Is the Gasol deal substanially better than the Carter deal?

[Trianoball]

The answer is no.

Gasol is a much, much, much more valuable piece than Vince was at the time of his deal - with out getting into too much detail, Gasol is a young, effective 7 footer with a lot of skill. Not to mention Vince slowly but surely getting comfortable, and weak, in his new uniform - like most knew he would.

People still laugh at Babcock for the Carter deal. Yesterday's trade should make a lot people realize that the Carter deal was nowhere near as bad as they insist.

And everybody should publicly apologize to Babcock.

[BoBBo!]

Is this thread substantially better than the other half dozen threads which directly or indirectly compare the two trades?

The answer is IBTL...

[Trianoball]

Is this thread substantially better than the other half dozen threads which directly or indirectly compare the two trades?

The answer is IBTL...

Just apologize to Babcock.

[Mad Balla 15]

Kwame Brown is a 9M expiring contract which is what we had to pay for the buyout to Alonzo who refuesd to report. Secondly, Javaris is a good young looking player compared to the Williams'. This is not to say Memphis got a good deal because they certainly did not but those two things I mentioned make it a better deal than the Carter deal.

[AB_21]

Gasol deal got an expiring contract. We got 2 scrubs, a guy that costed us a lot of money and two mid-round draft picks. The Gasol deal was better because they got 2 first rounders, Crittenton AND Kwame's expiring deal.

[bstein14]

I think its better. You got bad contracts, one a player you had to pay to not even show up in town.

That's terrible.

Gasol is putting up 18 and 8 as probably the 2nd best player on a terrible team.

Memphis did ok for a player who'd going to make $15, $16.5, and $18.0 million the next 3 years.

[Trianoball]

Gasol deal got an expiring contract. We got 2 scrubs, a guy that costed us a lot of money and two mid-round draft picks. The Gasol deal was better because they got 2 first rounders, Crittenton AND Kwame's expiring deal.

And Gasol is a much more valuable piece than Carter.

No matter how hard you get when see Carter drive every once an while, the truth is, he's not that effective. And he's a 2/3.

Gasol is a very effective player, and plays a position that's hard to fill.

[Chandler55]

joey graham is better than all of those pieces combined just you watch

[The Letter V]

Just because MEM agreed to let LAL (edit) them, does not make the Carter deal any better than what it was beforehand.

They were both one sided garbage trades.

[Trianoball]

I think its better. You got bad contracts, one a player you had to pay to not even show up in town.

That's terrible.

Gasol is putting up 18 and 8 as probably the 2nd best player on a terrible team.

Memphis did ok for a player who'd going to make $15, $16.5, and $18.0 million the next 3 years.

What is Carter's current rep around the league? Seemingly not very impressive. And consider how much worse it was while he was still a Raptor.

That's why we didn't do as well as Memphis in our deal...and that's also why, relatively speaking, the return both teams got for their "franchise players" is basically the same.

[inrapscity]

the answer is yes.

MEM got huge expiring contract of Kwane.

TOR got expensive buyout of Mourning, non-expiring contracts of EWill and AaWill.

Yes, Nets pick was higher but we got Graham (instead of Granger, arg). Next pick was dealt to NY in order to get the huge expiring in Davis (which was good).

[Trianoball]

Just because MEM agreed to let LAL rape them, does not make the Carter deal any better than what it was beforehand.

They were both one sided garbage trades.

No. The point is that trades don't neccessarily reap instant rewards.

I'd say we're much better off than NJ, at this point, as a result of that specific trade. And a lot of smart, patient people realized that as soon as the saw the details of the deal.

[Trianoball]

the answer is yes.

MEM got huge expiring contract of Kwane.

TOR got expensive buyout of Mourning, non-expiring contracts of EWill and AaWill.

Yes, Nets pick was higher but we got Graham (instead of Granger, arg). Next pick was dealt to NY in order to get the huge expiring in Davis (which was good).

But do you also recgonize the fact that Carter is a less valuable piece than Gasol?

[BoBBo!]

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Just apologize to Babcock.

