Top 5 PG Prospects?

[CB4MiamiHeat]

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Living off of hype? Rose is the leader of a #1 seed. Bayless will be playing in the 8/9 game. If you think playing PG is about stats then by all means, take Bayless over Rose. Rose is a true PG, Bayless is a combo guard. Combo guards like Bayless are far more prevelant than true PG's like Rose.

First of all, Rose has not proven hes this Jkidd PG that everyone says he is at the college level......but lets say he is a pass first pure PG.

Teams like Portland, Miami, Houston, Atlanta, Cleveland would love a scoring PG like Bayless since those teams have playmakers like Roy, Wade, Tmac, JJ, Lebron outside the PG position.

Teams like NJ, Seattle, Minnesota would probably prefer a pure PG like Rose.

I dont know who decided that a pass first PG is must, and a PG who looks to score first is a negative.

Last i cheked Parker was OK as the Spurs, and he has a scoring mentality...Miami won w/o a pure point. Same with La.




It kinda depends on the need or the fit..

[JBoogs37]

I think people get overly infatuated with Rose's "unselfish" mindset. Being unselfish doesn't make you a great passer or point guard. He is not, and will never be Jason Kidd. JK has a feel for the game and a level of court vision that Rose doesn't have, plain and simple. Rose is a 6'2-6'3, super athletic, unselfish point guard.

He is a great prospect but his game will be nullified if he cannot get into the lane. He is still more of a project than a guy like Bayless. A better prospect yes, but nowhere near as skilled. He has no midrange game, which will make him useless in the pick and roll until he develops one. He does have GOOD court vision, not Jason Kidd level at all, and as said, does usually look to pass first, although he does tend to force things sometimes.

I see him turning in a Baron Davis type...not Jason Kidd. Bayless has a Gilbert Arenas ceiling, which ain't bad. That said, Rose is the best PG prospect in this draft...but let's not overrate him

[cmd1985]

I for one just feel you all underrate his court vision because his assist aren't high if he averaged 6 assist everyone would be saying his court vision is great!, that is a problem for me. Memphis system sucks for a PG! And I think his in between game is nice, his perimeter shooting is not great. Oh well, what do we know we sit on realgm, it's guys like Steve Kerr and Kevin McHale who well tell us who the next great PG's are, on June 26th

Also I think he could average 20 points as well. He doesn't have to on his team. Against Tennessee the new #1 team in the country when no one else could score he took on the role of scorer. Same thing that happened in the 1st half against Georgetown and against Gonzaga as well. CDR is the go to guy and if he was not there Rose scoring numbers would be higher, but he always shows up in big games with the exception of USC, which was an anomaly

[JBoogs37]

cmd1985, I hear what you're saying, but my views on Rose's court vision are based on the passes he DOESN'T make, not his assists numbers. I mean, most won't believe this, but OJ Mayo's court vision is as good if not better than anybodys in this draft, but look at his assist numbers?? I realize the Memphis system isn't conducive to a ton of assists, but I just don't see JASON KIDD vision with Rose, but he does have very very good court vision. But like you said, what do we matter, we'll all be witnesses on draft day lol.

[Cammo101]

cmd1985, I hear what you're saying, but my views on Rose's court vision are based on the passes he DOESN'T make, not his assists numbers. I mean, most won't believe this, but OJ Mayo's court vision is as good if not better than anybodys in this draft, but look at his assist numbers?? I realize the Memphis system isn't conducive to a ton of assists, but I just don't see JASON KIDD vision with Rose, but he does have very very good court vision. But like you said, what do we matter, we'll all be witnesses on draft day lol.

There is so much wrong with this that I would not know where to start. This whole thread reads like the shoot first combo guard appreciation thread.

[JBoogs37]

I appreciate your opinion, but if you know any pro scouts, ask them who has better court vision, Rose or Mayo? Willingness to pass doesn't make you a better player or passer than the next guy, it makes you more unselfish. Talent and skill make you better. There are more skilled players than Derrick Rose, but he does have the most potential. Rose isn't as "pure" of a point as people make him out to be. But as I've said, all things considered, he's the best PG PROSPECT in this draft...but not J-Kidd. He's good though don't get me wrong.

[cmd1985]

Are you a pro scout? Let me know which one you have talked to. So are you saying is Mayo was less unselfish he would be a better prospect than Rose, Mayo is a fair athlete himself and he is 6'4-6'5

[JBoogs37]

Well no I'm no scout, I'm 19 years old and don't even play basketball anymore lol. But I have an uncle I spend summers with who lives in Northern California, he works with high school/college players as well as pros, working on their skills and all, and right now he's working with a top 25 prospect form the class of 2010. But basically, he's friends with a lot of pro scouts and so I've been forced to sit in and listen to all these kinds of conversations and watch tape, and over time I've just gotten really into scouting type things.

