OT- Remember how superior the Raps depth was?

[John Locke]

I think I made this comment back during the whole 'depth matters" argument. It DOES matter but here is the rub. It's not like NBA teams are going to be fielding untalented players. EVERY NBA player can play.

So what it comes down to is our 'second tier' so bad that it can't play with another teams 'second tier.' And the answer is (and it's the same for almost every team) no.

In the NBA there are alot of very good basketball players and a few great ones. The gap between our 4 - 12 and another teams is quite small.

Tennis is pretty similiar - as are most major sports. The 300th ranked tennis player is the world is STILL pretty awesome. Maybe he can't beat Federer on a regular basis but he damn well sure can hang with the #50 guy and probably beat him at on a fairly regular basis.

The 'depth matters' people werent' really claiming 'depth" matters as much as they were saying our guys who are the 50,52, 60 and 80 best players in the NBA are going to kick Eddie House and Leon Powe (a couple of 200+ guys) all over the place. That's simply not how it works.

The truth is many of these fan favorites who represent "depth" in the eyes of their fans are exendable and interchangable from an NBA standpoint. It's the stars that make all the difference.

Pete

Great post!

And to add on to it: The stars make other players better. For instance, Eddie House. He is being maximized in his role. He has a great shooting touch and can play pretty good D in our Defensive scheme (he atleast suprised me).

And that's what a lot of NBA fans fail to realize. It's better to play with superstars.

It doesn't matter if it's on offense or defense. Guys play with more confidence - more swagger. And that's a big part of the game.

It's often said that teams need guys 'who do the little things' to win. But, guys cannot concentrate on the 'little things' if they don't have stars taking care of the 'big things'.

Another thing that people didn't realize when the season was starting was the nature of Pierce's, Allen's and Garnett's personalities. People thought that those guys couldn't coexist (which I never understood). Here we have three guys who love to win. They know they need to sacrifice in order to do so. They were always on the same board.

But back to the depth debate. It is about having guys on the bench who specialize in some aspects of the game. And that is extremely important when you have three star players like we have. Now we have shooters (house..posey..add Sam I am), penetrators (Tony Allen), Rebounders (Powe, Davis) and etc.. We have guys who can concentrate on some aspects of the game. That is very important.

[Pistol Pete Vescey]

. . . and while it's fun to pile on the raptors, I also think it's important to have some sympathy for the difficult issues they're dealing with right now:

1) bargnani is suggesting more and more that he's a top pick in the class of kwame, joe smith, olowokandi, etc. and many raptor fans are having to come to grips with this painful reality; many were expecting him to a dirk-type and the fall from dirk to skita is painful indeed

2) tj ford's most recent spinal injury and history of spinal injuries makes it very unlikely that they will be able to trade him for anything close to value

3) calderon's remarkable and all-star-lite production as a starter has plummeted since ford's return; yet, as mentioned before ford is nearly impossible to move

4) garbajosa's injury and the possibility that he will never be the same player

this year has been a very painful crash back to reality for toronto fans and colangelo really has his work cut out for him.

[3pt %]

They will be able to move Ford, but not at the same level as what they gave up to get him.

Bargnani had a great stretch (10 games or so), and he is a still developing Big, so I'd say the Kwame/olowokandi comparison is a bit much.

I'd see him getting to a Bogut level over time, although with different strengths/weaknesses. A double double player with a couple of pretty good years.

[Pistol Pete Vescey]

They will be able to move Ford, but not at the same level as what they gave up to get him.

Bargnani had a great stretch (10 games or so), and he is a still developing Big, so I'd say the Kwame/olowokandi comparison is a bit much.

I'd see him getting to a Bogut level over time, although with different strengths/weaknesses. A double double player with a couple of pretty good years.

I hope you're right -- toronto is a great city and I think colangelo usually has the right idea, even if this season has cast some doubt on his decisions thus far. I wish the raptors good luck!

[TheCelticTruth]

i dont think its fun to pile on the raptors, but im glad weve proven their arguments wrong and shown how little one season can mean.

i dont recall boston fans ever celebrating a divison title and theres a certain number (16) that to me means we never should celebrate a DIVISION title

[DelMonte West]

Bargnani had a great stretch (10 games or so), and he is a still developing Big, so I'd say the Kwame/olowokandi comparison is a bit much.

I'd see him getting to a Bogut level over time, although with different strengths/weaknesses. A double double player with a couple of pretty good years.

I don't see any scenario that involves Bargs being a double/double guy in the near future, outside of playing north of 40 minutes on a consistant basis. People underestimate just how hard it is to grab that many boards, especially since Bargs camps out at the perimeter where the ball doesn't come back out off a miss. Other than them both being white I don't see any similarities to Bogut; Bogut's more of a bull in a china shop whereas Bargs is more of a rich man's Walter McCarty (hoo, that'll go over well) at this point.

I feel for their injuries but the general cockiness, arrogance, and condescending attitudes from some of their posters (NOT necessarily the majority) has been downright nauseating at times. The fact that they picked up Rudy Giuliani's "9/11 Tourette's Syndrome" in the form of "Depth" just makes it more ironic...it was all we heard over and over again, but you need a diversified roster that can do more than take jump shots to win.

[Truthiracy]

Raptors are the only team in the NBA in which I've never felt bad when they've had injuries. Too many fights with their fans to even feel remotely bad about them in any way.

[TheCelticTruth]

People underestimate just how hard it is to grab that many boards, especially since Bargs camps out at the perimeter where the ball doesn't come back out off a miss.

Bogut's more of a bull in a china shop whereas Bargs is more of a rich man's Walter McCarty (hoo, that'll go over well) at this point.

ive never seen anyone as lucky as dirk in the camping for rebounds category

also, that mccarty comparison is saddeningly, shockingly true to me, but id never thought of it

[DynastyInTheMaking]

Injuries are a part of basketball.