ImageImageImageImageImage

Points Above Average

Moderators: 7 Footer, Morris_Shatford, DG88, niQ, Duffman100, tsherkin, Reeko, lebron stopper, HiJiNX

User avatar
supersub15
Retired Mod
Retired Mod
Posts: 16,846
And1: 27
Joined: Dec 16, 2003
Location: God, family, Raps and Man U

Points Above Average 

Post#1 » by supersub15 » Fri Feb 8, 2008 3:06 pm

A dude on the APBRMetric board created a formula to evaluate players
total points created above league average. He the took total points and subtracted what the average player would score based on TS%. This is the formula:

PlayerPoints - (LgTs%*(2* (PlayerFGA+.44*FTA)))

It was pointed out that you can't compare all players equally, i.e. you can't compare Lebron and his 22 FGA per game with Michael Ruffin with his 0.81 FGA per game. I consequently separated several FGA ranges with average LgTS% at each range. This is the equivalent for scoring points, like positions (or height) is for rebounds. And Lebron would be compared with scorers in his range:

I understand that my classification is arbitrary and can probably be tweaked, but at least it's a start.

Group 1 - 15.00 FGA/G or more: Mostly all-stars or first option on teams
Group 2 - 12.00 - 14.99 FGA/G: Mostly second banana (could be first option in certain systems)
Group 3 - 9.00 - 11.99: Third option on the floor
Group 4 - 6.00 - 8.99: Fourth option on the floor
Group 5 - 3.00 - 5.99 - Bench player (or fifth option on the floor)
Group 6 - 0.00 - 2.99 - Scrub and back-end of rotation player

Group 1: Average TS% = 0.547 (36 players)
Top 5:

Code: Select all

Player                PAA
Kevin Martin         79.05
Yao Ming             60.63
Chris Bosh           55.79
Dirk Nowitzki        53.09
Richard Jefferson    44.24
Kobe Bryant          41.26


Bottom 5:

Code: Select all

Player                PAA
Tracy McGrady       -50.82
Jamal Crawford      -54.29
Antawn Jamison      -57.4
Joe Johnson         -64.73
Kevin Durant        -91.28


Group 2: Average TS% = 0.568 (31 players)
Top 5:

Code: Select all

Player                PAA
Amare Stoudemire     124.8
Steve Nash            96.29
Dwight Howard         96.2
Mike Miller           80.38
Deron Williams        52.26


Bottom 5:

Code: Select all

Player                PAA
Ricky Davis         -61.8
Zach Randolph       -77.78
Jermaine O'Neal     -79.01
Kirk Hinrich        -83.65
Josh Smith          -84.83


Group 3: Average TS% = 0.538 (44 players)
Top 5:

Code: Select all

Player                PAA
Chauncey Billups    112.9
Jose Calderon        77.41
John Salmons         57.69
Jason Terry          57.65
Derek Fisher         55.78


Bottom 5:

Code: Select all

Player                PAA
Jason Kidd          -63.11
Rafer Alston        -64.49
Larry Hughes        -76.52
Sebastian Telfair   -78.7
Jamaal Tinsley      -82.11


Group 4: Average TS% = 0.529 (92 players)
Top 5:

Code: Select all

Player                PAA
Andrew Bynum         90.56
Josh Childress       86.08
Andris Biedrins      85.92
Tyson Chandler       84.41
Daniel Gibson        77.06


Bottom 5:

Code: Select all

Player                PAA
Damien Wilkins      -48.87
Antoine Walker      -49.23
Charlie Bell        -59.48
Sasha Pavlovic      -67.4
Quentin Richardson  -74.85


Group 5: Average TS% = 0.511 (112 players)
Top 5:

Code: Select all

Player                PAA
James Jones          73.12
Kendrick Perkins     55.34
Sasha Vujacic        47.48
Brent Barry          46.46
Keyon Dooling        45.77


Bottom 5:

Code: Select all

Player                PAA
Jason Hart          -33.15
Tyrus Thomas        -33.33
Acie Law            -35.46
Corey Brewer        -66.48
Ben Wallace         -68.26


Group 6: Average TS% = 0.474 (119 players)
Top 5:

Code: Select all

Player                PAA
Glen Davis           38.41
DeSagana Diop        26.57
J.J. Redick          17.18
Arron Afflalo        16.01
Bobby Jones          14.52


Bottom 5:

Code: Select all

Player                PAA
Darrick Martin      -14.39
Jamaal Magloire     -15.4
Jared Jeffries      -17.35
Mardy Collins       -20.47
Malik Rose          -26.18


What do you think?
User avatar
kleatius_01
Pro Prospect
Posts: 765
And1: 319
Joined: Apr 10, 2006
 

 

Post#2 » by kleatius_01 » Fri Feb 8, 2008 3:19 pm

Very cool! Seems like a lot of work, good job. I would also be interested to see where each raptor player falls within his group.
cdel00
Head Coach
Posts: 6,739
And1: 424
Joined: Apr 12, 2007

 

Post#3 » by cdel00 » Fri Feb 8, 2008 3:51 pm

Yet another reason why Durrant should NOT be ROY -91 in his group. Yet another reason why Jose is better than Kidd this year.
Yet another reason why Mike Miller would be awesome on the Raps.

