This is a good trade for Memphis

[Al n' Perk No Layups!]

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I guarantee you that Luol Deng is one very happy man right now. He is either going to get a max deal from Memphis or Chicago. He can't lose.

Why would Memphis overpay Luol Deng when they have Gay, who is better?

[chakdaddy]

The point is they essentially didn't do a single thing except erase Gasol's contract. They didn't get anything of value for him, the Lakers didn't give up anything. Gasol is a good big man, and the Lakers got him for NOTHING. A low pick who hasn't played, and two future low picks, and an expiring contract which would have just lapsed at the end of the year. All utterly negligible quantities.

A remotely competent GM would have called the bluff, demanded at least a good draft pick in return; instead they erased their best player from the roster and got ABSOLUTELY nothing in return. Anything would have been a better steal for them.

This is a Sam Smith, Peter Vescey, Malik Rose for Kevin Garnett straight up, "you aren't winning with assets, so you should trade your assets to me for nothing" deal. I mean to the extent that the league should block the freakin trade on some Ted Stepien type business.

[chakdaddy]

I think someone like Gasol would be pretty much a best case scenario if you want to give a max contract out on the FA market - anyone better will never change teams as a FA. He's nearly a franchise big man, just not a good defender.

Bynum's overrated, everyone hyping up a 10 and 10 guy, but he certainly should improve. But I'll take Al Jefferson any day of the week over him. But now LA is a real contender.

I'm so mad, Memphis basically has just screwed up the balance of the league, giving us another competitor. Maybe it will just wear out the west champs more this way and give the east a better chance in the finals though.

[BrokenLeftyJumper]

A remotely competent GM would have called the bluff, demanded at least a good draft pick in return; instead they erased their best player from the roster and got ABSOLUTELY nothing in return. Anything would have been a better steal for them.

This is a Sam Smith, Peter Vescey, Malik Rose for Kevin Garnett straight up, "you aren't winning with assets, so you should trade your assets to me for nothing" deal. I mean to the extent that the league should block the freakin trade on some Ted Stepien type business.

I think it's addition by subtraction. They get flexibility. They get the opportunity to improve their roster drastically. They get ping pong balls and cap space. With an already good young core, they are gonna have some of the most assets (good young players, high draft pick, and cap space) in the league this summer.

The other flaw to your argument is your assuming other deals were out there that could have netted something Memphis needed more than lottery balls and cap space. There wasn't.

They weren't gonna get a high draft pick for Gasol, bad teams who would have high picks don't want Gasol and his big deal. Name one bad team that would want Gasol for a high draft pick.

The value of picking up a Ben Gordon or Luol Deng wouldn't have been better than the lotto balls and the cap space they got. BG or Deng would have made the team stay at the current pace, while duplicating a player they already had, and then probably be required to get overpaid this summer.

Only good teams would have wanted Gasol, teams that feel like Gasol might be the difference between a title or not. Teams like the Lakers. Those teams don't have high draft picks. Nor do they usually want to give up good players, because the move becomes horizontal.

Overall, I think people are overrating Gasol's trade value. As Truehoop said today, Chicago refused to trade Nocioni in a deal for Gasol. Says something. He's a good player, but his contract made his value pretty low.

[chakdaddy]

1. Oh come on, Zach Randolph, you're better than that.

How is it dissimilar from the Zach Randolph situation? Guys who get paid to be your #1 option but aren't good enough to build a successful team around, it sticks a team to perpetual mediocrity. I think Gasol is better than Zach but not by too much. And that trade turned out looking pretty good for the Blazers.

Why do you say the trade is looking good for the Blazers? They had a good team plus Zach Randolph, now they have a good team plus Channing Frye. They had a good team either way, but they'd have an even better team if they'd gotten something good for Randolph.

Do you understand that trading someone for the sake of trading them isn't a good idea unless you get something of appropriate value in return?


It's like Memphis had a 2nd house and couldn't afford the property tax, even though it's a nice house and had value. So they sold it for 20 bucks...it's a good deal because they're not losing money on the property tax now, right?

