Will he pass Larry Bird?
What does he need to do (or how many championships does he need to pass him)?
Can LeBron pass Larry if he never wins a title?
Will LeBron pass Bird as best SF ever?
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Will LeBron pass Bird as best SF ever?
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That Nicka
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greenbeans
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If the MVP actually made sense, he would win it(like KB should've won it in 05-06) he would be the clear front-runner.-
Benedict_Boozer
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Lebron is 23 years old, that's younger than alot of rookies. What is the point of comparing him to someone as accomplished as Bird?
Compare him to his 23 yr old peers instead of proven HOF's and give him time to actually accomplish things. He's got a LONG time before he even hits his 30's and is still improving his game.
Compare him to his 23 yr old peers instead of proven HOF's and give him time to actually accomplish things. He's got a LONG time before he even hits his 30's and is still improving his game.
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Jules Winnfield
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I think Lebron is going to surpass Jordan, honestly.
I just don't think there's anyone in the history of the game who can do what Lebron does. Honestly, the only thing keeping him from being the best player of all time is rings, MVPs, and defense.
I guarantee Lebron is going to get at least 5 league MVPs. He's going to put up 30/7/7 like every season. There is no player in the modern game that can put up numbers like that.
I guarantee he'll improve his defense.
The only question is rings...and I personally think that if you gave him just one more elite player that could score and play D, it would be over with.
I just don't think there's anyone in the history of the game who can do what Lebron does. Honestly, the only thing keeping him from being the best player of all time is rings, MVPs, and defense.
I guarantee Lebron is going to get at least 5 league MVPs. He's going to put up 30/7/7 like every season. There is no player in the modern game that can put up numbers like that.
I guarantee he'll improve his defense.
The only question is rings...and I personally think that if you gave him just one more elite player that could score and play D, it would be over with.
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That Nicka
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Benedict_Boozer wrote:Lebron is 23 years old, that's younger than alot of rookies. What is the point of comparing him to someone as accomplished as Bird?
Compare him to his 23 yr old peers instead of proven HOF's and give him time to actually accomplish things. He's got a LONG time before he even hits his 30's and is still improving his game.
Uhm, because he's basically a lock to go to the HOF at only 23... He and Bird play the same position and as of right now, it seems as though LeBron will retire as AT LEAST the 2nd best SF of all time
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On topic... IMHO all if LeBron wins a championship with a similar roster to which he has now AND continues to put up 30/8/8 for the rest of his career then he will be the best SF to ever play...
If LeBron eventually gets a 2nd all star and an overall solid squad then he will need 2-3 rings to surpass Bird... Reason being, Bird had the luxary of playing with TWO all star big men... i dont think any other superstar in NBA history played with two all star bigs..
So imo LeBron needs either:
- 1 title with a team of roleplayers (like he has now) while putting up his current numbers
OR
- 2-3 titles with one other all star, while putting up his current numbers
I think either one is definiitely possible considering he is 23 and could very well play for another 15 years
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Benedict_Boozer
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That Nicka wrote:Benedict_Boozer wrote:Lebron is 23 years old, that's younger than alot of rookies. What is the point of comparing him to someone as accomplished as Bird?
Compare him to his 23 yr old peers instead of proven HOF's and give him time to actually accomplish things. He's got a LONG time before he even hits his 30's and is still improving his game.
Uhm, because he's basically a lock to go to the HOF at only 23... He and Bird play the same position and as of right now, it seems as though LeBron will retire as AT LEAST the 2nd best SF of all time
_____________________________________________________________
On topic... IMHO all if LeBron wins a championship with a similar roster to which he has now AND continues to put up 30/8/8 for the rest of his career then he will be the best SF to ever play...
If LeBron eventually gets a 2nd all star and an overall solid squad then he will need 2-3 rings to surpass Bird... Reason being, Bird had the luxary of playing with TWO all star big men... i dont think any other superstar in NBA history played with two all star bigs..
So imo LeBron needs either:
- 1 title with a team of roleplayers (like he has now) while putting up his current numbers
OR
- 2-3 titles with one other all star, while putting up his current numbers
I think either one is definiitely possible considering he is 23 and could very well play for another 15 years
I love LBJ but he is not a lock for the HOF just yet. There have been guys who were comparable (maybe not better) like Grant Hill for example who's career was completely derailed by injuries.
Look at what happened to Wade this year...LBJ needs to do what he's doing now for at least another 5-6+ years to ensure a spot in the HOF.
That said I agree with your ideas on what LBJ would need to accomplish
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That Nicka
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Benedict_Boozer wrote:-= original quote snipped =-
I love LBJ but he is not a lock for the HOF just yet. There have been guys who were comparable (maybe not better) like Grant Hill for example who's career was completely derailed by injuries.
Look at what happened to Wade this year...LBJ needs to do what he's doing now for at least another 5-6+ years to ensure a spot in the HOF.
