SendEm wrote:Iggy just can't beat ANY defender in the NBA.
it's hard to take you seriously when you only show up when Iggy play poorly..........if your going to hate, grow a pair and show up everygame or atleast everyother game.
76ers @ Warriors 2/29/08
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tk76
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Dedicated_76ers_fan
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Maurice Cheeks sickens me to no end. Games like these should reveal to Ed Stefanski what kind of coach he has. Reggie Evans? In this game? Probably for defensive rebounds but other then that, don't try to involve yourself on offense, it's 4 on 5 anyway. Why is Sam switching against these perimeter players GS has, he should pack the paint instead and trust his perimeter defense.
Dond, these are things coaches fix. These are things coaches preach. And playing basketball doesn't always need to require being a LeBron James, AI, Kobe, or Wade.
Soo....admit that Mo is a BAD, BAD coach and that we can STILL fire him now.
Dond, these are things coaches fix. These are things coaches preach. And playing basketball doesn't always need to require being a LeBron James, AI, Kobe, or Wade.
Soo....admit that Mo is a BAD, BAD coach and that we can STILL fire him now.
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underpressure
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We should not overreact. The Warriors were desperate for a win and unfortunately, they choose us as their victims. If such a scrub like Pietrins hits all of his shots, you cannot do much. The Warriors deserved that win.
My frustration with Dalembert is still ongoing. You can expect of a veteran more than that.
My frustration with Dalembert is still ongoing. You can expect of a veteran more than that.
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SendEm
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I was laughing so hard when the Warriors finally figured out that Carney ONLY can handle the ball with his right hand. Monta Ellis stole the ball from him so hard that the sound that his hand made upon impact on the ball sounded like a blocked shot headed into the 17th row in the crowd. I can NEVER recall hearing anything like that during a steal. That was an example of a player with NBA caliber defensive reactions going up against a player whose ball handling skills are NOT NBA caliber. You could just tell that they went in at half time and talked about Carney's deficiencies waiting for that precise opportunity.
Willie Green: gets to the basket
Lou Williams:gets to the basket
Andre Miller:gets to the basket
Andre Iguodala: shoots midrange jump shots
As a team we have to decide RIGHT NOW where Iggy will play the rest of his career. Is he a front court player or is he a back court player. In order to win in the NBA it is really simple, on offense you need a balance floor with outside shooters, inside shooters, and players that can penetrate the defense and scorer. Iggy is neither of this those three. There are exceptions for role players that play defense/rebound well like Rodman, Ben Wallace, Bruce Bowen. I challenge anyone to dispute what I just wrote. Iggy DOES NOT have championship caliber offense. He can't get it done from the perimeter, he's not a penetrating scorer, and he's not an inside player.
His playing for this bad team without much talent outside of himself doesn't expose his flaws much because we don't have many traditional players. We don't have many outside shooters and inside shooters. We have penetrators like Andre Miller, Willie Green, and Lou Williams but after that everything falls off.
John Salmi must be getting paid by Iggy's agent. I heard him say last night that "Iggy is having a tough time because the Warriors defense is keying on him, every time he gets past his defender another one is waiting on him." Hello that's called NBA defense! I also don't believe that the Warriors keyed on him, the entire NBA has found out that Iggy has a 0% chance of scoring when presented with any defender and a help defender waiting on the same side of the floor with one eye on him. Iggy just might be able to lower his shoulder and get past his defender somehow but he then has a poor ability to make a move on that second defender for a score. In between that first and second defender Iggy normally bails out and passes the ball instead of continue to apply pressure to the defense with his penetration. But most of the time Iggy doesn't even attempt to drive past that first defender he just settles for a fadeaway or pull up jump shot.
Willie Green: gets to the basket
Lou Williams:gets to the basket
Andre Miller:gets to the basket
Andre Iguodala: shoots midrange jump shots
As a team we have to decide RIGHT NOW where Iggy will play the rest of his career. Is he a front court player or is he a back court player. In order to win in the NBA it is really simple, on offense you need a balance floor with outside shooters, inside shooters, and players that can penetrate the defense and scorer. Iggy is neither of this those three. There are exceptions for role players that play defense/rebound well like Rodman, Ben Wallace, Bruce Bowen. I challenge anyone to dispute what I just wrote. Iggy DOES NOT have championship caliber offense. He can't get it done from the perimeter, he's not a penetrating scorer, and he's not an inside player.
