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Bianchi: John Weisbrod Deserves Some Credit

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Post#121 » by mhectorgato » Wed Mar 12, 2008 3:37 pm

maginno wrote:Battie is out for an entire year and even when healthy plays SUBSTANTIALLY less minutes and contributes less than Wallace when he is healthy. So when you adjust minutes on the floor (which after all is all that matters) you come much closer to Battie even when he is healthy.

Theres nothing inherent about going all out. with experience and good coaching you learn to pick your spots. For someone thats actually seen more Heat games then most of you I can tell you Wade used to hit the deck A LOT more. He credits none other than Stan for that so perfect coach for it here.

When you factor in that you would have another player out of the money left then its a wash with better defense, options for when your outside shot isn't falling, more rebounding and much more easily traded pieces to upgrade cause any way you slice it this isn't your championship team.

Now of course you can't just transplant numbers form one team to another but it goes to show what the player is capable of and since team chemistry has a lot to do with things you would be still playing an up tempo game but would go inside more often so Wallace would get his touches.


Well the decision would be between Wallace and Rashard, and not a comparison between Wallace and Battie.

But coming into the season - based on past history - what were the odds that Wallace would miss relatively considerable time due to injury?

The concussion he got this season was not from his attacking or not, it was about him being in a battle in the post. That's something that could certainly happen if he were on his team.

No doubt that Wallace would be an interesting addition to the team. But assuming that we got Wallace and (Nocioni or Kapono) as some suggested - and Battie went down.

How effectively would Wallace play the 4 spot?

His numbers from 82games at the PF spot are 37% of the time spent there with a team net of -44 points. Whereas Rashard's are 69% and +272 respectively. (not that I think Rashard is an amazing PF).

I think with the review of the team from previous seasons of play, we needed a player like Rashard. Not many would have predicted such a breakout season from Hedo. Had Battie not have gotten injured, I wonder what Hedo's numbers would look like?
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Post#122 » by maginno » Wed Mar 12, 2008 3:46 pm

Sorry gato. Normally I'd give you the honor of actually responding to your posts point by point but your insistence on failing to denounce ORl policy and now trying to justify

For what it's worth, I'll put down whomever I feel like putting down at any time if I feel like that poster merits being put down


Only cements you as a hypocrite (in that area). I need no other proof and to the degree that others agree with you I have all the answer I ever need to why you take issue with me. Simply because I don't agree with your positions. Here we have a stated policy that ORL extends to anyone he feels like putting down and we have your defense of it. What more do I need? Talk about making yourself look silly

If it were not so you would object to the policy. and since you defend it then why should I change? Your defending the right for ORL to state that he can put down WHOEVER he feels like putting down gives me no reason to cease from slicing and dicing your arguments to death which even in this thread you can see I will continue to do.

and spare us all the veiled reference to your online fraternity. Only those who are in it are impressed with it. As evidenced in this thread and many others I have a growing amount of people that agree with my positions. But I unlike you don't need popularity anyway because you have so PERFECTLY demonstrated your hypocrisy. I have no need to heed your word s or anyone else who would defend the indefensible. I can hereby forever dismiss it without much fanfare.
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Post#123 » by mhectorgato » Wed Mar 12, 2008 3:52 pm

maginno wrote:Sorry gato. Normally I'd give you the honor of actually responding to your posts point by point but your insistence on failing to denounce ORl policy and now trying to justify

For what it's worth, I'll put down whomever I feel like putting down at any time if I feel like that poster merits being put down


Only cements you as a hypocrite (in that area). I need no other proof and to the degree that others agree with you I have all the answer I ever need to why you take issue with me. Simply because I don't agree with your positions. Here we have a stated policy that ORL extends to anyone he feels like putting down and we have your defense of it. What more do I need? Talk about making yourself look silly

If it were not so you would object to the policy. and since you defend it then why should I change? Your defending the right for ORL to state that he can put down WHOEVER he feels like putting down gives me no reason to cease from slicing and dicing your arguments to death which even in this thread you can see I will continue to do.

and spare us all the veiled reference to your online fraternity. Only those who are in it are impressed with it. As evidenced in this thread and many others I have a growing amount of people that agree with my positions. But I unlike you don't need popularity anyway because you have so PERFECTLY demonstrated your hypocrisy. I have no need to heed your word s or anyone else who would defend the indefensible. I can hereby forever dismiss it without much fanfare.


Works both ways.
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Post#124 » by ORL » Wed Mar 12, 2008 4:00 pm

It's a simple as it gets -- I can do whatever the hell I please, just you like can, just like hector can, just like any other poster on this site can -- SO LONG AS YOU DO IT WITHOUT BREAKING TERMS OF SERVICE. I challenge you to find the point at which I have done that.
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Post#125 » by maginno » Wed Mar 12, 2008 4:06 pm

mhectorgato wrote:No doubt that Wallace would be an interesting addition to the team. But assuming that we got Wallace and (Nocioni or Kapono) as some suggested - and Battie went down.