[BrokenLeftyJumper]

Why do you say the trade is looking good for the Blazers?

I don't know. Maybe because they are way better than last year. They are also looking to have a ton of cap room in the near future when some big names are gonna be out there.

Do you understand that trading someone for the sake of trading them isn't a good idea unless you get something of appropriate value in return?

Do you understand that getting cap space and more ping pong balls is appropriate value? They might not have got it from the Lakers, but that's the end result. Those two assets right there are gonna help them more in the long run than any player they might have got in the deal.

It's like Memphis had a 2nd house and couldn't afford the property tax, even though it's a nice house and had value. So they sold it for 20 bucks...it's a good deal because they're not losing money on the property tax now, right?

No, it's like Memphis had an okay house and was paying a ridiculous property tax on it. So they cut their losses while they could and saved money that they could now spend on a house with a more fair property tax.

[BrokenLeftyJumper]

Oh and I'm still waiting for a realistic, better deal the Grizz could have made with Gasol that would have made more sense for them in the long run.

You throw it out there and I'll try to break it down for you.

[Joselo16]

Chris Wallace is horrible, how is it that he could not have gotten a better deal for Gasol than Kwame Brown, and garbage. They should of just held on to Gasol until the deadline see if anyone else was interested. LA came out winning here.

PS Bynum is Overrated and the LakeShow play no defense. Do you guys remember the 2 games the C's had against them??? Also Doc and Phil are a wash they are the same type of coach except one has had the fortune of coaching great players to win championships while the other hasn't until now!

[DynastyInTheMaking]

Why do they need so many PG/SG types

[sarah42]

i think this was a great trade for Memphis. gasol was this sulking dude who never really amounted to anything in the nba. he put up good stats and made the playoffs a few times - but it wasn't all him that got him to the playoffs - he had a deep team around him.

he just a bad leader and really bad defender. i've watched him enough to know that the memphis front office was probably tired of him.

why not trade him if they felt they could do better without him? why not trade him if they are going to the lottery with him as well?

its obvious rudy gay is the better player now. i think they were tired of his attitude.

[chakdaddy]

Oh and I'm still waiting for a realistic, better deal the Grizz could have made with Gasol that would have made more sense for them in the long run.

You throw it out there and I'll try to break it down for you.

Any deal where they get someone who's an actual decent prospect (ie not Crittendon) and an actual decent draft pick that's in the freaking top 20 would be a start.

I would imagine that nearly any team could put together a better deal.

How about: Tyronn Lue, Anthony Johnson, Shelden Williams, Lorenzen Wright, and a future #1 pick?

How about: just about any combination of Bulls prospects, draft picks, and PJ Brown?

How about: Biedrins, Azubukie, O'Braynt, Pietrus, Barnes, maybe a draft pick?

Most average teams could scrape together expiring contracts and offer a better draft pick, and could become a playoff team or contender by adding a big man cheaply, but Memphis would still get more tan they did from LA

[chakdaddy]

why not trade him if they felt they could do better without him? why not trade him if they are going to the lottery with him as well?
.

Why trade oen of the few valuable pieces they have for nothing? Why trade him for crap?

Why trade him for nothing when you'd be just as bad keeping him and maybe could trade him for something decent later?

Your life is bad now, with or without all your money, so give me all your money, you'll be poor and miserable either way!

[threrf23]

I could see Memphis trading Mike Miller for Bobby Jackson and Jannero Pargo

[sarah42]

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Why trade oen of the few valuable pieces they have for nothing? Why trade him for crap?

Why trade him for nothing when you'd be just as bad keeping him and maybe could trade him for something decent later?

