IT'S TIME...

soobias · Post #1 » by **soobias** » Mon Mar 17, 2008 9:39 pm

it's time to let nate go.
with all that is going on with rudy/sergio i think it's time.
almost everyone is saying that sergio sucks ,not readyor that blake&jack are better. to me that is crazy if you follow the blazers like i do you would remember last year at the end after we sat z-bo down and started playing are younger players sregio did good. i'm talking getting almost 10 assist in one quarter good.
everyone here agree's that jack needs to go,but that is not the only one who needs to go.we all know how pryz logs little if any mins inthe 4th yet he's our best def. fry get's inconsistant mins at pf. blake could be having a good game then you don't see him in the 4th these are some of the reasons why are games are so close.
lma&roy get consistant mins and well deserved but they need others to get mins to to jell.
how would you feel if oden was killing his man and we're winning, then nate sat him out for a long stretch now we are losing or it's close but the other team built up momentum,would you blame oden for not being in a rythem or say the other team wanted it more.
listen i'm not a big hate nate or jack kind of guy,it's just we have a chance to do something really great these next few years and i don't want to lose core guys to fa because inconsistant mins or coaching.
we really don't need any other pieces just oden &rudy and subtract a few pieces that's all.
i know some of you are going to defend nate and jack,but before you do remember this when we started are streak it was the assistants who told nate to give them a longer leash to make and correct thier own mistakes. don't get me wrong nate did what he was suppose to do bring in order and discipline when zack and miles were playing.he did a good job but it's time for someone to get us to the next level(mike d)(adelman)someone..

TBpup · Post #2 » by **TBpup** » Mon Mar 17, 2008 9:47 pm

Adelman is performing miracles in Houston. Have you seen their lineup? Cast offs, rookies and geriatrics. Now Adelman can coach...

:starwars

swede · Post #3 » by **swede** » Mon Mar 17, 2008 10:03 pm

But everyone is playing A role and playing it DAMN well there. Its crazy.

SoHo · Post #4 » by **SoHo** » Mon Mar 17, 2008 10:15 pm

I think the real question is which coach that is available can do a better job than Nate. Sure Adelman is a good coach, but he's the Rockets coach.

Just out of curiosity when does Nate's contract end?

Post #5 » by **mojomarc** » Mon Mar 17, 2008 10:22 pm

Didn't he sign a four year deal?

Post #6 » by **Billy** » Mon Mar 17, 2008 10:23 pm

There seems to be a lot of "pie in the sky" talk here. Yeah, D'Antoni or Adelman would be awesome. But they aren't coming here. They are under contract. Portland could probably fire Nate and try to seek permission to talk. But what happens if neither is interested? Who do you get?

Who should Portland go out and get to coach anyway? Obviously McMillan isn't perfect, but who is? Who is out there, clearly available and is head and shoulders above McMillan? It must not be too hard to find right?

Jack's regressed to a point of comedy at this point so I'm not going to waste my time defending him.

I don't want to bash Sergio, as he has a lot of skill. But really, I don't think I've ever seen so much stress about a third string point guard. Sure he's got plenty of skill, but it's gotten to the point where nothing short of Sergio playing tons of minutes of perfect basketball is going to make most people happy.

I hear all kinds of excuses for Sergio (which balances out all the excuses I can make up for Nate

). If he misses all 5 of his shots they were all in-and-outs. If he turns the ball over 3 times in 3 minutes Nate must have stifled him somehow. Yet Jack can go 3/5 from the field, have 8 assists a steal and a TO and somehow he was still crap (I guess I'm defending Jack anyway).

I guess I just don't really know what at this point McMillan could do that will make people happy. Okay, lets go out and get a new coach. I wouldn't complain if he was clearly better than Nate. But who are they going to bring in?

If they bring him in and Sergio still doesn't play is that coach also a bad coach? If Rudy waits for Nate to get fired, and then sees Sam Mitchell replacing him (simply a hypo here), and cites his handling of Garbo for not wanting to come over, do we fire him on the spot?

