Having Korver makes the Jazz a significantly better team.

stevebozell · Post #141 » by **stevebozell** » Sun Feb 3, 2008 3:38 pm

All I can say is, if like according to alot of you Gira bashers he really was always this bad, our management is worse than I thought for trading for him and signing him to an extension. Were they that blind?

The Sheik · Post #142 » by **The Sheik** » Sun Feb 3, 2008 6:27 pm

red4hf wrote:-= original quote snipped =-

Not this year he isn't better....... Not as a Jazz player he isn't better........

So again, how does he get the green light?

Korver= .355

Gira= .353

Korver= .353

Gira= .326

Again...what are you talking about? I understand the margin is not much, but Korver is better this season.

stevebozell · Post #143 » by **stevebozell** » Sun Feb 3, 2008 6:41 pm

So based on those numbers, he should have the green light to chuck at will but Gira shouldnt have it?(I feel stupid arguing this point, because I think he should have the green light, but I thought Gira should have had it too).

The Sheik · Post #144 » by **The Sheik** » Sun Feb 3, 2008 6:46 pm

stevebozell wrote:So based on those numbers, he should have the green light to chuck at will but Gira shouldnt have it?(I feel stupid arguing this point, because I think he should have the green light, but I thought Gira should have had it too).

I think Gira should have had it too and I think he did. He typically got his 3's being open out of ball movement and coming off a baseline screen. The only point I was trying to make was red saying that Gira (statistically) is a better shooter. I honestly dont find Korver to be a chuck. He is a career 40% 3pt shooter and for the most part he is getting his shots out of the offense. One of the few "chuck" shots I thought was at the end of the Washington game, where we had a huge lead.

Jazzfan Bayamon · Post #145 » by **Jazzfan Bayamon** » Sun Feb 3, 2008 6:47 pm

stevebozell wrote:So based on those numbers, he should have the green light to chuck at will but Gira shouldnt have it?(I feel stupid arguing this point, because I think he should have the green light, but I thought Gira should have had it too).

It's not just the shot, it's the type of shot.

I've not seen Korver pumfake and OPEN shot, to force and take a bad contested shot ONCE. Giri did that ALL the time. That's the difference with Harp also (for red). So Sloan and his staff didn't like that, I didn't like that and most Jazz fans didn't either so there you go.

stevebozell · Post #146 » by **stevebozell** » Sun Feb 3, 2008 6:50 pm

So Korvers bad shot is jacking, and clanking, a 3 with 20 seconds still on the shot clock and a guy wide open underneath. Either way, their both bad shots that hurt the team.

ColdBlue · Post #147 » by **ColdBlue** » Sun Feb 3, 2008 7:00 pm

The point all of you are missing is how confidence comes into play. Giri's confidence was affected by Sloan. Giri always had the '2nd guessing' going on when he was faced with a decision of whether to shoot/pass/drive. I think Giri's instincts would be to shoot the ball if the shot is there, but once you start 2nd guessing things... it leads to dumb mistakes.

red4hf · Post #148 » by **red4hf** » Sun Feb 3, 2008 7:39 pm

sodapop wrote:-= original quote snipped =-

Our record with Giricek in the 25 games he played was 11 wins and 14 losses that's a 44.0 percentage. The records don't show it.

Just keep throwing out the made up statistics. It takes away any credibility your argument may have.

What kind of drugs are you on, seriously?????

In 2003-2004 after we traded for Giri we went 16 and 9, that's a .640 winning percentage....... What was our record before him, 26 and 31......

That is significantly better.......

Either you have no clue what you are talking about, or you need to repeat third grade math, because you can't add, subtract or divide.......

stevebozell · Post #149 » by **stevebozell** » Sun Feb 3, 2008 7:41 pm

red4hf wrote: Either you have no clue what you are talking about, or you need to repeat third grade math, because you can't add, subtract or divide.......

:lol:

red4hf · Post #150 » by **red4hf** » Sun Feb 3, 2008 7:42 pm

The Sheik wrote:-= original quote snipped =-

Korver= .355

Gira= .353

Korver= .353

Gira= .326

Again...what are you talking about? I understand the margin is not much, but Korver is better this season.

Those numbers are after yesterday's game, where Korver had a great night shooting the ball......

When I posted, yesterday, his numbers were actually below Giri's......

red4hf · Post #151 » by **red4hf** » Sun Feb 3, 2008 7:47 pm

See, I don't get it, Korver is a "great" shooter with a career FG% of .421, but Giri is a "chucker" with a career FG% of .440....... And Giri averages more assists per minute played FOR HIS CAREER........

How does that work?

stevebozell · Post #152 » by **stevebozell** » Sun Feb 3, 2008 7:48 pm

Well Red, Giras percentage is only that high because of Sloans influence on him during his time here. :wink:

red4hf · Post #153 » by **red4hf** » Sun Feb 3, 2008 7:55 pm

stevebozell wrote:Well Red, Giras percentage is only that high because of Sloans influence on him during his time here.

Yeah, that must be it........ :rofl:

Pai Gow · Post #154 » by **Pai Gow** » Sun Feb 3, 2008 10:36 pm

red4hf wrote:See, I don't get it, Korver is a "great" shooter with a career FG% of .421, but Giri is a "chucker" with a career FG% of .440....... And Giri averages more assists per minute played FOR HIS CAREER........

How does that work?

Because sometimes FG% doesn't tell the a true story, how about you try something like eFG%, ESPECIALLY, because it favors players who take a lot of perimeter shots.