That said I agree with your ideas on what LBJ would need to accomplish
yeah, i meant if he continues his current production he is definitely a lock
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C'mon Cavs
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If LeBron wins a championship with the Cavs current roster, I will launch him over Jordan to be honest (in response to the post above).
I dont think that this Cavs team would win the championship even if you replaced LeBron with any player in the history of the game. So, having said that, he would jump to #1 in my book if he gets it done with this squad this year.
I think he is destined to be a top 5 player of all time. Where he falls in that mix will have a lot to do with his health, his team around him, and how he progresses as a player.
I dont think that this Cavs team would win the championship even if you replaced LeBron with any player in the history of the game. So, having said that, he would jump to #1 in my book if he gets it done with this squad this year.
I think he is destined to be a top 5 player of all time. Where he falls in that mix will have a lot to do with his health, his team around him, and how he progresses as a player.
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tsherkin
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I don't think Lebron will pass Bird. It's certainly possible, but Larry had a lot of achievements that are really hard to conceive of Lebron matching.
I sincerely doubt Lebron will ever win 3 consecutive MVPs, and I sincerely doubt he'll make the Finals in three consecutive years (5 times overall, winning three times).
I don't think he'll be THAT good, not with the competition he's got right now. Remember, Bird's Celtics thoroughly abused people (the start of three consecutive years as the #1 team).
While Bird was a Celtic, Boston had the best record in the league in his rookie season, then tied Philly for the best record the year after, had the best record in his third season, had the best record again two years later (the start of three consecutive seasons at the top), they dropped off a bit as L.A., Detroit and Chicago started to surge, then went 42-40 when Bird only played 6 games in 88-89 and never really recovered after that.
But that means that over Bird's career, they held or tied for the best record in 6/13 seasons, averaging 57.8 wins per season in that time (59.1 if you don't count the season in which he only played 6 games and 61.1 if you look at the years before his back surgery, from 79-80 through 87-88, a 9-year span).
Larry Bird was an assassin and the best player on one of the best teams in the history of the league; not teams as in single-season squads, but a team that was a monster for a decade and very good even on his decline while injuries and age forced Bird to play fewer and fewer games.
Lebron is an amazing talent but we'll have to see how good a GM Danny Ferry can be and just how good Lebron gets. I doubt he'll match Bird.
I sincerely doubt Lebron will ever win 3 consecutive MVPs, and I sincerely doubt he'll make the Finals in three consecutive years (5 times overall, winning three times).
I don't think he'll be THAT good, not with the competition he's got right now. Remember, Bird's Celtics thoroughly abused people (the start of three consecutive years as the #1 team).
While Bird was a Celtic, Boston had the best record in the league in his rookie season, then tied Philly for the best record the year after, had the best record in his third season, had the best record again two years later (the start of three consecutive seasons at the top), they dropped off a bit as L.A., Detroit and Chicago started to surge, then went 42-40 when Bird only played 6 games in 88-89 and never really recovered after that.
But that means that over Bird's career, they held or tied for the best record in 6/13 seasons, averaging 57.8 wins per season in that time (59.1 if you don't count the season in which he only played 6 games and 61.1 if you look at the years before his back surgery, from 79-80 through 87-88, a 9-year span).
Larry Bird was an assassin and the best player on one of the best teams in the history of the league; not teams as in single-season squads, but a team that was a monster for a decade and very good even on his decline while injuries and age forced Bird to play fewer and fewer games.
Lebron is an amazing talent but we'll have to see how good a GM Danny Ferry can be and just how good Lebron gets. I doubt he'll match Bird.
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Buckeye-NBAFan
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Benedict_Boozer wrote:-= original quote snipped =-
I love LBJ but he is not a lock for the HOF just yet. There have been guys who were comparable (maybe not better) like Grant Hill for example who's career was completely derailed by injuries.
Look at what happened to Wade this year...LBJ needs to do what he's doing now for at least another 5-6+ years to ensure a spot in the HOF.
That said I agree with your ideas on what LBJ would need to accomplish
Remember, it is the basketball hall of fame. I don't know how much they take into account high school accomplishments, but LeBron was one of the three most accomplished high school players of all time with Kareem and Jerry Lucas.
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TheSheriff
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Buckeye-NBAFan wrote:-= original quote snipped =-
Remember, it is the basketball hall of fame. I don't know how much they take into account high school accomplishments, but LeBron was one of the three most accomplished high school players of all time with Kareem and Jerry Lucas.
Well Bird was one of the more accomplished collegiate players ever, winning the Naismith and Wooden Awards, leading Indiana State to the title game, and left college (after 3 years) as the the fifth leading scoring ever. Kinda hard to have your high school games on ESPN when you are playing in French Lick.
And who really cares about high school anyway? Jordan got cut from his high school team.