Sacramento (18-24) at Seattle (9-34)

[Ballings7]

Nice win

Almost got away, but really was needed. Balanced offensive effort, too.

Kevin with another GW shot - that's like the 4th or 5th of his career.

Salmons played good d on Wilkins there, he just had a better shot - I was kinda surprised it went in.

[a-rod]

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We'll let you know in about 3 weeks. By then even Petrie might now.

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Petrie has no idea what he wants to do to be honest.

I believe it was Herodotus who said: "Circumstances rule men. Men do not rule circumstances."

[KingInExile]

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Petrie has no idea what he wants to do to be honest.

Actually, looking at our salary for next year, I think it is very likely that he will try to move Bibby for a package that will convert at least part of his salary into expiring deals. The Maloofs don't want to pay the luxury tax, but we will be pretty close to that level with the roster the way it is (assumes Ron walks, we resign Justin and Beno and sign our draft pick and a couple minimum FAs). One of Bibby, Miller, SAR or KT have to be moved by the deadline for some sort of expiring deal(s) to keep salary where the Maloofs will be happy. Bibby is the most probable one to be moved.

But I think Petrie still does want to compete and try to make the playoffs.

[RoyalCourtJestr]

How many game WINNERS (or go-ahead for the eventual win) has Martin hit?

Spurs game 3, Chicago last year, Minnesota last year, and this one... am I missing one?

[sackings916]

Kings fans kill me. Bibby had a bad stretch in the 3rd and was crucified, then he comes through with shooting and passing in the clutch and barely a peep, maybe because he was overshadowed by Kmart but he still deserves more credit than he gets.

[pillwenney]

Kings fans kill me. Bibby had a bad stretch in the 3rd and was crucified, then he comes through with shooting and passing in the clutch and barely a peep, maybe because he was overshadowed by Kmart but he still deserves more credit than he gets.

I don't think anybody is doubting what Mike can do, moreso just whether or not it's really in our best interest to keep him around.

[SacKingZZZ]

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Actually, looking at our salary for next year, I think it is very likely that he will try to move Bibby for a package that will convert at least part of his salary into expiring deals. The Maloofs don't want to pay the luxury tax, but we will be pretty close to that level with the roster the way it is (assumes Ron walks, we resign Justin and Beno and sign our draft pick and a couple minimum FAs). One of Bibby, Miller, SAR or KT have to be moved by the deadline for some sort of expiring deal(s) to keep salary where the Maloofs will be happy. Bibby is the most probable one to be moved.

But I think Petrie still does want to compete and try to make the playoffs.

Here is what I think. Bibby stays unless something great comes along. Otherwise Ron has to be top priority so we don't lose him for nothing. Bibby can be a draft night trade if we are wanting another pick, in fact it may be the best time to move him. Or even as late as next deadline to ease the tax burden.

[pillwenney]

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Here is what I think. Bibby stays unless something great comes along. Otherwise Ron has to be top priority so we don't lose him for nothing. Bibby can be a draft night trade if we are wanting another pick, in fact it may be the best time to move him. Or even as late as next deadline to ease the tax burden.

But if we just let Ron go (or essentially move him for other expirings) then we still will be well into the tax going into next year--that is unless we move him with Kenny.

[SacKingZZZ]

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But if we just let Ron go (or essentially move him for other expirings) then we still will be well into the tax going into next year--that is unless we move him with Kenny.

My rule, not for tax reasons (what fan really gives a crap if an owner pays taxes anyway!?), is that Kenny HAS to be moved with Ron. Contracts just matchup perfectly. In a perfect world Kenny is the $$$ off the books when we come into next season. If he isn't that means we are losing value somewhere else.

I would like to think that if the Kings were guaranteed cap space in '09 they would be willing to pay tax in '08. If they aren't they're buttnuts because it may have to be that way. They could save a few million here or there by taking less salary in a trade however, a few million here, a few million there, it all adds up in the end.


What even makes it more strange is that the one seemingly legit trade for Ron had us taking on a player that is looking for a huge extension! Maybe they aren't as concerned with paying the tax as they are with receiving value???