About the unselfishness, I just used Mayo as an example of assists not always telling the whole story. My point is, because of Rose's freakish athleticism and unselfish attitude, he is a great PG prospect. However, him being unselfish/willing to pass doesn't make him a great passer with great vision. He is a good passer with good court vision, but coupled with his size and athleticism makes for a great pro prospect. As far as Mayo goes, right now Rose is a better prospect, because he is more concerned with playing the game the right way than Mayo. However, Mayo has more skills right now. I've seen full-length videos of when he was a sophmore in HS(not that it matters), and he was unbelievably unselfish in comparison to now, and made some pretty scary passes that only the great ones make. If he could ever get back to playing that way, he'd be ridiculous, because he has all the skills. But as of right now, Rose is the guy as far as PG's go, and I'm sure he'll be a great pro, all-star caliber, I just feel some overrate him. That's all

[cmd1985]

That is fine, you are entitled to your opinion and I to mine. I just don't think you have seen enough of Rose to say he only has average court vision, what 6 games on ESPN this year?

[philbe311]

Rose
Collison
Bayless
Augustin
Maynor

[JBoogs37]

Well yeah cmd1985, 6 games on ESPN, but I have also seen at least 5 other games on CSTV, and plenty of his high school/AAU footage...but let me clarify one thing...AT NO POINT did I say Rose had AVERAGE court vision, that would be disrespectful to him. I've said he has VERY GOOD court vision(I said that a few times lol) just not on a J-Kidd level like some people like to say. But no, not average vision, he has very good vision by all means. But as you said, everyone has their opinion, and I respect yours.

[cmd1985]

I appreciate your opinion I just think you will see a different player in the league. And thats after 150 hs and AAU games, and and 2/3 of a college season. I think that a team where he is able to run a high pick and roll and be the guy that sets up everything unlike at Memphis he will be a high level NBA PG in 2 years

[JBoogs37]

I wouldn't doubt it at all, he's got great potential. I think it may take more like 3-5 yrs for him to truly grasp the PG position in the league, but there's no reason why he won't. He's got the physical tools, and the unselfish attitude already, he could be a great. It's just that J-Kidd is a rare breed of PG, so when people start throwing his name around, I'm a bit skeptical. But I wish D-Rose the best and hope he works hard and reaches his all star potential.

[cmd1985]

I think when they say J-Kidd its not only his passing but the fact that Rose will be able to get 10 boards and 10 assist and put up a lot of triple doubles in his prime. And I don't think it will take him 3-5, 2-3 at the most!

[JBoogs37]

Which is why I dig the Baron Davis comparison, who can also get those kind of numbers trip-dub numbers. I actually think Rose will be a better scorer than J-Kidd, but not quite the playmaker. He'll have some 25,10,10 nights, like Davis, but won't be a 10,10,10 on virtually a nightly basis like J-Kidd.

But Rose can be great if he wants, there's no denying that, all the logistics don't really matter in the long run. 2-3yrs, 3-5yrs, again, we're splitting hairs here. Rose will be a beast at some point, probably sooner than later. I'm through lol...for now[/quote]

[cmd1985]

You're right J.Boogs. Anyway I don't really see a player that you really can compare him to, he is his own player. It's funny, you can say he is Wade/Kidd/Payton/Davis just put together, not saying he will be as good as any of those guys, it just makes him an interesting prospect!

[Upperclass]

Rose- Obvious reasons already stated.. though im not a huge fan of his, but cant deny the athletic gifts.. i see early Antonio Daniels, Devin Harris, Barbosa(before nash got there)..
If he doesn't land w/a quality coaching staff/situation i think he'll be an easily disrupted, easily flustered pg who will abandon his skill and decision making to rely on what he has confidence in(athleticism)..seems to lack the natural game sense that pg's usually have

Westbrook- He'll play point in the L, on par w/Rose in athleticism but not height or pg experience.. i think he's Arenas pt. 2..he has "presence"

Curt Jerrells- I think he comes out, he reminds me of early Baron Davis

Bayless- Reasons already stated, though i dont think he'll be dynamic @ the point in the nba.. i think he'll be a bench scorer like Barbosa

AJ Price- super bball IQ and game sense, good looking jumper, but doesnt seem like he has confidence shooting anything but layups.. if he ever gets in shape i think hes a quality starter in the L..reminds me of Cassell

The rest:

Augustin- Not very athletic or overly quick, but moves great, has great feet, good shooter, smart player, tries hard, seems like a leader.. im a fan

Collison- loved his game last yr and the year b4.. seems disinterested this year, i think he wishes he declared in '07.. love his ugly jumper, quickness & speed, grit, vision(but hes not a creator imo)..he's hard to peg but i think tj ford is what he'll endup as but less drive, more jumper

Wildcard: DeMarcus Nelson.. I personally dont think its possible.. but if some team can reign him in and teach him to run the point(ala Louis Williams & Monta), i think he will be an absolute terror in the NBA & 1A as far potential in this draft.. the gifts he has that go un-used @ Duke are just baffling..i see Monta Ellis, much better defender.. i would take this kid mid to late first round no question

[Cammo101]

Augustine is not athletic or quick? Watch him again. He is more athletic and quicker than Jerrells.

[cdash]

DeMarcus Nelson must have some major flaws. Coach K is the best basketball coach alive. Rarely does he "misuse" people.

[Cammo101]

DeMarcus Nelson must have some major flaws. Coach K is the best basketball coach alive. Rarely does he "misuse" people.

He missused Josh McRoberts.