How effectively would Wallace play the 4 spot?



thats silly. you don't evaluate a player based on his ability to play out of position because the team was so poorly constructed it was depending on a 32 year old PF as your only decent big to play the position. We are arguing that the team should have been better constructed to begin with. The comparison to Battie was precisely because we ended up depending on ONE player for one spot who got injured longer than Wallace ever has.

You are lost just thrashing around for a point that will make you feel better about being proven wrong in your defense of the indefensible. Wouldn't it be better to just recant the hypocrisy?

anyway I got to get ready for work. looking forward to more exchanges within the newly stated rules of the "culture of this board"
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Post#126 » by mhectorgato » Wed Mar 12, 2008 4:10 pm

maginno wrote:thats silly. you don't evaluate a player based on his ability to play out of position because the team was so poorly constructed it was depending on a 32 year old PF as your only decent big to play the position.


Regardless of the reason why we were depending on Tony, it's the situation that GWallace and the Magic would find themselves in.

Or would the signing of GWallace and (Nocioni / Kapono) somehow change the fact that we were depending on Tony to be healthy?

We are arguing that the team should have been better constructed to begin with. The comparison to Battie was precisely because we ended up depending on ONE player for one spot who got injured longer than Wallace ever has.


No. We were debating about the addition of Wallace and Noc/Kapono to team as it stands. Well, at least that's what I replied to richboy about. Then you replied to richboy bringing up Battie. For a couple of posts we then were discussing Wallace's injury history in relation to Tony, which I attempted to steer back to back the discussion of Wallace and Noc/Kapono.

The fact is that Tony was already signed. The fact is that were coming into camp expecting Tony to be the first option at the PF. The fact is that the signing of Wallace and Noc/Kapono wouldn't change that fact.

The fact, iirc, is that SVG said he would experiement with the lineups and perhaps not even use a typical lineup.

So with all these established facts (except for possibly the last statement) and had we signed Wallace instead of Lewis, then Wallace or Hedo would our PF this season, do to the fact that we lost Tony.

So if Crash wouldn't be our starting 4, who would? Would Hedo be moved to the PF spot? Would he as effective at the 4?

Again, the discussion wasn't how the team wasn't constructed prior to this off-season, rather how would the signing of Wallace be different than Lewis.

You are lost just thrashing around for a point that will make you feel better about being proven wrong in your defense of the indefensible. Wouldn't it be better to just recant the hypocrisy?


I hereby dismiss this without much fanfare, due to the fact your trying to change the discussion to Tony and the teams prior construction, rather than how Wallace would fit in or be used.
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Post#127 » by maginno » Wed Mar 12, 2008 4:13 pm

ORL wrote:It's a simple as it gets -- I can do whatever the hell I please, just you like can, just like hector can, just like any other poster on this site can -- SO LONG AS YOU DO IT WITHOUT BREAKING TERMS OF SERVICE. I challenge you to find the point at which I have done that.


Simpler as it gets - You are a hypocrite. If you defend the right to put down others for yourself while complaining about me doing the same its a classical defining example of the meaning of the word. In fact its the purest possible form of hypocrisy.
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Post#128 » by ORL » Wed Mar 12, 2008 4:18 pm

You probably misread something somewhere, I NEVER EVER said anything of the kind. You can do whatever you please, I'm not a mod anymore, it's not my problem.
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Post#129 » by spinedoc » Wed Mar 12, 2008 10:30 pm

maginno wrote:-= original quote snipped =-

Now get some of our cronies to come in and make the same observations and then everyone will see what you all stand for - that you will defend character assassinations behind peoples back out of one side of your mouths and having principles out of the other.


I have to weigh in here because you have taken this argument off track from what it initially was. You like to do that often, play the martyr when it was you and your comments that people have been having issue with. ORL wasn't the one going around this board for months insulting people and talking down to them, that was all you Mags. He merely commented on your audacity of not hiding that fact, not that he insulted you or that you felt insulted when he did so. There is no hypocrisy here, because no one is putting themselves up on a pedestal like you do. You clearly think your better than everyone here, and obviously thats a problem with some, go figure.

And no one is claiming to be pristine here either, we have all used off color remarks or have gotten carried away in the heat of the moment. Thats not the point. No one is trying to be the thought police here, its a question of there being a threshold. I'll admit that you passed mine a long time ago, and not because of one comment, or one post, one thread, or even one week of discussion. Its been non stop with you. You rub people the wrong way, thats why you get approached about it, and it doesn't always have to be put in a nice way for people to make that point. I don't know about you, but most of us try to remain respectful to one another. Thats why we use "lol", "rofl", or silly emoticons, to at least attempt to let the reader know that we aren't trying to be disrespectful. I admit, I'm not always successful, but at least I try to show a little humility. Thats all people have attempted to do with you in one way or the other, but instead you turn it around on them to attempt to highlight their flaws.