[KingInExile]

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Here is what I think. Bibby stays unless something great comes along. Otherwise Ron has to be top priority so we don't lose him for nothing. Bibby can be a draft night trade if we are wanting another pick, in fact it may be the best time to move him. Or even as late as next deadline to ease the tax burden.

If the Kings do nothing with the roster except let Artest expire when he opts out, they have the potential to have a salary next year of right around $73M (Martin's new contract plus resigning Justin/Beno and signing a draft pick and a couple of rookie FAs). $73M may be right at the tax level next season or may even be slightly over. "Getting something" for Artest will only add to the potential that the Kings will be paying luxury tax. Based on past behavior I think it is unlikely that they will want to do that.

If the Kings keep Bibby the only way to stay under the tax is A) trade Brad (bad idea IMO), KT (yeah, right...who will take him for an expiring), or SAR (ditto); or B) waive goodbye to Beno and Justin as we watch them sign for other teams (Jimmy Jackson all over again?). I am more than happy saying goodbye to Bibby if it means getting rebuilding pieces and salary relief back in return.

[SacKingZZZ]

No, I am saying we need to MOVE Artest and move Kenny with him. I think that is the only way Kenny is moved since moving 20 + million by combining him with Brad or Mike is unlikely except for maybe a Cleveland Cavs scnenario. Letting him expire is pretty pointless because it really does nothing to help us rebuild nor does it keep us under the tax.

[Ballings7]

Going to be tough to find a team who gives in, or will take Ron along with Kenny. Also, depending on the team, the fact Ron will opt out of his contract and tour the market. Especially considering there isn't a wide range of teams where he can be traded to.

Then, the package being offered has to be decent. Not ordinary or poor, in value. That's settling for garbage and being stupid. The return for us has to have some significance in value. Another factor is that a three-way deal may well be the only option with certain teams, if it continues to go as it has gone, where a deal can't be agreed to between just the two teams.

I don't think the favorability is that good for a Ron/Kenny deal to happen - unless there are drastic changes with some teams.

I think Bibby's more reaslitic to be moved of the two, simply because he's more valuable.

[RoyalCourtJestr]

Bibby is not this teams answer. I could never downplay his contribution on the scoring end, but this team needs a passer, we are one of the worst passing teams in the league. Two passes in crunch time last night does not suddenly make him this team's passing future.

I don't think Bibby OR Beno is the answer to that, and I'd rather trade both while their value is high.

[KingInExile]

No, I am saying we need to MOVE Artest and move Kenny with him. I think that is the only way Kenny is moved since moving 20 + million by combining him with Brad or Mike is unlikely except for maybe a Cleveland Cavs scnenario. Letting him expire is pretty pointless because it really does nothing to help us rebuild nor does it keep us under the tax.

Any team that will be willing to take Artest with the knowledge that he will opt out will be a team who will have high interest in signing him this summer. They would probably also want some sort of assurance from Ron and his agent that he would resign with them over the summer. That basically means that we're talking about a strong playoff team with a legitimate shot at winning a championship in the near future. Take a look at those teams and point to just one who would be willing (or capable) to send the Kings a package of expiring deals, young prospects and a draft pick for Ron and KT. I think you will have a very hard time finding one.

[Ballings7]

Exactly what I'm saying ^... it's just not simple or an above-average possibility.

[Smills91]

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Any team that will be willing to take Artest with the knowledge that he will opt out will be a team who will have high interest in signing him this summer. They would probably also want some sort of assurance from Ron and his agent that he would resign with them over the summer. That basically means that we're talking about a strong playoff team with a legitimate shot at winning a championship in the near future. Take a look at those teams and point to just one who would be willing (or capable) to send the Kings a package of expiring deals, young prospects and a draft pick for Ron and KT. I think you will have a very hard time finding one.

Lakers
Magic
Mavs
Pistons
Suns

Are all teams that could conceiveably have interest in Ron.

