Keeping up with the Joneses

[Pootie41]

This is the only way I can see us competing with the Lakers and Suns after their recent trades.

Having Z will allow Dirk to be the scorer he should be. Damp and Diop have no offensive games which allows the opposing team to double Dirk and clog up the paint.

Z can play the post and can shoot. Allowing Dirk to use his post game better and Dirk's shooting would make Z a better post player.

Why would the Cavs do it? Damp and LeBron would be a better defensive tandem and Terry could be the offensive point guard they need to complement LeBron. Though if I was the Cavs and had Z I wouldn't trade him. But I wouldn't have traded Shaq or Pau for what they did either, so maybe weird trades are contagious? We should have other pieces to throw in as well though to make the dela work I would deal Nahs or Devin or both for Z if they wanted them too. We can replace these types of players. We can't get the things Z brings to the table making Dirk the player he should be.



http://www.realgm.com/src_checktrade.ph ... id=4479329


Dallas Trade Breakdown
Change in Team Outlook: -5.6 ppg, +1.0 rpg, and -1.0 apg. Incoming Players
Eric Snow
6-3 PG from Michigan State
0.9 ppg, 0.9 rpg, 1.8 apg in 12.1 minutes
Zydrunas Ilgauskas
7-3 C from Lithuania (Foreign)
14.0 ppg, 9.6 rpg, 1.5 apg in 30.7 minutes
Outgoing Players
Jason Terry
6-2 PG from Arizona
15.0 ppg, 2.5 rpg, 3.4 apg in 31.5 minutes
Erick Dampier
6-11 C from Mississippi State
5.5 ppg, 7.0 rpg, 0.9 apg in 22.8 minutes


Cleveland Trade Breakdown
Change in Team Outlook: +5.6 ppg, -1.0 rpg, and +1.0 apg. Incoming Players
Jason Terry
6-2 PG from Arizona
15.0 ppg, 2.5 rpg, 3.4 apg in 31.5 minutes
Erick Dampier
6-11 C from Mississippi State
5.5 ppg, 7.0 rpg, 0.9 apg in 22.8 minutes
Outgoing Players
Eric Snow
6-3 PG from Michigan State
0.9 ppg, 0.9 rpg, 1.8 apg in 12.1 minutes
Zydrunas Ilgauskas
7-3 C from Lithuania (Foreign)
14.0 ppg, 9.6 rpg, 1.5 apg in 30.7 minutes

[JES12]

[Pootie41]

Now that's a compelling argument.

[JHo&T.O.FaSho]

You think the Mavs are really scared of the Suns and Shaq or Lakers and Pau? Ha think we more concerned with Duncan, Yao, and a Bynum instead Pau so we're fine thanks for the laughs though.

[Rand10]

That's basically giving away Terry. He's worth more to us than a slight upgrade at center.

[Pootie41]

It's not a slight upgrade though.

This will TOTALLY change the way Dirk plays in the playoffs.

Dirk needs a big that can play in the low post to be his best because Dirk is a perimeter player. But ideally Dirk needs a big playing with him that is just as versatile as himself. That way you can play Dirk inside and out. And they will make eah other ten times better in both places as well.

Read this:

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/3033 ... zki-221007

If Dirk has a player like this playing with him you will see his game impacted the same way Nash's game improved when he went to the Suns. Dirk has never had a player like this playing with him. The best post player Dirk ever had to play off of was Nick Van Excel.

[JES12]

The best post player Dirk ever had to play off of was Nick Van Excel.

Quotable! As Bass is better in the post right now than NVE ever was.

[dirkforpres]

While we're at it, lets give Cleveland Dirk and Josh as well.... At first I thought this trade offer was a joke because its just awful. And do you honestly think the Mavs are afraid of Phoenix MORE than they were last week? Shaq is going to be a disaster in Phoenix... Im still amazed that that offer went through. The only real threat Dallas has is New Orleans, San Antonio (if healthy), and Los Angeles (even though they lost to Atlanta last night)

[Pootie41]

Not for his size. Even if Bass could post up. He can't pass either. So you can't combat the double teams.

Baron Davis is another example of a guard that is a great post player for his size like Van Exel. Baron beat us by posting up Harris and Terry. So you should be familiar with post playing guards. Could Bass beat the Mavs posting us up?

As for Shaq, Nash and Shaq will add another 5 years to each others careers. Nash will be the best player Shaq ever played with in his entire career. Best penetrator. Best perimeter shooter. And most unselfish passer. These guys will be an unstoppable tandem. Shaq has been injured and the Heat have some serious roster problems. The Suns are loaded with talent at every positon.

[jwa1107]

that trade does this team no good
Damp is more effective against Gasol and Shaq and TD than Zydrunas

[Pootie41]

Getting Z allows Dirk to be a leader. As the team is constructed now, because Damp and Diop have no offensive game, it allows the opposing team to take the ball out of Dirk's hands. This forces guys like Terry, Howard and stack to be the leader of our team.

Dirk is an offensive player. If you don't have a team that complements him you get knocked out in the first round of the playoffs. The Mavs don't have shooters to spread the floor for Dirk and they don't have a post player for him to play off of. Again, this is how you get a total flame out in the Finals and the biggest upset in history in the first round of the playoffs.

