus and a recent #1 pick....wiping out SF/SG depth....AND then take on Odums contact at $13 mill +++ and sacrifice $$ saved (that TPE $) to get stuck with VladRad's contract. I could see SOME variant of this being interesting to GSW but if GSW is ADDING Odum's salary....a sizable salary will be exiting-and adding Vlad too....the GSW front office won't touch. While this des add a player of some worth.....Odum IS a 12 pt scoring $13 mill guy....which makes Barnes + pietrus look like very good bang for the buck. GSW might deal POB or Kosta..but not both unless a good C is coming in. GSW further won't incluse POB/Kosta if they are rated as minimal trade value.

old rem tactics?

suck the stains out of my underwear! I feel I may have been dissed. Oh well....in time the merits will prevail.

[old rem]

Does GSW want to give up Al Harrington, or the less productive future pieces? Harrington of course, ruins the OP's dream of getting expirings to jump in front of so many teams that will also have contract room for free agents in the Summer of 2009.

If Craig Smith swung to GSW, does that meet your concerns about a back-up PF (at least for low post scoring), but GSW incentives would need to increase though. I understand your concerns about money. I think if LAL can get out of Odom's deal and move Vlad with it, getting expirigns for all of them, they should be happy. I'd also note that I would prefer to not have POB in the trade. MIN should focus on players that would be under contract in 2008-09.

I LIKE Craig Smith. I can't say Nellie makes good use of him--at this point. However.......Nellie is retiring at some point and GSW SHOULD be looking at both the current situation and the post-Nellie picture.

The front office has shown recently a tilt toward NOT adding payroll---commitments. Odum? maybe in some scenarios. Vlad also? Not a chance. Even if I happen to LIKE the net outcome--what the GSW front office sees as priority is another thing.

[old rem]

I'd rather just make a deal directly with LA, Al + Pietrus for Odom (or something along those lines).

While you and I may like that concept-I suspect the GSW front office is in economy mode and Odums $$$$$$ relative to Harrington might kill that deal.

With the Warriors and Lakers rivals....each will be reluctant to do deals they think might help the other.

[WarFan]

I don't think this deal has a chance of happening. Just wanted to give a fans perspective of GS prospects. Feel free to disagree, I'd like to hear some outside opinions if you have them.

Belinelli - Most likely worth about the same as his selection spot. After impressing over the summer, he was beat out in training camp for a rotation spot and has basically been buried on the bench or in a suit, his new nickname is Armani. All that said, I'm not really worried about him. 3 of the guys ahead of him are FA's and he should get a chance to play next year, if not by the end of this year. He's cheap and Nellie likes him, so I doubt he goes anywhere especially for just a pick or some other prospect.

O'Bryant - I think his value is about equal to an early 2nd round pick with an expiring contract attached. The GS front office obviously could care less about him. On the court he looks like a raw rookie, though he does show obvious skills and athleticism. I've pretty much decided that Mullin or Nellie just doesn't think his head is in it and it never will be, because that's about the only explanation that makes sense. They're taking a huge gamble and some team could get really lucky. Another team taking him in a trade gets the advantage of seeing him up close as well as getting him playing time, but they get no Bird rights to him, so would most likely have to use the MLE to re-sign him. There's a risk that letting him play would blow up in a team's face as they'd be raising the bids for him, but at least they'd have a better idea of what he can do. Also, after the way POB has been treated in GS, he would probably prefer to resign with a team that gave him a chance.

Perovic - Hard to tell, a rebuilding team might value him at about equal to a very late 1st. He just played his first game of the year the other night, looked pretty damn good for half a quarter. He's 22 years old, 7'2" and not a plodder. Apparently he has a good jump-shot, haven't seen it yet.

Wright - This is the hardest one for me, I just don't know how other teams would value him. I was surprised that he was available at #8 when Charlotte took him. Obviously, he was drafted as a high upside project, but the amount of minutes he's gotten (at a need position on this team) is concerning. A couple weeks ago, he got a start and Nellie said he'd be seeing more minutes, but he's barely been on the court since then and it's not like he was awful. I think that Wright and his situation are kind of similar to Ty Thomas last year, but I don't think either team would do a straight up trade of the two. I think some other teams might prefer Wright over Ty, but probably not most. He'd have more value to a rebuilding team, as he's probably not going to produce much for at least another year.

[loserX]

I don't think this deal has a chance of happening. Just wanted to give a fans perspective of GS prospects. Feel free to disagree, I'd like to hear some outside opinions if you have them.

Good, thorough analysis. For what it's worth, this outsider largely agrees with your assessments, although I don't know you'd get a late first for Perovic at this point.

[DLeagueAllStars]

if any Warrior fan wouldnt do the original deal here, they are missing the boat seriously..

starting lineup of

Baron, Ellis, Sjax, odom and Biedrins would be great and having Harrington as a 6th man works... if the Warriors need to go big, well whats a bigger athletic lineup than Baron, Sjax, Odom, Harrington and Biedrins...

lastly, the Warriors would still have Cro, Bukie, Watson and Wright to fill out the roster.. its not like Nellie goes 10 guys anyways..

[turk3d]

if any Warrior fan wouldnt do the original deal here, they are missing the boat seriously..

starting lineup of

Baron, Ellis, Sjax, odom and Biedrins would be great and having Harrington as a 6th man works... if the Warriors need to go big, well whats a bigger athletic lineup than Baron, Sjax, Odom, Harrington and Biedrins...

lastly, the Warriors would still have Cro, Bukie, Watson and Wright to fill out the roster.. its not like Nellie goes 10 guys anyways..

I'd have to second you on this one mc (although I'd hate losing Marco). Also, props to Shrink for his proposal. Regardless of whether or not this would ever happen (which I seriously doubt), it's the first deal I've ever seen you propose which was reasonably fair towards the Warriors and not intended to give them the short end of the stick.

[shrink]

-= original quote snipped =-


I'd have to second you on this one mc (although I'd hate losing Marco). Also, props to Shrink for his proposal. Regardless of whether or not this would ever happen (which I seriously doubt), it's the first deal I've ever seen you propose which was reasonably fair towards the Warriors and not intended to give them the short end of the stick.

:confused:

Well, props go to Viper for the idea to try to move Odom and Vlad to get the Lakers to free agency, which I think is a fairly novel idea. All I did was work out the finances, inserting MIN because they have expirings and are able to trade production to get prospects from two teams that have a much closer time-frame on victories.

To be honest, I'm surprised that there aren't more deals on the trade boards from win-now teams trying to get production from MIN. They (and maybe SEA) is clearly the team that can most afford to trade away production.

As for the barb, I don't particularly remember making many GSW deals. I do remember saying that a Garnett deal would have to include Biedrins, but you appear to be correct -- that KG guy is too old to help anyone.

[old rem]

I think GSW has no choice BUT TO DO this trade

Take a good look at the salary hit of Odum + Vlad Rad and consider what happens if Biedrins is injured or in foul trouble.

For perspective....bear in mind Odum's current scoring is about 1 1/2 pt above what Pietrus had last year. For small $ we could have Ryan Gomes who can get 12-13 a game. Vlad would be a poor mans Croshere except he's paid over 5x more....

Combined payroll hit for Odum-Vlad.....it would probably cost less to get E Brand. Were it just about talent....this is Odum for a lot of depth guys....and that's attractive...but factor in that the front office is on an economy kick and there is bound to be somee "phase 2" to this where they find another $$ savings. If that meant we S+T Ellis + Azu----mostly to avoid payroll....I'd be bummed.