Trade Exceptions

[Sun Scorched]

Sure you may have known that we had two trade exceptions:

Kurt Thomas - $8,091,189
This gives us an effective trade range of $6,472,951 - $10,113,986 in value

James Jones - $2,900,000
This gives us an effective trade range of $2,320,000 - $3,625,000 in value

But did you know that we now have one more as a result of the Shaq trade?

Marcus Banks - $ 3,966,206
This gives us an effective trade range of $3,172,967 - $4,957,761 in value

This makes the Suns the most attractive three-way trade partner in the league. The ranges that I noted here are due to the CBA trade rules that state that incoming and outgoing value need to be within 125% of each other.

If the Suns are involved with a trade in this capacity, I expect us to receive something in return. A pick perhaps, not just some scrub. We could sign a scrub without giving up one of our exceptions.

Questions? Comments? Concerns?

[impulsenine]

$10k/year will buy you a nice player... Verrrrry nice.

Maybe we should be looking at something a little more dramatic for our 13th player?

[ray ray]

$10k/year will buy you a nice player... Verrrrry nice.

Maybe we should be looking at something a little more dramatic for our 13th player?

What if we trade the Kurt Thomas trade exception(8 mil) and the Atlanta's pick for John Salmons (4.7 mil)? I know that we would be over the luxury tax this yr by 3 mil so he would essentially cost us 8 mil including the luxury tax. But he gives us another eliment in the defensive side of the ball not to mention you can pair John Salmons and Barbosa in the back court becouse Salmons can play some point at 6'7. Salmons is a very good defender who can spot up from the 3 point line.

Next yr we are going to lose about 3.3 mil becouse Marks, Piowkaski and Skinner are going to be gone. I would love this move, becouse he is nowhere close to Marion offensively but he is about 15 million cheaper and in my opinion he is as good as Marion defensively.

[KJ7]

Firstly, I remember reading that the "range" you described does not come into play when trading a TPE. Therefore if we have a 8m TPE we can NOT obtain a 10m player.

Secondly, are you 100% sure that we got a TPE from the Shaq trade?

20m * 125% > Marion + Banks salary. Therefore I seriously doubt we got a TPE. You usually only get a sizeable one when one of the teams involved in a trade is under the cap (which wasn't the case in the Shaq trade).

Someone feel free to correct me if I'm wrong.

[impulsenine]

Don't we also have to use the exceptions within a year or two?

[Never Fear 33 Is Here]

Secondly, are you 100% sure that we got a TPE from the Shaq trade?

One would think no. Based on the rule that you cannot include a TPE with a player in a trade.

Or at least that was what I was under the impression of.

[Sun Scorched]

KJ7 is right about the 125% situation. We can use a TPE for any other player as long as the incoming salary is less than the TPE itself. This is in addition to not being able to combine them. TPE's are good for one year.

In terms of the Banks TPE, I have no clue why we have it and this could be a mistake I suppose. Worth looking into at the very least.

[Mr. Sun]

^^ I asked in the CBA forum why the TE for Banks. Hopefully Sunday will get an answer.

[nevetsov]

I assume the reason we recieved a TPE for Marcus is because of the way the trade was set up. It's really quite clever when you think about it; we COULD have traded Shawn and Banks combined for Shaq under the CBA, but Marion's $16+M salary was enough to trade for Shaq's contract in itself. This would mean that Marcus got traded simulatneously for a TPE.

So in reality you could look at it as two separate yet simultaneous trades:

Shawn ($16ishM) *125% +100k = Shaq ($20M)
Marcus ($3+M) for a TPE.

And you are right, the 125% exception does not apply for TPEs as you cannot combine exceptions.

You can use a portion of a TPE but you can't combine them.

So for example, using the Kurt TPE (something like $8,091,000) we can use that to acquire a player up to a salary of $8,191,000. (+100k).

We could also use that to acquire a player of significantly less, for example, $5M, but we do not lose the whole exception; we would still be able to acquire a player of $3,191,000.