Why is it that Portland's record is so easily cast aside as if the team is winning despite McMillan? Because he's not playing a third string point guard? Forget his record in Seattle, and just look at Portland. His record blows with 2 pathetic roster, and has overachieved this year. Sure I'd like to be in the playoffs fighting for the one seed. Instead this year we have witnessed a team that will most likely double the number of wins any team this young has ever won in NBA history. Most people I think would be relatively excited about that--even if the third string point guard was being unjustly sat down.

Milkdud · Post #7 » by **Milkdud** » Mon Mar 17, 2008 10:33 pm

Couple things

1) Unless there is some clear cut better coach out there we can for sure land I don't see a pressing need to dump Nate. He might not be a great coach but his players love to play for him and with our lineup being made up of so many young players I think thats an impotent fact.

2) Im not gonna defend Jack because he has been broken down the whole season on this board. I think everyone has a pretty clear stance on him, and Ive had my moments wondering why Sergio didn't get some PT in some games where Jack was out there hurting us. That being said Sergio's game is majorly flawed. If he wants to get some PT is has to become at least a marginal threat to score. His jumper shot is flat and no threat to go in and he rivals Damon for his ability to make layups. Dislike Jack all you want but at least he can put some shots down.

Post #8 » by **mojomarc** » Mon Mar 17, 2008 10:36 pm

Good rant, Billy. However, as a counter-point I have looked at Nate's record in Seattle and have been unimpressed. I've seen his record in Portland and a hot streak against teams that were pretty much all down at that point is about all that has saved his job this year (and, come to think of it, all that kept his job in Seattle and all that got him hired here in the first place).

That said, no way he is getting fired this season. He simply would consider it unfair treatment given that he built a scheme (his view, not mine) anticipating Oden and then lost him and he had to backtrack considerably. Now I don't care if this is a true viewpoint or not, the fact is this would be the viewpoint of a coach, and likely would be the viewpoint of any coach we would interview as well.

The solution is not for Nate to go now, but rather to give him a chance with Oden. If the players really show as limited an improvement as I think they will, nothing will save Nate's job at that point.

zzaj · Post #9 » by **zzaj** » Mon Mar 17, 2008 10:43 pm

I think that Nate was brought in because Blazer management saw how little a "player's" coach in Cheeks did for the team. They wanted a disciplinarian and down to basics guy to guide a very young team.

IMO Nate is more of a "system" coach that, regardless of type or skill set of his players, will play the same way. That of course is no good for developing young players' skills, but schools them in the fundamentals of basketball.

My best guess is that when Nate's contract is up (after next year?), the team will be past the point of needing the hardnosed taskmaster coach and try and find someone who can develop a winning style based on the strengths and weaknesses of our roster.

It's a shame that Houston is doing so well, Adelman would be absolutely perfect both on the court and in the p.r. dept. for the Blazer organization in the near & distant future.

Yadadimean · Post #10 » by **Yadadimean** » Mon Mar 17, 2008 10:44 pm

gotta agree with Billy and Milkdud on this one.

soobias · Post #11 » by **soobias** » Mon Mar 17, 2008 10:47 pm

because we are talking about our leader, general, our decision maker. it all goes though the coach. who's on the floor and what trey are suppose to be doing and not doing.
have you noticed how much the team changed when james jones is on the court. it's not about jack/sergio it's aout the team and can we get better. we have a lot of talent (young) but a lot of it.
take a look at last year everyone was scared to let zack go because LMA was'nt ready. once zack sat down LMA performed imo sergio performed,hell jamal made a living off of sergio's passes.
it's the same with james jones he shoots more wide open shots with sergio. don't get me wrong i'm not saying start sergio and play him 35-40 mins. i just don't want to see what happened to J.O'NEIL happens to rudy and if some of you guys would rather trade him for what might be from colledge kids instead of holding on to a guy who's mvp at a higher level then maybee we're all just confused about the game of bball.IMHO.

The Emcee · Post #12 » by **The Emcee** » Mon Mar 17, 2008 10:59 pm

Imagine the outcry from the public if we up and fired McMillan. Rip City is finally back.

Just saying PR stuff will be considered.