[KingInExile]

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Lakers
Magic
Mavs
Pistons
Suns

Are all teams that could conceiveably have interest in Ron.

Agreed...but which of those teams are willing to or capable of offering a package of expirings, young talent and picks for Ron AND Kenny (which is SacKingZZZ's wish).

Lakers...could put a deal together that would include Kwame Brown and filler (with luck Crittenton would be included) and possibly a pick. The question, though is WOULD the Lakers do that?

Magic...barely have enough expirings to put together to cover Artest let alone convert part of KT's contract. They also don't really have any young prospects to give up. I seriously doubt they can put a package together.

Mavs...similar to the Magic: not enough expirings and thin on young prospects.

Pistons...Maxiell would be a nice young prospect to get back, but all of their expiring deals are small. We would probably be looking at a 7 for 2 deal just to get salaries to work out. I don't see that happening.

Suns...The only scenario that would work out financially would be a trade of Ron and KT for Marion with the understanding that Marion would opt out and we would not resign him (or we resign him to a max deal and take the tax hit...I would gladly pay the tax for him). Unfortunately I don't see this as a realistic possibility.

So the Suns and the Lakers COULD put together a package for Ron and KT...but I don't think the odds are great that they WOULD put together those deals.

[SacKingZZZ]

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Any team that will be willing to take Artest with the knowledge that he will opt out will be a team who will have high interest in signing him this summer. They would probably also want some sort of assurance from Ron and his agent that he would resign with them over the summer. That basically means that we're talking about a strong playoff team with a legitimate shot at winning a championship in the near future. Take a look at those teams and point to just one who would be willing (or capable) to send the Kings a package of expiring deals, young prospects and a draft pick for Ron and KT. I think you will have a very hard time finding one.

My guess is that any team taking on Ron will be looking at him as "last piece" material and be trying to get a ring THIS YEAR.

The answer to your question is: the Lakers. They have really overachieved and I wouldn't doubt if they added Ron Artest to their team they may take the west....for starters.

[SacKingZZZ]

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Agreed...but which of those teams are willing to or capable of offering a package of expirings, young talent and picks for Ron [b]AND Kenny (which is SacKingZZZ's wish). [/b]

Lakers...could put a deal together that would include Kwame Brown and filler (with luck Crittenton would be included) and possibly a pick. The question, though is WOULD the Lakers do that?

Magic...barely have enough expirings to put together to cover Artest let alone convert part of KT's contract. They also don't really have any young prospects to give up. I seriously doubt they can put a package together.

Mavs...similar to the Magic: not enough expirings and thin on young prospects.

Pistons...Maxiell would be a nice young prospect to get back, but all of their expiring deals are small. We would probably be looking at a 7 for 2 deal just to get salaries to work out. I don't see that happening.

Suns...The only scenario that would work out financially would be a trade of Ron and KT for Marion with the understanding that Marion would opt out and we would not resign him (or we resign him to a max deal and take the tax hit...I would gladly pay the tax for him). Unfortunately I don't see this as a realistic possibility.

So the Suns and the Lakers COULD put together a package for Ron and KT...but I don't think the odds are great that they WOULD put together those deals.

Don't read something into what I didn't write. I dont think EVERY situation can or would involve young talent AND picks. We may have to sacrifice one or the other depending on what that given team has. As long as we dump KT for a shorter deal, I will be OK.

Also don't forget that Petrie is the master of piggybacking onto other trades to get what he wants. For example that rumored Kobe deal.

[KingInExile]

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Don't read something into what I didn't write. I dont think EVERY situation can or would involve young talent AND picks. We may have to sacrifice one or the other depending on what that given team has. As long as we dump KT for a shorter deal, I will be OK.

Also don't forget that Petrie is the master of piggybacking onto other trades to get what he wants. For example that rumored Kobe deal.

Wasn't trying to imply that you were only interested in deals that included picks, young talent and expirings. Those are criteria that I think would be the only reasonable return for a team that theoretically should be rebuilding. My statement was just pointing out that you wanted the deal to include KT, that's all.