I would if I criticized him like so many others, but I was mostly a Babcock apologist with regards to both the Araujo selection and the Carter trade.

You cannot expect a new GM to properly prepare for a top-10 draft pick for a completely new organization - requiring countless hours of player evaluation both in terms of prospective draftees and current roster base - in two weeks' time!

And with regards to the Carter trade, I supported him initially as I felt that Alonzo Mourning would have been our answer at the centre position alongside Bosh. Unfortunately information came out that Zo would not play for Toronto and Thorn alerted Babcock of the matter prior to consummating the trade. Once this key piece of information was released, I could not support Rob's foolish decision to trade an all-star to a division rival for 10 cents on the dollar and an IOU to a player for another 10 cents to just go away...

[Fenris-77]

At the time though Vince was anything but a semi-effective 2-3, he was an all star player with really high visibility. Gasol might be a better piece right now, but I hardly think that many would have agreed at the time (except Toronto fans maybe ).

All that aside, the only fair way to evaluate the two(apparently) losing sides, is to take a look at where they're at after the trade. Toronto looked terrible and was paying a lot of money for guys who never saw the floor. Memphis has slashed their cap like a Compton white wall, added a promising young PG, and added two first round picks.

I don't think anyone is arguing that the talent level is equal (obviously it's not). However, Memphis is now in a very flexible cap position with a nice stable of young players - both excellent things for a rebuilding franchise. When you add in their own high pick in next years draft I think that the Memphis management is very happy indeed.

[Trianoball]

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And with regards to the Carter trade, I supported him initially as I felt that Alonzo Mourning would have been our answer at the centre position alongside Bosh. Unfortunately information came out that Zo would not play for Toronto and Thorn alerted Babcock of the matter prior to consummating the trade. Once this key piece of information was released, I could not support Rob's foolish decision to trade an all-star to a division rival for 10 cents on the dollar and an IOU to a player for another 10 cents to just go away...

What's the difference? It has worked out beautifully for us in the end. Icing on the cake is that NJ is now screwed...stuck with a huge Carter contract, and all the frustration and dissapointment that he absolutely always brings with him.

[Rooster]

I think its better. You got bad contracts, one a player you had to pay to not even show up in town.

That's terrible.

Gasol is putting up 18 and 8 as probably the 2nd best player on a terrible team.

Memphis did ok for a player who'd going to make $15, $16.5, and $18.0 million the next 3 years.

Sorry, who am I forgetting?

[Fenris-77]

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What's the difference? It has worked out beautifully for us in the end. Icing on the cake is that NJ is now screwed...stuck with a huge Carter contract, and all the frustration and dissapointment that he absolutely always brings with him.

The difference is you can't use multiple years of 20-20 hindsight to evaluate the trade. Not in any kind of fair or logical way.

[The Letter V]

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No. The point is that trades don't neccessarily reap instant rewards.

I'd say we're much better off than NJ, at this point, as a result of that specific trade. And a lot of smart, patient people realized that as soon as the saw the details of the deal.

You have to differentiate between the trade itself and the rebuilding process that inevitably follows it. Getting rid of the old soon to be washed up franchise player, to make room for the budding young star is surely beneficial in the long run, but it is not part of the trade itself.

What I'm saying is, though this trade will help them down the road when they have solid up and coming team, they could've helped themselves alot more by getting a little bit more value in the trade. If they would've gotten another young guy, say Tyrus Thomas or something, it would've been much better for them. Same goes for us.

[Trianoball]

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The difference is you can't use multiple years of 20-20 hindsight to evaluate the trade. Not in any kind of fair or logical way.

I'm not. While initially disappointed, I soon realized that NBA GM's are not quite as dumb as Vince Carter fans, and they knew what I knew: Vince is a talented player, with A LOT of issues. Issues that almost guarantee that he will never have superstar, or even all-star, effectiveness.

So I was quite content with the deal, looking ahead to the near future in which we would have the cap-room to sign some good pieces to better round out our team.

That's how I felt then, and that's how I feel now about the very similar Gasol deal.