OT: Cavs ?? (3 way Merged)

[celticfan42487]

why is everybody saying Prestis a genius??
SEA outgoing:
Ray Allen
Big Baby!

SEA incoming:
Jeff Green
Ira Newble
Donyell Marshall

I know everybodys sellin low on their stars, but cmon, THAT crap for Ray and Bigbaby?!?!

Ray Allen is slowin' down with injuries and shouldn't be relied on to carry another young team in a city that doesn't care about basketball.

Consider his other movements.

Rshard Lewis and Wally and an unhappy West/Thomas outgoing: Incoming pure cap relief for a team leaving SEA and 3 first round draft picks.

SEA is not in a stage for winning right now, there not even in a city to support them yet. But they set themself up very nicely for when they do move. And Durant needs time to learn the game. Helps on the way in the future.

[sully00]

I am in the desperation camp. Its like one of us scraping our fantasy team before the deadline because your going to get rubbed out in the first round of the playoffs. It still isn't likely to work but at least you tried.

The individual players aren't terrible but they gave up the two best players in the trade in Hughes and Gooden. While Hughes isn't a great fit anymore and swapping him for Wally and West would have been slick, overall, as Pete pointed out, this is the exact opposite of what they should have been trying to do. They had to get Kidd, Marion, or take a chance on JO. They took 2 NBA starters and aquired 4 bench players which would be fine if they had more than two NBA starters left on their team.

[Spin Move]

I do like picking wally up for the cavs because maybe next year he can be traded for a disgrunteld all star when he is expiring. For real though, Presti got 3 draft picks out trading for and retrading thomas, then he cute more salary with this. He is shrewd, not sure i lke the drafting fo green though

[devwat12]

I take it the people who are calling this desperation don't watch the Cavs much?

Wallace is declining and has a bad contract, but it's the same length as Hughes'. Hughes had been a bad fit from day one. The only thing the Cavs lose is his D, while Wally brings an offensive player that complements Lebron much better.

Drew Gooden is one of the dumbest players in the league and plays no D. The Cavs could never play him late in games because he was such a liability. Nice touch from mid range and a half hook were all he had offensively. Obviously much more than Wallace, but nothing special at all.

Basically the Cavs dropped 4 scrubs who would never play with everyone healthy and 2 poor fits. What could possibly be desperate about that?

Joe Smith is a better player than Drew Gooden right now. Toss in West who is a better point than anything Cleveland has had since Andre Miller. Anything that Ben Wallace gives them would simply be gravy.

This makes the Cavs better in the talent and depth department while not compromising anything in the future. Wally gives them a huge expiring next season. Smith and West have reasonably contracts. Ben's deal stinks, but it's a wash when you figure Hughes was making 12 mil to shoot 35% from the field and not distribute the ball.

Cavs got better here. How much remains to be seen, but the notions that they got worse or did something desperate are way off.

[nasbahceltic]

I take it the people who are calling this desperation don't watch the Cavs much?

Wallace is declining and has a bad contract, but it's the same length as Hughes'. Hughes had been a bad fit from day one. The only thing the Cavs lose is his D, while Wally brings an offensive player that complements Lebron much better.

Drew Gooden is one of the dumbest players in the league and plays no D. The Cavs could never play him late in games because he was such a liability. Nice touch from mid range and a half hook were all he had offensively. Obviously much more than Wallace, but nothing special at all.

Basically the Cavs dropped 4 scrubs who would never play with everyone healthy and 2 poor fits. What could possibly be desperate about that?

Joe Smith is a better player than Drew Gooden right now. Toss in West who is a better point than anything Cleveland has had since Andre Miller. Anything that Ben Wallace gives them would simply be gravy.

This makes the Cavs better in the talent and depth department while not compromising anything in the future. Wally gives them a huge expiring next season. Smith and West have reasonably contracts. Ben's deal stinks, but it's a wash when you figure Hughes was making 12 mil to shoot 35% from the field and not distribute the ball.

Cavs got better here. How much remains to be seen, but the notions that they got worse or did something desperate are way off.

I can see where you're coming from, but the difference in Hughe's and Wally's defense is pretty substantial and when you figure he'll have to guard Pierce, Ray or Rip in the playoffs its gonna get the Cav's bigs into foul trouble early and often.

And I love Delonte as much as the next guy but he is not the guy you want running the point for you. He's an undersized two who plays with a lot of heart, but he just doesn't have the ability to effectively play the point position on either side of the ball for a Championship caliber team.

[mg]

^^Of course with LeBron it's not as necessary to have a 'pure' PG running the show since LBJ will have the ball in his hands so much.

I think the only thing the Cavs will miss after this trade is Hughes' perimeter defense. Of course LeBron has really picked it up defensively and Pavlovic, though unheralded, might be their best perimeter defender. Pavlovic was the one who defended Vince Carter so well in the playoffs last year.

[Mahoney_jr]

The Cavs are better now in post defense and worse in perimeter defense. Gooden's offense will be replaced to 80% by Smith. Wally add's more efficient offense compared to Hughes. West will replace Hughes' ballhandling.

I don't know how it will work out, but Ben Wallace needed a clean slate. This year it won't be enough to get by us, but watch out in 2009, when Cleveland will trade Wally, Snow and Damon Jones. That will net them the co-star they were chasing since offseason 2005. It's an ok move for this season but a great move for next season.

And after 2009, Wallace and Ilgauskas will expire and they have the chance to rebuild their frontcourt (offensive post player next to Varejao). I like Cleveland's future much better since Hughes got traded.

[Pogue Mahone]

I think this helps Chicago, a lot. They finally have a penetrator in Hughes to pair with Deng, with Hinrich able to play more PG. That's three above average perimeter defenders in the starting line-up and offensive threats at the PF position with both Nocioni and Gooden and more offense off the bench in Gordon. I think they may have saved their season but the hole may be a little too deep at this point. Granted, Hughes is very much overpaid but he isn't as bad a player as he appeared in Cleveland, imo.

[freakon0mics]

Chicago's lineup looks solid with Hinrich/Hughes/Deng/Thomas/Gooden. Thats not bad at all with Duhon and Gordon coming off the bench as well. They still need a lowpost scorer. To this day, I still don't understand the drafting of Noah. As for the Cavs, they are looking good for the long haul but as of now they are not going to win it all. Losing Hughes means losing a solid perimeter defender. They have a void to fill there and I don't think that Wally and West can help at that.

[UGA Hayes]

Hughes isn't this great or even good defender that people are making him out to be-that first team all defense was a joke-the wizards were the WORST defensive team in the league that year. He is an avg man and poor help defender and really only does a good job against big PG and noone else. The reason the Cavs made a jump in defense last year is because Sasha Pavlovic was a way above avg defnder and could do a good job on twos and threes (did some of the best work I saw last year on the Kobe, TMac types). Its no coincidence that since he and AV have been hurt the Cavs aren't that good defensively. People just give Hughes credit b/c Sasha is anonymous and lord forbid if an unaccomplished player was actually better at things than a "name" player