Is the Gasol deal substanially better than the Carter deal?

[ruckus]

-= original quote snipped =-



Would you agree that Garnett is a vastly, VASTLY superior player to VC of 2004?

I find it perfectly acceptable that they got a very good player, a couple good young players, and a few picks. And I also think, relatively speaking, it gives one a good feel for why the little we got for the 2004 Carter is acceptable.

How does the Garnett trade or the Gasol trade or any other trade make the VC trade any less of a steaming pile?

Thats like saying, "I bought a '93 Taurus yesterday for $8,000.00. I know its a crap deal but, since you bought a '91 Accent for $10,000.00, that makes my crap deal less crap."

[alfie123]

So have we reached the point where people are going to be willing to agree to disagree?

You mods..are a tricky bunch.
Why make that comment for? Do you want people to get out of hand so you can lock the thread?

[omeloon]

No one cares that the deal didn't hurt the Raptors. That's not the goal of a trade involving your team's most marketable player and all-star. You either get some significant pieces that help you move forward in a new direction, or get an equal star back. Jamison and Ray Allen at least brought back top 10 picks along with bad deals.

Its not that Babcock screwed this team badly, its just that he did very little to help besides finding Calderon. Our big contracts had to expire eventually. Having a top 10 pick four years in a row in the East won't hurt either. Babcock kept us bad, which helped us get better. If he didn't mess up the Araujo pick we probably would have been a much different team. I'd like to think we'd be much better, but who knows how things would have changed. Many would argue that Parker was our MVP's last season. We were able to turn things around so quickly because of the team players Bryan was able to bring in and because of the winning culture he created by bringing in Rasho (who could have been had for peanuts anyways), Ford, Parker, and Garbo. Getting rid of the negativity surrounding Araujo was also a huge move.

[Pchu]

-= original quote snipped =-



And what a mess... A catastrophe of Isiaic proportions.

Let's call a spade a spade:

It was a mess.

Before Emery took over:

We have Jalen Rose around for 1 + year, at Max contract. The Williams are still here, and complaining. We have Hoffa, one of the worst player in the league around. We don't have alot of hope.

The worst thing is: Chris Bosh wouldn't have signed the extension.

If Babcock is still around, do you think he could traded Hoffa for Hump? I doubt he would trade Hoffa at all. He wouldn't trade Rose for sure, and you probably won't see TJ Ford either. Bosh would probably asked for a trade...

[whysoserious]

-= original quote snipped =-



Would you agree that Garnett is a vastly, VASTLY superior player to VC of 2004?

I find it perfectly acceptable that they got a very good player, a couple good young players, and a few picks. And I also think, relatively speaking, it gives one a good feel for why the little we got for the 2004 Carter is acceptable.

What do all these other deals have to do with the VC deal? Absolutely nothing.

Just 'cause other teams got more or less, doesn't suddenly make the VC deal any less of a mistake.

Once again, you fail to address some of the standard criteria of making such a move.

Picks, Prospects and Capspace. Babcock failed on two of the three and thus the deal was not a good trade.

[Tyler_Durden76]

Quote:

Let's call a spade a spade:

It was a mess.

Before Emery took over:

We have Jalen Rose around for 1 + year, at Max contract. The Williams are still here, and complaining. We have Hoffa, one of the worst player in the league around. We don't have alot of hope.

The worst thing is: Chris Bosh wouldn't have signed the extension.

If Babcock is still around, do you think he could traded Hoffa for Hump? I doubt he would trade Hoffa at all. He wouldn't trade Rose for sure, and you probably won't see TJ Ford either. Bosh would probably asked for a trade...

-------------------------------------

I second the person who posted about the catastrophic mess...

Prior to Embry yes the Raps was a mess. Most of the problems were a result of the VC trade. This is why the Gasol deal was a lot better as mentioned by other posters than the Babcock deal.

Most people have taken BC for granted. Without BC and still having Babcock running the show, the Raptors will be a team worst than the Bucks, a place where no players want to play for hence creating a revolving door of players, with no direction and a negative atmosphere.

If Babcock was still GM you can bet that Jalen's salary will be off the books via expiration and the 2 Williams players may still be in the roster complaining, Bosh would have left after not signing the extension, Calderon may not be as good as Mitchell would have been fired after another atrocious season and yes the Raptors are lotto bound once again. With Babcock's rep I bet he would pick Ammo instead of Bargiani and may pick another lemon out of last draft as well. With Bosh gone, Villanueva will be trusted to be the main star of the team, and that does not look good on paper.

With Bosh not signing the extension who knows what Babcock would get if he does try to deal him, but after the VC fiasco I doubt anything would have happen on the trade front, Bosh would just walk out like TMac did previously. (FYI, do you know the Lakers were lowballing Babcock to acquire Bosh? This is due to Bosh going public saying he will not sign an extension with the Raptors unless there is positive management changes. Phil Jackson was so bold to even announce that he would love to see Bosh wearing a Lakers jersey the next season. Seems to me everyone forgot that episode.)

To top it off, for sure Hoffa would still be in the Raps roster and most likely Babcock would have picked up the option years of his contract. Yikes, there will be no hope to this team and if he continues to run the franchise like this, it wont be long before people stop coming to see the games and the Raps will move to the states permanently after an ownership sale.

To be honest, I believe David Stern has something to do with the pressure to fire Babcock and hire BC. He is very concerned about losing the last Canadian team, it would have marked that his strategy to turn NBA into a global league have failed.

------------------------------------

You can now imagine the 2007-08 roster of the Raptors run by Babcock:

PF Villanueva/Bonner/AaWilliams
SF Brewer(*)/Balkman/EWilliams
C Araujo/Skolar/Sow
SG Morrison(*)/Graham
PG Calderon/Ukic/DMartin

[Shaazzam]

To be honest, I believe David Stern has something to do with the pressure to fire Babcock. He is very concerned about losing the last Canadian team, it would have marked that his strategy to turn NBA into a global league have failed.

He was the one that recommended that MLSE use the agency that they did in order to speak to BC. I have always taken that to mean that he basically put the two together. TO is a serious global market, and is really an excellent conduit to other countries. It requires excellent management, or else the NBA would simply be wasting it's potential.