Milkdud · Post #13 » by **Milkdud** » Mon Mar 17, 2008 11:18 pm

I'm sure Nate is guilty of giving Jack and long leash and Sergio a short one. That being said I really don't think Sergio has improved him game much to merit getting more PT. As great as his passing is he is a offensive liability out there and NBA teams are smart enough to use that to their advantage. Whatever advantage Sergio has over Jack as a play maker IMO gets reduced when the other team know Sergio can't hit the broadside of a barn with his jumper. Fault Jack however much you want, and he clearly has his flaws but you get him a solid look at a 3 or watch him attack the hoop and he has been able to get the blazers much needed points, that something I have a hard time having any faith in Sergio being able to do.

With the Rudy situation I honestly hope its being blow out of proportion because it seems really silly to me. Other then there are from Spain I don't see many parallels with Rudy and Sergio. Rudy's game from what ive seen is much farther along then Sergio's and his skill set he has and the pressing need for the blazers to have a backup SG makes it hard for me to believe that Rudy wouldn't get a fair chance at PT.

listerine · Post #14 » by **listerine** » Mon Mar 17, 2008 11:24 pm

I think this is a ridiculous discussion right now. You fire coaches when teams underperform. By all accounts, this year's Blazers are vastly over-exceeding expectations. In fact, it seems they over-exceeded so much that some people have now readjusted their expectations and are disappointed that the Blazers have leveled out.

And I'm tired of these conversations about, "Nate can't develop young talent.... Nate destroys young players... Sergio's Blazer career will be wasted and then he'll become a star on another team."

Look at the players who have moved on from the Blazers since Nate became coach.

Randolph
Dixon
Telfair
Blake (only to return)
Khryapa
Ha
Udoka
Fred Jones
Green

Not a very stellar list. Let me know if I'm missing anyone.

If anyone can point out a Jermaine O'neal who Nate hid on the bench before he was traded, point him out.

Taking a quick glance through the Sonics' old rosters also fails to reveal a player who "languished" on the bench under Nate, only to become a better player with a new coach.

The best argument against Sergio playing more is just that (believe it or not) Jack might be the better player. (ooooh... I so went there!)

PDXKnight · Post #15 » by **PDXKnight** » Mon Mar 17, 2008 11:25 pm

As much as I've disapproved of Nate's coaching, I don't think it makes much sense to fire him right now. He still has two full seasons on his deal which is manageable and if a better coach is available at that time, I think that would be the time to go after another coach. As it stands, Nate's good at motivating this team and two years should be enough time to satisfy his supporters and critics (including myself) where if he vastly improves his coaching, he'll stay and if he is still showing the same problems in his coaching, KP will hopefully hire another coach.

The other thing to consider is that Nate has yet to coach the Blazers with Oden and Rudy. This is Nate's final chance to prove that he can live up to his defensive image and establish a top defensive team in the league (which he'd better do with a monster like Oden in the paint).

kumquat · Post #16 » by **kumquat** » Mon Mar 17, 2008 11:34 pm

I think sergio is being treated a bit harshly, but how the hell has his shot not improved in 2 years. It looks as flat as ever.

taufblazers33 · Post #17 » by **taufblazers33** » Mon Mar 17, 2008 11:56 pm

Yadadimean wrote:gotta agree with Billy and Milkdud on this one.

+1

Klinky · Post #18 » by **Klinky** » Tue Mar 18, 2008 12:06 am

Wow look what happens when we go two days without a Blazer game ;D! Craziness ensues. Seriously the sky was not falling two days ago. I don't think a knee jerk reaction is the best thing we can do. I think we all need to Chill.

I think Jack is gone this offseason & Nate is gone the next, but we'll see how it all turns out. Definitely next year will be a proving year for a lot of people on the team, including Nate.

ph1sh55 · Post #19 » by **ph1sh55** » Tue Mar 18, 2008 12:48 am

The only way nate is fired next year is if the blazers miss the playoffs next year. He will have 2 years with Oden at the least before any decision is made.

Yadadimean · Post #20 » by **Yadadimean** » Tue Mar 18, 2008 2:18 am

I think anybody who blames Nate for anything going wrong at certain times is vastly overestimating the talent on the roster. Yes he has his faults (as does every other coach in the league), but its not like there are not glaring weaknesses on the team either. Everything is going in the right direction. Have some damn patience. Things are only just starting to turn around. We weren't even supposed to be this good with no Randolph and no Oden this year. Relax a little.