Another Variation on BG to Blazers w/ Grizz & Hawks!

[N.O.R.E.]

Bulls get: Miller, LaFrentz, Lowry
trade: BG, Nocioni, J. Smith, Duhon, Griffin, $3 mil

Noah/Gray
TT/Wallace/LaFrentz
Deng/Thabo/VK
Miller/Thabo
Kirk/Lowry

The Bulls replace BG with the reasonably priced Miller while getting out of Nocioni's contract.


Blazers get: BG, Nocioni, J. Smith, Cardinal
trade: Webster, Fernandez, Frye, LaFrentz, minor filler

Oden/Przy
Aldridge/J.Smith/Outlaw
Nocioni/JJ/Cardinal
Roy/Jack
Blake/Sergio

The Blazers complete their squad while keeping their core and depth at every position.


Grizz get: Webster, Fernandez, Frye, Shelden, Griffin, $3 mil, Ty Lue (cut)
trade: Miller, Cardinal, Lowry, Warrick

08/09
Darko/Collins
Frye/Shelden
Gay/Webster
Mayo/Fernandez/Griff
Conley/Critt

The Grizz get a lot of prospects, salary flexibility and all the other things rebuilding teams need.

Hawks trade: Shelden, Ty Lue
Receive: Duhon, minor PDX filler

[N.O.R.E.]

My bad, can someone please move this to the trade board?

[Wizenheimer]

the blazers would do this but only if they substituted jack + kaponen or some similar variation for Fernandez. Portland won't be trading fernandez for a return package like this.

The Griz may accept this trade, but for both them and the blazers it might make more sense both salary-wise and roster-wise if portland sent them James Jones instead of Webster

But it all wouldn't matter because the Bulls wouldn't do this trade

[Spykes]

I gotta agree with Wizen here. While I love what Portland gets back, they simply aren't going to trade Fernandez.

[Napoleon7]

Fernandez will not be traded.

[hermes]

bulls decline

[treis]

It's absolutely silly that you guys consider the 24th pick in the draft to be untouchable.

[Wizenheimer]

It's absolutely silly that you guys consider the 24th pick in the draft to be untouchable.

wrong perspective

Fernandez slipped to the 24th position because of the duration and buyout provision of his previous contract.

Portland's GM apparently has some close contacts in the Spanish professional league that Fernandez plays in (he played there when he was still playing)

Within a few short weeks of when Portland selected him, Fernandez and his team negotiated a new amended contract with a very favorable buy-out provision. If that had been in place before the draft, it seems to be a consensus that Fernandez would have been a lottery pick, and probably even a top-10 pick.

So portland's GM apparently knew something...or someone...that the rest of the GM's didn't know, and were able to get a 'steal' late in the draft.

Portland's front office is reportedly 'very high' on Fernandez's NBA prospects. While they wouldn't consider him untouchable, it would take more then this package for portland to agree to include him.

[treis]

-= original quote snipped =-



wrong perspective

Fernandez slipped to the 24th position because of the duration and buyout provision of his previous contract.

It's absolutely the right perspective. You guys got Fernandez by taking on Jones and giving the Suns 3 million dollars. He isn't particularly dominant in Europe, and doesn't have ideal size to transfer his game to the NBA. That's the type of value he has, and it's nowhere near untouchable.

-
Within a few short weeks of when Portland selected him, Fernandez and his team negotiated a new amended contract with a very favorable buy-out provision. If that had been in place before the draft, it seems to be a consensus that Fernandez would have been a lottery pick, and probably even a top-10 pick.

I never heard that. Besides, Gordon was the 3rd pick in the draft. I mean, hello? Last year, at age 24, Gordon averaged 21.4, 3, and 3 on great %'s. You think Rudy is going to be able to manage that at 24? I'd be absolutely shocked if he did.

[Spykes]

It's absolutely the right perspective. You guys got Fernandez by taking on Jones and giving the Suns 3 million dollars. He isn't particularly dominant in Europe, and doesn't have ideal size to transfer his game to the NBA. That's the type of value he has, and it's nowhere near untouchable.

Not particularly dominant?! He's widely regarded by scouts as one of the best European players. He was the MVP for crying out loud!

You might wanna read this thread before spouting off inaccuracies like you just did...

http://www.realgm.com/boards/viewtopic. ... sc&start=0

Might as well give you this link too...

http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Rud ... layerblog/

Now does that make him traditionally "untouchable". No. Is he untouchable in a trade for Ben Gordon? Yes. Gordon is a nice player and a good fit next to Roy, but with his contract situation, the Blazers won't get up a prospect they covet as much as they do in Rudy.