Your life is bad now, with or without all your money, so give me all your money, you'll be poor and miserable either way!

obviously they couldn't get anything big for him this year. have you seen him play this year? they are going to the lottery anyway. its not as if he all of a sudden got old. but in this new system, he's really not that good.

i think they were sick of his attitude. sick of his bad play and thought less of his overall game.

who were they really going to get for him? some of the bulls players? with their injuries and suspect play doubt it. its not as if he's not injury prone either.

why are the lakers all of a sudden contenders? with kobe and pau they are just a playoff team. they still have to beat the spurs and mavs to get out of the west, and team chemistry has to be there as well with half the season over with and bynum out for a long time!

if he was a great defensive player - it would be easy to say title condenter. but since he's on that carlos boozer/amare stoudamire level of defense.....meh. lets not overreact for an overpaid/sulky player.

[threrf23]

How about: Tyronn Lue, Anthony Johnson, Shelden Williams, Lorenzen Wright, and a future #1 pick?

maybe, but they only get one pick out of that....Shelden Williams is bigger than Critt (obviously), but I don't think he's a better prospect, nothing amazing on the boards, not a big shot blocker, foul prone, poor offensive player, and he's five years older than Critt (I'll add based on scouting reports and such I like Critt a lot)

How about: just about any combination of Bulls prospects, draft picks, and PJ Brown?

To make that work salary-wise for both teams it would probably have to be Ben Gordon, Tyrus Thomas (or Joakim Noah, or Kryapa or Thabo), and Joe Smith. Maybe the Bulls considered that too much. I'm also not sure how many roster spots the Grizz have open. Ben Gordon IMO wouldn't have been the best fit for the future and would have demanded a large salary next year.

How about: Biedrins, Azubukie, O'Braynt, Pietrus, Barnes, maybe a draft pick?

Again, roster spots, and I'm still not sure that GS is willing to move Biedrins and a pick for Gasol, especially if they are losing wing depth in the process.

[BrokenLeftyJumper]

Tyronn Lue, Anthony Johnson, Shelden Williams, Lorenzen Wright, and a future #1 pick?

Where is the value there? Your freakin out about how bad this trade is and your presenting that as a better alternative? That's expirings, and Shelden Williams and a future #1. The Hawks don't have a #1 this year (JJ deal). So it would have to be in two years. Figuring the Hawks seem to be getting better, that pick likely isn't going to be worth more than Crittendon who was a mid-first rounder last year. I think Memphis would rather have the extra cap space this summer and the next from not having Shelden Williams deal and Crittendon right now than Shelden Williams and a 2009 mid-first rounder.

How about: just about any combination of Bulls prospects, draft picks, and PJ Brown?

Maybe if your talking in hindsight. But the Bulls don't have PJ Brown anymore. And they would only be offering BG or Deng, two guys who are gonna need to get paid and who are redundant on the Grizz roster. The Bulls also aren't gonna have a high draft pick to trade if they get Gasol. That's gonna be a mid-first rounder again and you got the same value in this deal from Crittendon.

How about: Biedrins, Azubukie, O'Braynt, Pietrus, Barnes, maybe a draft pick?

The only thing of real value for Memphis in this deal is Biedrins. And Biedrins is going to have to be resigned next year, sucking up a big chunk of that cap space. Would Memphis rather have the cap space and the possibility of an actual impact player or Biedrins with a slightly bloated deal and pretty much no chance of signing a big FA? I think the cap space is more valuable.

Most average teams could scrape together expiring contracts and offer a better draft pick, and could become a playoff team or contender by adding a big man cheaply, but Memphis would still get more tan they did from LA

It's easy to speak in generalities. You have yet to give one actual example of these deals that average teams could have offered which would have been better for Memphis.

Your life is bad now, with or without all your money, so give me all your money, you'll be poor and miserable either way!

Chill with the analogies. They just aren't working. The fact is the broker you get in the NBA, the more likely it is that you gonna get rich quick.

[Rocky5000]

The lakers had to sign Aaron McKie in order to make the deal work. He won't even play a game for either team. That's how big of a stretch it is to call this a good trade. And now the Grizzlies are going to buy out Kwame Brown? They're left with the laker's version of Gabe Pruitt and a couple of low first round picks. If Brown is only wanted for his salary, any crappy highly paid player on any team will do. They should at least have traded him out of their own conference. But Gasol is a big enough name that it may have been possible for them to get a player like Shawn Marion. His contract lasts one more year than Kwame's but he's 100x the player. He'd also fit in with the new coach

[Jammer]

BrokenLeftyJumper is right.