You talk a good game about being an adult, and often call people kid, but where is your maturity? You spout off about people accusing you of being a duplicate account, its because we have others in the past, and present, who have the same exact shortcomings as you. Your posts ring of deja vu. This is an internet community not just a message board, and if you want respect from others you have to give some from time to time. Davor (ORL) has earned a decent reputation here because of doing just that, respecting others, whether you feel that has been displayed in this thread or not, he's bent over backwards in that regard throughout his time here. Thats something that you haven't even attempted yet, let alone achieved, just my two cents anyway.
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Post#130 » by maginno » Thu Mar 13, 2008 1:34 am

Spinedoc. Your input is welcome because it makes my argument of a hypocritical online fraternity so much more solid the more of you that weigh in. I scanned your response (sorry read the tone before so didn't bother with the whole thing) and your comments in regard to ORL confirm what I have said for months.

I would have ENTIRELY predicted that you would defend the indefensible. You could write a thousand more long paragraphs you will never change the definition of hypocrisy cemented in every dictionary and its not up for your vote. I need only quote again what you choose to defend

For what it's worth, I'll put down whomever I feel like putting down at any time if I feel like that poster merits being put down.


What more needs to be said? You have no credibility based in any integrity to accuse me of putting people down when you defend a blatantly stated right to do the same by one of your online friends. Obvious hypocrisy. Positively obvious,

Sorry but you defy all your talk of earning reputation of respect when what you really mean is that he respects those who you want him to and doesn't those you you don't care for.

Its also quite obvious that you put a great store in the length of time people have been on this board and confuse tenure with reputation' Realgm doesn't exist for your fraternity. All members are the same and that approach causes Realgm to grow and earn additional revenue. What you attempt is actually in contrast to Realgm's goals. If you think your online fraternity should be honored go and start your own board. This isn't it.

I wouldn't have thought I needed to write this but seeing as you bring it up every now and again - let me put it to rest. I am not seeking your approval, do not consider it necessary or particularly want your respect. its a wide open board of which the magic area is just a part. I don't need anonymous board respect to get through the day and every time Otis makes a bad move more and more people agree with me anyway.

In the end you use "history of the board" "time " of being a member and a lot of similar things to prop up your arguments. in the end they always fall anyway because arguments are made on rationality not on tenure.

So for the times I have gotten personal I can and will apologize but in the cases like this post where you just don't like having your arguments taken apart - Thats just part of life and debate on a free board. Since your now stated and defended culture indicates that putting down whoever you feel to put down is your right I could go to town with that standard but its poor form and i try not to follow a pack especially not this one.
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Post#131 » by spinedoc » Thu Mar 13, 2008 2:12 am

That was very inspiring, but it wasn't meant to be a discussion. I'm going to Amsterdam tomorrow, and I don't have the time to deal with your Napoleon complex. Danka Well! 8)
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Post#132 » by mhectorgato » Thu Mar 13, 2008 2:15 am

spinedoc wrote:That was very inspiring, but it wasn't meant to be a discussion. I'm going to Amsterdam tomorrow, and I don't have the time to deal with your Napoleon complex. Danka Well! 8)


Bon voyage. Gute Reise. Goede reis.
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Post#133 » by spinedoc » Thu Mar 13, 2008 2:27 am

mhectorgato wrote:-= original quote snipped =-



Bon voyage. Gute Reise. Goede reis.


Thanks man. Its a great time, I highly recommend it. :D
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Post#134 » by mhectorgato » Thu Mar 13, 2008 2:30 am

spinedoc wrote:Thanks man. Its a great time, I highly recommend it. :D


Highly?

Give MagicHolland a shout while there. He's from Holland you know.
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Post#135 » by ORL » Thu Mar 13, 2008 2:34 am

Always wanted to go. Was at the airport (which is huuuuge, BTW) a couple of times, but never got a chance to get off it. Have fun spine... Is this a trip you're making with our without your significant other? :D
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Post#136 » by spinedoc » Thu Mar 13, 2008 2:38 am

ORL wrote:Always wanted to go. Was at the airport (which is huuuuge, BTW) a couple of times, but never got a chance to get off it. Have fun spine... Is this a trip you're making with our without your significant other? :D


Without, there are eight of us. One from Miami, two from Tampa, four from Norway, and little me from Tennessee. Its a blast, we go every year. The Mrs. is totally cool with it though, she's the best.
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Post#137 » by ORL » Thu Mar 13, 2008 2:44 am

LOL nice. Sounds like a keeper...
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Post#138 » by craig01 » Thu Mar 13, 2008 2:48 am

Have a great trip doc.

BTW- I thought this was a Magic board.
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Post#139 » by TheGlyde » Thu Mar 13, 2008 2:52 am

Yeah so... Hedo is having a nice season eh?
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Post#140 » by mhectorgato » Thu Mar 13, 2008 2:53 am

craig01 wrote:Have a great trip doc.

BTW- I thought this was a Magic board.


Check one:

_____ pun intended

or

_____ no pun intended
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