:)
User avatar
supersub15
Retired Mod
Retired Mod
Posts: 16,846
And1: 27
Joined: Dec 16, 2003
Location: God, family, Raps and Man U

 

Post#4 » by supersub15 » Fri Feb 8, 2008 5:00 pm

kleatius_01 wrote:Very cool! Seems like a lot of work, good job. I would also be interested to see where each raptor player falls within his group.


Group 1:
3. Chris Bosh: +55.79 PAA

Group 3:
2. Jose Calderon: +77.41 PAA
10. Anthony Parker: +
User avatar
supersub15
Retired Mod
Retired Mod
Posts: 16,846
And1: 27
Joined: Dec 16, 2003
Location: God, family, Raps and Man U

 

Post#5 » by supersub15 » Fri Feb 8, 2008 5:10 pm

So, basically, we have 8 players above average in their respective groups, with Bosh and Calderon in the elite in their respective groups.

Going by this classification, we don't have a second option. That's why, offensively at least, a Mike Miller makes sense for the Raptors, as he becomes immediately our second option behind Bosh.
KG1585
Head Coach
Posts: 6,349
And1: 358
Joined: Jun 23, 2006
Location: B-Town
       

 

Post#6 » by KG1585 » Fri Feb 8, 2008 5:17 pm

Going by this classification, we don't have a second option. That's why, offensively at least, a Mike Miller makes sense for the Raptors, as he becomes immediately our second option behind Bosh.


We don't have a second option yet, but with TJ healthy, and Bargs starting to play well, one of them could become that second option. Also with this team, its usually Bosh and there is one other player that usually steps on any give game to be a second option.
User avatar
gniewek
Sophomore
Posts: 219
And1: 1
Joined: Nov 04, 2007
Location: Halifax

 

Post#7 » by gniewek » Fri Feb 8, 2008 11:10 pm

Really cool stats, I always love reading them. But i was just wondering who the first option or "group 1" player from phoniex is? It says here than Amare and Nash are both group 2. They are clearly in the top...should one of them be in the first group?

Top 5:
Code:
Player PAA
Amare Stoudemire 124.8
Steve Nash 96.29
Dwight Howard 96.2
Mike Miller 80.38
Deron Williams 52.26


Edit: wouldnt Howard also be the number 1 option in Orlando?
User avatar
Hank_Scorpio
Retired Mod
Retired Mod
Posts: 25,179
And1: 6
Joined: Jun 04, 2001
Location: Los Angeles, CA

 

Post#8 » by Hank_Scorpio » Fri Feb 8, 2008 11:13 pm

I have no idea what any of that means, but its very impressive.
Postbro1 wrote:Obama is right on this.
User avatar
ansoncarter
Head Coach
Posts: 6,152
And1: 367
Joined: Feb 01, 2006

 

Post#9 » by ansoncarter » Fri Feb 8, 2008 11:27 pm

wow TJ is pretty low. Why is that?
User avatar
supersub15
Retired Mod
Retired Mod
Posts: 16,846
And1: 27
Joined: Dec 16, 2003
Location: God, family, Raps and Man U

 

Post#10 » by supersub15 » Fri Feb 8, 2008 11:28 pm

Hank_Scorpio wrote:I have no idea what any of that means, but its very impressive.


:D

It's a way to compare the offense of players with the same status. Let's take Joe Johnson vs. Lebron James. Compared to the average player in their group (TS% of 0.547), Johnson produces -1.5 per game, wheras Lebron produces almost +1 per game. In other words, Lebron is better offensively than your average superstar, whereas Johnson is markedly worse than that same average superstar. You probably knew that already, but stats it's a way to put it in numbers.

Of course, defense does not enter the equation here.
User avatar
don't panac
Analyst
Posts: 3,020
And1: 664
Joined: Dec 17, 2007
         

 

Post#11 » by don't panac » Fri Feb 8, 2008 11:45 pm

out of curiosity, if it's not complicated, what would be bargnani's average in the last few games?
assuming that he's going to maintain this level (big assumption) it would indicate his actual level now
User avatar
supersub15
Retired Mod
Retired Mod
Posts: 16,846
And1: 27
Joined: Dec 16, 2003
Location: God, family, Raps and Man U

 

Post#12 » by supersub15 » Sat Feb 9, 2008 12:08 am

don't panac wrote:out of curiosity, if it's not complicated, what would be bargnani's average in the last few games?
assuming that he's going to maintain this level (big assumption) it would indicate his actual level now


Good question. For his last 6 games, Bargnani has been +20 compared to his peers (as opposed to -21 right now).

Return to Toronto Raptors