His playing for this bad team without much talent outside of himself doesn't expose his flaws much because we don't have many traditional players. We don't have many outside shooters and inside shooters. We have penetrators like Andre Miller, Willie Green, and Lou Williams but after that everything falls off.
John Salmi must be getting paid by Iggy's agent. I heard him say last night that "Iggy is having a tough time because the Warriors defense is keying on him, every time he gets past his defender another one is waiting on him." Hello that's called NBA defense! I also don't believe that the Warriors keyed on him, the entire NBA has found out that Iggy has a 0% chance of scoring when presented with any defender and a help defender waiting on the same side of the floor with one eye on him. Iggy just might be able to lower his shoulder and get past his defender somehow but he then has a poor ability to make a move on that second defender for a score. In between that first and second defender Iggy normally bails out and passes the ball instead of continue to apply pressure to the defense with his penetration. But most of the time Iggy doesn't even attempt to drive past that first defender he just settles for a fadeaway or pull up jump shot.
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dond
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freshie2 wrote:They hustle, but don't have the basketball IQ to keep up.
You have some evidence of this OUTRAGEOUS statement or is this just something you throw out there as though you have some basic knowledge of such things.
Come on ... they lost a game. Try not to extrapolate (like that word ?) that to the nth degree and link it to some generalization about their knowledge of the game. They had won 8 or their last 10 games. They should be allowed a loss without being subjected to baseless inferences about their competence in the game of basketball by a fan.
Unless, of course, you are more than a fan and have some credentials qualifying you to make a judgement as to their basketball IQ.
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dond
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Hewy29 wrote:GS deserves to win. Mo is not a real coach. If you see players taking it easy and not hustling, you pull their ass. Plain and simple. Make a point that you dont play if you dont hustle.
Boy, you almost made a very nice comment here. If you could have just left it with the first sentence it would have been perfect.
The rest of it is just lashing out at the coach because the Sixers are losing. Mo is a real coach and he does have his players hustling and sometimes one team is better than the other team or plays better on a given night. This team out hustles their opponent on a regular basis and if they have a game here and there where it does not appear to be that way ... it happens.
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freshie2
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dond wrote:-= original quote snipped =-
You have some evidence of this OUTRAGEOUS statement or is this just something you throw out there as though you have some basic knowledge of such things.
Come on ... they lost a game. Try not to extrapolate (like that word ?) that to the nth degree and link it to some generalization about their knowledge of the game. They had won 8 or their last 10 games. They should be allowed a loss without being subjected to baseless inferences about their competence in the game of basketball by a fan.
Unless, of course, you are more than a fan and have some credentials qualifying you to make a judgement as to their basketball IQ.
So you think that Sam and Reggie display a high basketball IQ by their play on the floor? My statement was not in regards to the entire team, but to Reggie and Sam specifically...if it is misleading otherwise, I do apologize.
Basketball IQ is not too hard to figure out...Miller has it...Sam does not. Players fall in between the extremes, but for the Sixers, that is probably the high end and low end of the spectrum. If you can't pick up the subtle plays of someone who 'gets it' vs someone who doesn't, then this discussion is pretty useless.
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dbodner
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Unless, of course, you are more than a fan and have some credentials qualifying you to make a judgement as to their basketball IQ.
I love this. Nobody except dond is allowed to have an opinion or make any kind of analysis.
Yet dond is allowed to proclaim Andre Iguodala thinks he's a superstar and a cancer to his team.
I would like to see your basketball and psychology credentials that allow you to make that determination, but prevent us from doing so. You have 24 hours. Go!
</Ricky>
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dond
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freshie2 wrote:So you think that Sam and Reggie display a high basketball IQ by their play on the floor? My statement was not in regards to the entire team, but to Reggie and Sam specifically...if it is misleading otherwise, I do apologize.
Basketball IQ is not too hard to figure out...Miller has it...Sam does not. Players fall in between the extremes, but for the Sixers, that is probably the high end and low end of the spectrum. If you can't pick up the subtle plays of someone who 'gets it' vs someone who doesn't, then this discussion is pretty useless.