[treis]

Unless I am mistaken he was just the MVP of the Copa Del Rey tournament. Scola was the MVP of the Spanish league, and Papaloukas was the MVP of the Euroleague. Certainly winning the MVP of a major tournament is an accomplishment, but it doesn't show his dominance over the Euroleague. Guys like Scola, Anthony Parker, and Juan Carlos were all more dominant than Rudy, and they are no more than role players over here.

To say that you wouldn't trade Rudy for Gordon makes no sense. If Gordon were in Europe he'd easily be the best player, and would dominate. His contract isn't a problem since he is a RFA. As Portland fans love to point out, or at least they do when it helps them, Paul Allen has more money than God and won't let Gordon leave in FA.

[SoHo]

He isn't particularly dominant in Europe

That's really just not true. He was named the brightest young star in Euroleague last year... Rudy is about 5 years younger than Scola and Navarro and is definitely one of the most dominant players in Europe right now. Further, our management is very excited about his potential over here because he has youth and athleticism to let him mature more than any of the three you listed. Would passing on BG and Nocioni to keep Rudy be a good idea? I dunno Lord Bargnani was also supposed to be an amazing young euro...

However, I do agree that I'd rather have BG. If Ben was signed to a nice contract and we knew he would be playing for us long into the future we might consider making that trade. Unfortunately BG wants a big contract and we basically pigeon hole ourselves into paying him whatever he wants by trading for him. That's really not a great situation.

Paul Allen certainly can afford to pay BG what he wants, but it's stupid to think we will just disregard his contract situation because of that tidbit. If we pay him an insane amount of money then it affects our ability to sign/trade for other players. There is more to giving BG a huge contract than the sheer dollar cost.

[Spykes]

However, I do agree that I'd rather have BG. If Ben was signed to a nice contract and we knew he would be playing for us long into the future we might consider making that trade. Unfortunately BG wants a big contract and we basically pigeon hole ourselves into paying him whatever he wants by trading for him. That's really not a great situation.

Paul Allen certainly can afford to pay BG what he wants, but it's stupid to think we will just disregard his contract situation because of that tidbit. If we pay him an insane amount of money then it affects our ability to sign/trade for other players. There is more to giving BG a huge contract than the sheer dollar cost.

Bingo.

[N.O.R.E.]

If BG was to re-sign to a reasonable contract, the Bulls would just keep him IMO.

[treis]

He isn't particularly dominant in Europe

That's really just not true. He was named the brightest young star in Euroleague last year... Rudy is about 5 years younger than Scola and Navarro and is definitely one of the most dominant players in Europe right now.

Winning the brightest young star is the equivalent of winning the ROY. It doesn't put you at the top of the top of the league, nor does winning a tournament MVP. I don't think any would argue that Rudy was the best player in the Spanish league last year, and no one would argue that he was the best player in Europe. That's what I mean by not particularly dominant. A top player in Europe? Sure.

[Wizenheimer]

-= original quote snipped =-



Winning the brightest young star is the equivalent of winning the ROY. It doesn't put you at the top of the top of the league, nor does winning a tournament MVP. I don't think any would argue that Rudy was the best player in the Spanish league last year, and no one would argue that he was the best player in Europe. That's what I mean by not particularly dominant. A top player in Europe? Sure.

I think you are underestimating his stature and abilities relative to the competition over there, but no matter.

As Soho pointed out, Gordon has a contract 'situation'. And that specific situation degrades Gordon's trade value by a significant margin. Portland couldn't negotiate wih him till he was a restricted free agent this summer. Portland has no guarantee that Gordon will agree to extend his contract. He's already suggested he'd be satisfied to simply play for his QO next season. So this trade comes with a lot of risk for Portland.

Another thing this trade comes with is an enormous obligation of future salaries. Nocioni's contract is large. Smith has over 5 million dollars left on his. And Cardinal, who would be next to useless for portland, has over 13 million left after this season.

Add to that a potential 50 million deal for gordon and paul allen might have to sell one of his yachts.

Compare that to Fernandez's 1 million salary next year along with what's left of the Webster and Frye contracts and Portland would pay a ton for this trade.

Gordon and Nocioni would be nice additions for portland...no argument, but Smith would be gone before Portland began to contend. And cardinal is 13 million dollars of useless.

Again...portland wouldn't agree to include Fernadez in this trade. Jack yes, fernandez no.

And I find it hard to believe the Bulls would agree either, especially considering paxson's history of conservative management.

[DanBlazer]

I'd rather just a Jack/Webster/09 protected first for Gordon type of deal. It's a lot easier. That way Portland could have their backcourt set, and then draft Gallinari for their future sf and find a banger pf in the early second round like Dorsey if hes there.