Big Z has an extremely versatile offensive game just like Dirk. This is why they would make each other so much better. Damp is a defensive liability as well. Which is why he couldn't play against the Warriors or the Suns when we played them. Basically what you have is a lot of dead weight. At the very least Z would provide offense and make Dirk even better offensively.

[itsgotime]

I see where you are going Pootie. I'm not completely opposed to this trade myself. If Snow has something left that is. I like him as a backup PG for a title contender. I like Z as a two way C. This would keep our SG position somewhat a problem but it gets rid of the minutes logjam that JET produces.

I really think that has been a part of the problem with the Mavs. Too many assets sitting on the bench while JET and Stack fill up the time. EJ is a servicable player, Hassell is a servicable player, George is a servicable player, Stack is a servicable player at slightly less minutes (to go with his aging), heck even Devin has sat so those two can get minutes (IMO especially in the 4th).

Snow is not so good that Avery would sit Devin to get him minutes, but he is good enough to allow Devin to rest and not give the game away. I'd like to see Devin get another 5-8 minutes per game. I'd like to see what Z could bring to the table on this team. I don't think Z is great, but I do think he is good. Damp brings many things to this team and I'd hate to see him go, however I think this trade is a step in the right direction, not a huge step but still a step.

Is this deal acceptable to CLE fans too?

[itsgotime]

I didn't read your last reply the whole way through Pootie, did you say Damp is a liability on Defense? I don't think you can expect that statement to get away without at least one person challenging it, so could you please expand on that statement?

[your_dallas_mavericks]

^^^ Let me be the first to challenge it. I don't believe Damp is a liability on Defense. Why do you Pootie?

[JES12]

I can't belive this trade was honored with so many responses. It should have been locked after my picture.

[FGump]

Damp is a defensive liability as well. Which is why he couldn't play against the Warriors or the Suns when we played them. .

That's just wrong.

Dampier is a major plus defensively.

And the concept that he "couldn't" play against GS and PHX is so wrongly out of date that it barely bears responding to.

What we've found is that Dampier didn't play against GS because he was injured. Major injury, that he tried to play through and just couldn't.

We've also seen that this season, Avery has used Damp against both GS and PHX and Damp has punished them. So in fact, instead of him being some sort of liability against those teams, it's turned out that he's actually a major factor against those munchkin lineups they try.

PHX 8 pts (4-4) 10r 5 blks in 30 minutes of play
GS 13 pts (5-5) 7r 3 blks in 27 minutes of play

And Mavs won both games.

[JES12]

PHX 8 pts (4-4) 10r 5 blks in 30 minutes of play
GS 13 pts (5-5) 7r 3 blks in 27 minutes of play

FTW

[Pointguard01]

/end thread

[Pootie41]

Yeah, why don't you put up Damp's playoff numbers. He has the numbers of a backup center in the playoffs. He can't even stay on the floor in the playoffs because he fouls out in the first 5 minutes. Damp is both a defensive liability and an offensive liability. Especially against running teams.

[Pootie41]

I see where you are going Pootie. I'm not completely opposed to this trade myself. If Snow has something left that is. I like him as a backup PG for a title contender. I like Z as a two way C. This would keep our SG position somewhat a problem but it gets rid of the minutes logjam that JET produces.

I really think that has been a part of the problem with the Mavs. Too many assets sitting on the bench while JET and Stack fill up the time. EJ is a servicable player, Hassell is a servicable player, George is a servicable player, Stack is a servicable player at slightly less minutes (to go with his aging), heck even Devin has sat so those two can get minutes (IMO especially in the 4th).

Snow is not so good that Avery would sit Devin to get him minutes, but he is good enough to allow Devin to rest and not give the game away. I'd like to see Devin get another 5-8 minutes per game. I'd like to see what Z could bring to the table on this team. I don't think Z is great, but I do think he is good. Damp brings many things to this team and I'd hate to see him go, however I think this trade is a step in the right direction, not a huge step but still a step.

Is this deal acceptable to CLE fans too?

I doubt Cleveland fans would go for it. If Mavs fans are this high on Dampier I am sure the Cleveland fans are just as in love with Z if not more so.

My hope is that Cleveland's brass is as desperate for change as our club is. They are kind of in the same boat. Hopefully they'd be willing to throw the dice because of what Terry could provide them -- another clutch shooter to help LeBron and make some plays.

I really just used Snow to make the numbers work. But him being a veteran would be nice for AJ. I am sure some other role player they have would work. And we could use different players as well. All our players outside of Dirk are extremely interchangable anyway IMO. Just different ages and different sized contracts.

I also think Damp would compliment LeBron for the same reasons I think Z would complement Dirk. I think LeBron's potential is more defensive. He's not a great shooter. And for this reason him and Z don't complement each other very well. So Dmap's strenght if he has a strenght is his defense. He and Lebron would make each other better defensively in the same way Z and Dirk would complement each other offensively. The Mavs have a lot of weak defenders in general. We need to play to our strenghts -- offense. And we need a post player.