Gordan efg%= .483
Korver efg%= .534

And that's why Korver gets a green light here and in Philly, and on a side note, Korver is shooting a efg% of .585 with us so far which is incredible considering you guys think he's shooting bad.

Gordan profile:
http://www.basketball-reference.com/pla ... cgo01.html

Korver profile:
http://www.basketball-reference.com/pla ... eky01.html

Pai Gow · Post #155 » by **Pai Gow** » Sun Feb 3, 2008 10:40 pm

ColdBlue wrote:The point all of you are missing is how confidence comes into play. Giri's confidence was affected by Sloan. Giri always had the '2nd guessing' going on when he was faced with a decision of whether to shoot/pass/drive. I think Giri's instincts would be to shoot the ball if the shot is there, but once you start 2nd guessing things... it leads to dumb mistakes.

That's such a garbage excuse, he got steady minutes for a looooooooooong time and did not perform whether he was taking bad shots or good shots. It really is a tired excuse having to hear it all the time. Also when does professionalism come to play, I mean honestly? You think after 3 years of steady practice and Sloan telling him what they wanted from him IN games that eventually he would figure it out and not make those dumb mistakes, can you honestly tell me that he couldn't figure it out because of confidence? I don't buy it.

Jazzfan Bayamon · Post #156 » by **Jazzfan Bayamon** » Sun Feb 3, 2008 10:45 pm

AKsWill wrote:-= original quote snipped =-

That's such a garbage excuse, he got steady minutes for a looooooooooong time and did not perform whether he was taking bad shots or good shots. It really is a tired excuse having to hear it all the time. Also when does professionalism come to play, I mean honestly? You think after 3 years of steady practice and Sloan telling him what they wanted from him IN games that eventually he would figure it out and not make those dumb mistakes, can you honestly tell me that he couldn't figure it out because of confidence? I don't buy it.

It's like talking to a brick wall my man. A word out to all the sane posters that have posted here... stop!! No matter what you say, they'll keep at it, and to be honest, I am sick to my stomach with Giricek. I am VERY glad he is gone, and I don't want to here anything from that bum again. HE'S NOT WITH THE JAZZ ANYMORE, SO GIVE IT A REST!!!

So by not posting anymore, these "other" guys won't have anything to "reply" to so it can finally DIE as it should have a LONG time ago.

red4hf · Post #157 » by **red4hf** » Sun Feb 3, 2008 11:40 pm

AKsWill wrote:-= original quote snipped =-

Because sometimes FG% doesn't tell the a true story, how about you try something like eFG%, ESPECIALLY, because it favors players who take a lot of perimeter shots.

Gordan efg%= .483
Korver efg%= .534

And that's why Korver gets a green light here and in Philly, and on a side note, Korver is shooting a efg% of .585 with us so far which is incredible considering you guys think he's shooting bad.

Gordan profile:
http://www.basketball-reference.com/pla ... cgo01.html

Korver profile:
http://www.basketball-reference.com/pla ... eky01.html

Why would I go with a made up statistic?

It's interesting, nobody wants to pay attention to +/- statistic, which shows that Giri is a hell of a lot more effective and beneficial to the Jazz than Harpring, but a statistic which takes into account some shots, but for some inexplicable reason leaves others off, is supposed to make all the difference?

Give me a freaking break.......

If Korver is such a great shooter from the 2 range, how come he doesn't take more shots from that range? The answer is pretty simple, he's not good at getting his shot off close to the basket, unlike Giri...... That's why he takes so many jumpshots.......

That's why only 23% of Giri's points have come off threes, while Korver's percentage stands at a whopping 56%....... Got an explanation for that?

red4hf · Post #158 » by **red4hf** » Sun Feb 3, 2008 11:42 pm

[quote="AKsWill"]-= original quote snipped =-

That's such a garbage excuse, he got steady minutes for a looooooooooong time and did not perform whether he was taking bad shots or good shots. [quote]

Please be so kind as to show us these stretches when Giricek got "steady" minutes and did not perform........

ColdBlue · Post #159 » by **ColdBlue** » Sun Feb 3, 2008 11:49 pm

AKsWill wrote:-= original quote snipped =-

That's such a garbage excuse, he got steady minutes for a looooooooooong time and did not perform whether he was taking bad shots or good shots. It really is a tired excuse having to hear it all the time. Also when does professionalism come to play, I mean honestly? You think after 3 years of steady practice and Sloan telling him what they wanted from him IN games that eventually he would figure it out and not make those dumb mistakes, can you honestly tell me that he couldn't figure it out because of confidence? I don't buy it.

So are you saying that Giri had a high confidence? Did Sloan give Giri the green light to go out and shoot the ball when he was open, but Giri just made bad decisions in spite of his overwhelming confidence in his game that Sloan gave him? I don't buy that either.

What are you trying to say?

ColdBlue · Post #160 » by **ColdBlue** » Sun Feb 3, 2008 11:59 pm

Jazzfan Bayamon wrote:-= original quote snipped =-

It's like talking to a brick wall my man. A word out to all the sane posters that have posted here... stop!! No matter what you say, they'll keep at it, and to be honest, I am sick to my stomach with Giricek. I am VERY glad he is gone, and I don't want to here anything from that bum again. HE'S NOT WITH THE JAZZ ANYMORE, SO GIVE IT A REST!!!

So by not posting anymore, these "other" guys won't have anything to "reply" to so it can finally DIE as it should have a LONG time ago.

The bandwagon rolls home...