Chris Wallace - One of the Worst GMs Ever

[sully00]

This trade is awful and there are no excuses for it. Wallace should have called every team in the league and asked them for their final offer for Gasol so they could have received the maximum amount of assets for him instead of $.30 on the dollar. ESPN insider has an article today about 10 trades that are as good if not better then what Memphis got for Gasol. Some of the trades are unrealistic but some of them are conceivable.

My Golden State idea was mentioned with Brandan Wright as the center piece. Chad Ford didn't include Belinelli but he threw in the expiring contracts of Azuibuike and Barnes instead.

The best idea was the expiring contracts of Khrypa and Pj Brown as well as Tyrus Thomas and their 2008 first round pick. This trade would be better then Golden State because Thomas and Wright are both unproven at this point so it is hard to tell who the better prospect is and Chicago's first round pick makes this the best possible deal for Memphis because the pick would most likely be in the 14-17 range.

Ideas are great but none of those trades were an option. Someone has to offer the deal. The Bulls had no interest in the idea of S&T PJ Brown. It would cost them almost double whatever they paid Brown in lux tax, not happening.

The Warriors weren't offering anything to the Griz.

What the Griz did was screw the Bulls. The Bulls were trying to unload Ben Wallace on Hollywood. That would have freed up the salary they need to resign Gordon and Deng. The Griz give the Lakers Gasol and now they have the cap space to sign one of those guys and the Bulls still have Wallace and can't go over the tax to keep both of their guys.

Imaginary trades are pointless to debate, if a real offer was made that is worth talking about but the only way to judge the deal is whether they should make a deal or keep him not make a trade that doesn't exhist. That, besides his terrible evaluation of draft talent, is why Ford is a glorified message board poster and not in the front office of a NBA team.

[francishsu]

I'm not sure if it can get much worse for the Grizzlies, but spending that cap space on Ben Gordon would do it for sure. And Wallace has already stated that they may wait until 2009 to go after a free agent. At this point, they're just not sure what they're doing, other than cutting payroll.

[BrokenLeftyJumper]

At this point, they're just not sure what they're doing, other than cutting payroll.

Well that makes sense for them. Cutting payroll is generally an essential before a GM can go about effectively rebuilding a team.

[sully00]

I'm not sure if it can get much worse for the Grizzlies, but spending that cap space on Ben Gordon would do it for sure. And Wallace has already stated that they may wait until 2009 to go after a free agent. At this point, they're just not sure what they're doing, other than cutting payroll.

Just because your not sure what they are doing doesn't mean they are not sure. There are going to be a lot of good players available in FA and restricted FA. There was a lack of expiring contracts, at least of useless players, this season, which is why this move makes sense. Not only are teams not going to be able to go out and sign FA's but they are going to struggle to keep their own and not go into lux tax territory. Of course they are going to say that they are willing to wait until '09 to use the money you have to create some leverage in negotiation.

What is the point in paying Pau Gasol 14 mil to finish in last place?

[francishsu]

At this point, they're just not sure what they're doing, other than cutting payroll.

Well that makes sense for them. Cutting payroll is generally an essential before a GM can go about effectively rebuilding a team.

The worst GM ever can trade a player of Gasol's caliber simply to reduce payroll. Yes, in that regards, mission accomplished! It's the assets that they got towards the rebuilding that I base my criticism on - Wallace seriously overvaluing the Laker draft pick and Marc Gasol. In Wallace's mind, he got back four first round draft picks. In my mind, he got back one, Crittenton. Once again, looking at Chris Wallace's history with the Celtics, the Lakers picks will amount to nothing and so will Marc Gasol.

[francishsu]

-= original quote snipped =-
Just because your not sure what they are doing doesn't mean they are not sure.

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BTA: If you really feel like the best thing to do, from a basketball perspective, is to roll this summer

[I love heinsohn]

Don't worry folks, Marc Gasol is the next Bruno Sundov! Everything is A-OK in Memphis!

[BrokenLeftyJumper]

Don't worry folks, Marc Gasol is the next Bruno Sundov! Everything is A-OK in Memphis!

I remember you rocking the Sundov jersey back in the day at CRLS.

[sully00]

francishsu

You are just evaluating the deal based on your opinion of Chris Wallace not on the trade itself. First round picks aren't first round picks because Wallace traded for them and those are your words. I am simply saying until you see what they do with the cap space you can't judge the deal.

A bad trade is what PHI did. They got back a good player who is expensive and absolutely useless to them. He has hurt them because they are caught between a 15 win rebuild and 35 wins. They got late picks in the current draft and ended up pissing them away.

What Wallace did is ideal, whether he can or his ownership will allow him to execute it is another question. He has the cap space to sign the type of players who were a best case senario for him to trade for. In addition he did not have to take on bad salary to make it happen. The draft picks are not the type of asset you can build your future around but they are the kind of asset that can be used to make a S&T deal and avoid an offer sheet.

Your not alone in not catching on but this is how the NBA works. I would look for them to make a simliar deal for Miller. Young players on rookie deals, expiring contracts, and draft picks. Trying to convince yourself you are trading for equal talent when dumping high salary stars is the path of fools.

[CanSee17]

Imagine how much better the league would be without the Grizzlies and maybe one or two more teams (Bobcats? Hornets?)?