Also, I *believe* the other team trading the player does not "recieve" a TPE, they merely clear that $5M (or whatever) from their books.

[FGump]

The idea that you can trade your TE for something is erroneous.

Like your other cap exceptions (MLE, BAE) you can use it, or lose it. But you can't trade it.

And there is no 25% cushion when you use one. Nor can they be combined for a bigger salaried player.

But keep in mind that when you use one, you are adding salary. So in reality, you are very unlikely to ever use one in Phoenix.

[impulsenine]

Will we be able to use our TE's over the summer, or will it be too late? It'd be awesome to be able to replace Piatkowski and Marks (as much as I like Marks) with $8M and $3M players.

That bigger TE can net some pretty awesome people, although we CANNOT use it on free agents, so we would have be trading for them. Here's a random sampling I found going through HoopsHype, not including people who are obviously not getting traded (like Tayshun Prince):

Speedy Claxton $6,306,182
Gerald Wallace $7,500,000
Andres Nocioni $8,500,000
Zydrunas Ilgauskas $10,142,156
Marcus Camby $8,000,000
Nen

[Sun Scorched]

* Shaq (C)/Amare (PF)/Howard (SF?)/Diaw (SG)/Nash (PG) would be illegal --- and average around 6'10. Heh.

In that line-up I think we move Amare to the 3. He's a bit quicker off the dribble than Dwight, has a better jumpshot and can shoot the trey.

[Mr. Sun]

It all dawns on me now! Marion for Shaq was a straight-up trade and Banks was a separate trade to just get rid of him.

[guaves13]

I assume the reason we recieved a TPE for Marcus is because of the way the trade was set up. It's really quite clever when you think about it; we COULD have traded Shawn and Banks combined for Shaq under the CBA, but Marion's $16+M salary was enough to trade for Shaq's contract in itself. This would mean that Marcus got traded simulatneously for a TPE.

So in reality you could look at it as two separate yet simultaneous trades:

Shawn ($16ishM) *125% +100k = Shaq ($20M)
Marcus ($3+M) for a TPE.And you are right, the 125% exception does not apply for TPEs as you cannot combine exceptions.

You can use a portion of a TPE but you can't combine them.

So for example, using the Kurt TPE (something like $8,091,000) we can use that to acquire a player up to a salary of $8,191,000. (+100k).

We could also use that to acquire a player of significantly less, for example, $5M, but we do not lose the whole exception; we would still be able to acquire a player of $3,191,000.

Also, I *believe* the other team trading the player does not "recieve" a TPE, they merely clear that $5M (or whatever) from their books.

The only way that would've worked is if Miami had a trade exception big enough to take on Banks' salary. They were and are over the cap.

[impulsenine]

-= original quote snipped =-



In that line-up I think we move Amare to the 3. He's a bit quicker off the dribble than Dwight, has a better jumpshot and can shoot the trey.

... sort of. But hey, since this is fantasyland, why not?

Heh, can you imagine the reaction of they gave up Dwight for just the trade exception? Heads would roll...

Actually the only person I can see us really using the whole TE for is Quentin, because NY is so screwed for salary. I dunno if it'd be a good idea to actually do it, but there you go.

[nevetsov]

Actually the only person I can see us really using the whole TE for is Quentin, because NY is so screwed for salary. I dunno if it'd be a good idea to actually do it, but there you go.

If we did use our $8M TPE on Q, we would have to swindle some other stuff out of NY as well, otherwise we'd be getting fleeced. Maybe a future 1st or David Lee. SOmething like that.

And to answer an earlier question, as TPEs last for exactly one calendar year, we can use the KT $8M exception until around a week after the moratorium.. if memory serves me correctly? However, as our salary is pretty much capped/ taxed out for the next three years, I don't see us using a substantial chunk of any unless we ditch some salary to accommodate. Even then, we would somehow have to rid ourselves of substantially more salary via trade than we take back, which is a pretty tricky thing to do under the CBA.

It would likely have to be a 3 teamer including Diaw and two other teams making expensive changes.