Now, that is an entirely different concept than the original statement you made. I can understand that. It was the original "they hustle but have a low basketball IQ" statement that got my attention. To me, that is slamming the entire team as having a low basketball IQ which I was forced to object to. This new thought I would agree with ... although I am not sure what it means.
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dond
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dbodner wrote:Unless, of course, you are more than a fan and have some credentials qualifying you to make a judgement as to their basketball IQ.
I love this. Nobody except dond is allowed to have an opinion or make any kind of analysis.
Yet dond is allowed to proclaim Andre Iguodala thinks he's a superstar and a cancer to his team.
I would like to see your basketball and psychology credentials that allow you to make that determination, but prevent us from doing so. You have 24 hours. Go!
</Ricky>
I don't know where you get the idea that I am preventing anyone from having an opinion or analyzing something. Others may have their opinion and I may express mine. If I see what I consider an OUTRAGEOUS opinion I may weigh in on it expressing my opinion. I know you don't like that, judging by your reactions, but it is my opinion.
And ... I think you might be making things up ... I do not believe I have said anything about Igoudala being a cancer to his team. And, I certainly do not believe that. As for acting like he is a superstar ... There was a time I believed he had gotten caught up in reading his press clippings and was trying to live up to the superstar image. I stand by that opinion. He has admitted he was trying to do too much. He has since backed off of that somewhat and it is no-longer an issue in my mind.
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ChuckS
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[quote]Maurice Cheeks sickens me to no end. Games like these should reveal to Ed Stefanski what kind of coach he has. Reggie Evans? In this game? Probably for defensive rebounds but other then that, don't try to involve yourself on offense, it's 4 on 5 anyway...
Soo....admit that Mo is a BAD, BAD coach and that we can STILL fire him now.[/quote]
I've been trying to avoid posting. This is only my second in 2008. (Enough with the cheers.) I disagree so strongly, with so many, that I fear being exposed as basketball ignorant. But then I thought: If I really am, then this is certainly the place to be.
For example, I think Mo has been doing a great job. However, if Ed does fire him, I pray he at least gets someone who would have realized that Reggie Evans was the least of our problems last night.
Of course Cheeks is not perfect. I was screaming at him at the two minute mark to get Thad out of there, but it took him a little bit too long to come to the same conclusion.
Let me preface this by saying that I believe the kid is good, and will become really good. I personally do not think it will be this year, though, but hope I am wrong. We have been somewhat deluded into believing he has become so much better as a starter. Maybe so, but I suspect he just looks better playing with Dre, who usually gives him at least three passes with which even I could easily score. He will surprise me with an occasional nice move inside, and an even rarer jump shot once in a while, but otherwise does very little to effect the game offensively.
I've seen him play some nice perimeter defense, but rarely, or never, anything but matador defense inside. Last night was an abomination. Sam usually gets blamed for any layup, because he is oftentimes the only defender even in the picture when a big scores -- unless, of course Reggie is in with him.
But you say: look at how well we have played with him starting. You may be right. Perhaps his athleticism, hustle, and energy, help. It is also possible that anyone would look better playing with the Andres,Willie, and Iguodala, than with other newbies. I, on the other hand, suspect that we are playing better now because we have de-pussified our second string with Reggie, who can bang, defend, and rebound, and has a greater basketball knowledge than what he is credited with having by many on this board. There is less chance with Evans in there that we will give up thirty point leads.
The "taking a step back" crowd have some valid arguments. Certainly playing more minutes may help a young guy acclimate more rapidly, and maybe even develop some pro skills. However, you can play someone 48 minutes for 82 games and if a rookie is puny in game one, he most likely will be even more puny in the last game, because his body is not ready for the mental and physical fatigue resulting from the equivalent of four college seasons. I do not know about his future, but right now Thad will have some problems playing the four.
I am in no way blaming this loss on Young. In spite of what I thought of his play last night, losing should never be blamed on a rookie. It was totally a team and, predominantly, veteran effort, combined with great opponent play. It is just that if some are going to blame Evans for everything, they should also pay some attention to the power forward alternatives. I'm glad we have Reggie...and Thad, actually.