It's a good trade for Memphis. They are obviously tanking for a high pick this year and next year.
__________________________________________________________
Lakers get Pau Gasol & Grizzlies 2010 2nd Round Pick.
__________________________________________________________

Grizz get $3 Million Cash and

Lakers 2008 & 2010 First Round Picks and

Javaris Crittenton (Age 19, 2007 # 19 pick), SG and

Kwame Brown, expiring contract who will likely be waived, and

Aaron Mckie, unguaranteed contract, will possibly be waived and

Rights to Marc Gasol, 2007 # 48 pick playing in Spain.
___________________________________________________________
The following is courtesy of Sham.

This is what Memphis has committed for next year.


Mike Jesus Miller: $9,128,575
Darko Milicic: $7,020,000
Brian Cardinal: $6,300,000
Swift or Collins (they earn the same): $6,200,000
Mike Conley: $3,630,480
Rudy Gay: $2,579,400
Hakim Warrick: $2,119,102
Kyle Lowry: $1,163,520

Total: $34,871,077 (my #)

Total doesn't include Stoudamire's buyout, which is somewhere between $0 and $2.3 million. Probably about somewhere halfway between.



FREE AGENTS TO BE RENOUNCED BECAUSE WHO GIVES A TOSS:

Andre Brown (cap hold would be $963,263)
Casey Jacobsen (cap hold would be $924,732)
Kwame Brown (cap hold would be $13,612,500)


FREE AGENTS THEY'LL WANT TO KEEP:

Juan Carlos Navarro (cap hold $645,708 (my number, not Sham's))


AARON MCKIE:

Will have an unguaranteed contract and will be waived. Might even happen immediately.



FIRST ROUNDER:

Its cap hold will range from $4,019,000 for the 1st pick to $2,394,600 for sixth. For argument's sake, we'll assume that they'll pick no worse than that.



ROSTER CHARGE:

For only having 11 players under contract, including renouncements, an additional cap hold of $442,114 will be billed for the 12th spot.




Now, for argument's sake, let's assume Damon got exactly half of his guaranteed money, leaving a buyout of $1.15 million with no set-off. Let's assume that all except Navarro are renounced, and let's assume that they pick third.

That gives Memphis a salary figure, before free agency, of $43,905,468, versus a salary cap of $57 millionish.

That's almost max cap room. It's certainly enough for almost anybody. But without Bird rights on Navarro due to Wallace's aforementioned incompetence over signing him, they'll have to delve into that to bring him back, which takes out a small chunk.

Anyway, long story short, they can afford to make signifcant offers to restricted free agents, possibly outbidding some teams who didn't expect Memphis to be players.


But, now look at the depth chart:

PG - Conley, Lowry, Crittenton
SG - Miller, Navarro
SF - Gay, Warrick
PF - The mighty Brian Cardinal
C - Milicic, Collins


It's easy to see how they want to prioritise power forwards first. Hmmm, if only they had a star one......

With them that much under the cap, Danny Ainge might even be able to ship them Scalabrine, if they don't get the free agents they'll likely aim at.

[canman1971]

2 picks in the 20s and cap space IMO is not a good deal, but when you look at Chris Wallace's past, I guess it is a slight improvement.

[captain_cheapseats]

The easy reaction upon seeing "Gasol for Kwame" is to think "wow, Grizz got hosed." Now, I know a lot of people on this board are extremely reactionary so I'm gonna try to lay out it nice and simple.

Which you did a nice job of. However, IMO the problem is that you're judging the trade by comparing it to what the situation would have been if the trade were never made. Instead, you should be judging the trade on the basis of its opportunity cost. And when you think of it that way, the Griz got hosed. Do you honestly believe that they couldn't have gotten a better deal elsewhere with a little patience?