Have a draft and disperse thos eplays throughout the league. The quality of play would increase sunstantially...

[francishsu]

francishsu
You are just evaluating the deal based on your opinion of Chris Wallace not on the trade itself. First round picks aren't first round picks because Wallace traded for them and those are your words. I am simply saying until you see what they do with the cap space you can't judge the deal.

Actually, I evaluated the deal on the trade itself combined with my opinion of Wallace, based on his extensive history. First, I'd slam the deal no matter who the general manager was. My belief is that they should have gotten at least a lottery pick and expiring out of it. I think that's a very reasonable expectation for a 28 year old career 19/9 big man. A single lottery pick is not equal value to Gasol, but it gives you at least a chance to get an impact player to replace him. A contrasting example is what the Sonics got for Ray Allen. They were right to go for a single very good pick, rather than quantity.

Where my opinion of Wallace factors in is with the value of those draft picks. With Ainge, you figure MAYBE one of those first round picks will get you a Tony Allen caliber player. You'll at least get a solid role player. My opinion is that Wallace is a worse drafter, and so the end of first round draft pick is worth even less. So with Ainge, I would call is a bad trade. With Wallace, I call it an even worse trade.

Trying to convince yourself you are trading for equal talent when dumping high salary stars is the path of fools.

I never stated that they should get equal talent, and I think almost all basketball fans did not expect that either. I believe that most would say it was a bad trade.

[hiphop1]

I lost hope in Wallace when he traded an expiring Kenny Anderson for Vin Baker! WTF was he thinking.

[sully00]

Imagine how much better the league would be without the Grizzlies and maybe one or two more teams (Bobcats? Hornets?)?

Have a draft and disperse thos eplays throughout the league. The quality of play would increase sunstantially...

I don't think talent is the issue I think it is the problem. Nobody bothers with the James Poseys and Eddie Houses. Everything is about upside and potential, and most importantly money. The first thing teams do when they hit a bump in the road is unload everything, all of their role players. Then they fill their rosters with guys with allstar potential in search of that francise guy. The problem with that is chiefs frequently make lousy indians. So if you fill your team with guys who are best suited to take 15 shots a game and handle the ball all the time, you may well find that super talent but everything else has been a waste. I think the ATL is a good example of this, their best player, at least through development was a mid to late first rounder but the rest of the roster, besides Horford, while talented is not a great fit to fill roles behind Smith and Johnson, they are all scorers as well.

To some extent the system is to blame, even a year of college makes it difficult for front offices to identify what a player will be capable of year or two down the road. Because of that it makes it difficult to put all your eggs in one basket as far as one guy being the man you will build around. So outside of the top 2 picks it is like every team in the lottery is drafting a quarterback every year. They take a player they are gambling their future on but they won't know the answer until a year or two down the road. Added to this is the lack of player movement.

There are guys not in the league that can play and guys on rosters who can't because they have upside and potential. There are also guys like Devean George and Donyell Marshal that could start for teams in the bottom half of the league but are buried on contending teams.

For too many teams winning just isn't the most important thing, we were there last year. Until it is for more teams then the level of play overall will suffer.

[sully00]

francishsu

C'mon how is he going to get a lottery pick for Gasol? What team that is heading into the lottery is looking to aquire a guy with 3 years and 50 mil coming to him? Beyond that he got the only expiring contract he could. SEA and MINN aren't trading for Gasol and certainly not at the price of their lottery pick. As far as SEA and Ray Allen they took on 2 years and 26 mil of Wally to unload 3 years and 50 mil of Ray there is nothing expiring about that. They chose to take on salary in exchange for draft picks they did the same with Kurt Thomas, because they have their franchise guy in Durant they aren't going to go into FA for that guy.

The only deal that was evidently available was taking on the 5 years and 37.5 mil of Nocioni, even if that got the Griz Deng or Gordon it is a terrible trade as they would be capped out. They can make a run at one or both of those guys in the offseason.

[francishsu]

francishsu
C'mon how is he going to get a lottery pick for Gasol?

Are you telling me that you have taken into consideration of the salary situation, and needs of all the teams headed to the lottery, and ruled out every single one of them with Gasol being a good fit? That it would be impossible for a lottery pick to be a acquired in the offseason? That no three way trade could be put together that could give the Grizzlies a more suitable return for Gasol?

I mean, this is your star player, and you've got to have the patience and determination to get a somewhat reasonable return for him.

We will have to agree to disagree at this point. Maybe some clarity and movement on this argument will occur during the offseason and we can revisit this.

As far as Wally's salary goes, I believe that Ainge would have made the same trade if Wally was an expiring as well. They wanted Ratliff, but obviously Ainge had to hold onto him to get KG. At the same time, if Wally was an expiring but we did not have a lottery pick to give, I believe the Sonics would have declined.

[Mahoney_jr]

-= original quote snipped =-

What is the point in paying Pau Gasol 14 mil to finish in last place?

Hey sully, I usually love your estimations of trades and business in the NBA but that quote is rather shortsighted in my opinion. What about this quote a year ago from fan X of another team than the Celtics:

"What is the point in paying Paul Pierce 16 mil to finish in last place?"

The point is, we were in a comparable situation and are now at the top of the league. Just because we didn't trade Paul Pierce for the next deal on the table.