But back to the matter at hand. We lost last night because GS was the better team, playing awesome perimeter defense, while also closing down the inside to easy layups. Our best player of the game, Miller, started more slowly than usual and uncharacteristically made some less than stellar plays early. Willie Green also started slowly, so we kind of dug a small hole. About halfway through the first quarter they woke up and both really battled to the end, but Iguodala was not as fortunate. We are not deep enough that those three can struggle, and Sam, against a very good team. Their color commentator (I think it was Jim Barnett, one of my favorite old time points) was very complimentary to the team, and somewhat surprised that we were not blown out in the first quarter, after our bad start.
In summary -- crap happens. By the way, I, too, was very pleased with Carney's play, and Williams looked very good, particularly his jump shot.
Soo....admit that Mo is a BAD, BAD coach and that we can STILL fire him now.[/quote]
I've been trying to avoid posting. This is only my second in 2008. (Enough with the cheers.) I disagree so strongly, with so many, that I fear being exposed as basketball ignorant. But then I thought: If I really am, then this is certainly the place to be.
For example, I think Mo has been doing a great job. However, if Ed does fire him, I pray he at least gets someone who would have realized that Reggie Evans was the least of our problems last night.
Of course Cheeks is not perfect. I was screaming at him at the two minute mark to get Thad out of there, but it took him a little bit too long to come to the same conclusion.
Let me preface this by saying that I believe the kid is good, and will become really good. I personally do not think it will be this year, though, but hope I am wrong. We have been somewhat deluded into believing he has become so much better as a starter. Maybe so, but I suspect he just looks better playing with Dre, who usually gives him at least three passes with which even I could easily score. He will surprise me with an occasional nice move inside, and an even rarer jump shot once in a while, but otherwise does very little to effect the game offensively.
I've seen him play some nice perimeter defense, but rarely, or never, anything but matador defense inside. Last night was an abomination. Sam usually gets blamed for any layup, because he is oftentimes the only defender even in the picture when a big scores -- unless, of course Reggie is in with him.
But you say: look at how well we have played with him starting. You may be right. Perhaps his athleticism, hustle, and energy, help. It is also possible that anyone would look better playing with the Andres,Willie, and Iguodala, than with other newbies. I, on the other hand, suspect that we are playing better now because we have de-pussified our second string with Reggie, who can bang, defend, and rebound, and has a greater basketball knowledge than what he is credited with having by many on this board. There is less chance with Evans in there that we will give up thirty point leads.
The "taking a step back" crowd have some valid arguments. Certainly playing more minutes may help a young guy acclimate more rapidly, and maybe even develop some pro skills. However, you can play someone 48 minutes for 82 games and if a rookie is puny in game one, he most likely will be even more puny in the last game, because his body is not ready for the mental and physical fatigue resulting from the equivalent of four college seasons. I do not know about his future, but right now Thad will have some problems playing the four.
I am in no way blaming this loss on Young. In spite of what I thought of his play last night, losing should never be blamed on a rookie. It was totally a team and, predominantly, veteran effort, combined with great opponent play. It is just that if some are going to blame Evans for everything, they should also pay some attention to the power forward alternatives. I'm glad we have Reggie...and Thad, actually.
But back to the matter at hand. We lost last night because GS was the better team, playing awesome perimeter defense, while also closing down the inside to easy layups. Our best player of the game, Miller, started more slowly than usual and uncharacteristically made some less than stellar plays early. Willie Green also started slowly, so we kind of dug a small hole. About halfway through the first quarter they woke up and both really battled to the end, but Iguodala was not as fortunate. We are not deep enough that those three can struggle, and Sam, against a very good team. Their color commentator (I think it was Jim Barnett, one of my favorite old time points) was very complimentary to the team, and somewhat surprised that we were not blown out in the first quarter, after our bad start.
In summary -- crap happens. By the way, I, too, was very pleased with Carney's play, and Williams looked very good, particularly his jump shot.
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dbodner
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You have said Iguodala needs to leave because he's better than he is. If "needs to leave" isn't the same as being a cancer (but why would he need to leave if he's not affecting the team?), I apologize.
I have no problem with people expressing their opinion. What I do have a problem with is hypocrisy, which I see from you all the time with your "you're not qualified to make that judgement" stance.
I have no problem with people expressing their opinion. What I do have a problem with is hypocrisy, which I see from you all the time with your "you're not qualified to make that judgement" stance.
twitter.com/DerekBodnerNBA :: Senior writer, The Athletic Philadelphia