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JS: Redd "it's ridiculous, the overall situation"

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Post#41 » by EastSideBucksFan » Thu Mar 27, 2008 8:56 pm

How long is LK's contract?

Isn't it three years?

So he's going to get paid for the next two while not working?

Or do the Bucks get out of the contract if he gets another job?


LK should've been fired, but since Kohl is already paying two coaches this year (Stotts and LK) he probably refused to be paying three head coaches.
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Post#42 » by Chuck Diesel » Thu Mar 27, 2008 9:06 pm

xTitan wrote:-= original quote snipped =-



It was the classic example of the idiot owner being charmed by yet another guy he liked. I believe Larry K. played Kohl like a fiddle and got this job, this is why this team has zero chance with Kohl being the owner.

I know people in Dallas, I will say no thank you to Avery Johnson, he managed to totally burn out his team last year and this season he is clueless if he can't coach that way....Avery Johnson will end up coaching college if he has the guts for recruiting. Dallas is probably the biggest underachiever this year and that falls on Johnson........I laugh at the idea of anyone getting Mo Williams to play defense.



I have to agree with you on Johnson. I know Devin wasn't exactly fond of him and really preferred Don Nelson.
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Post#43 » by jerrod » Thu Mar 27, 2008 9:14 pm

are you a scapegoat if it is actually your fault?
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Post#44 » by xTitan » Thu Mar 27, 2008 9:17 pm

jerrod wrote:are you a scapegoat if it is actually your fault?


:rofl: ....well played
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Post#45 » by Sigra » Thu Mar 27, 2008 9:23 pm

Larry K is probably worst head coach in NBA at this moment. And yet I am happy that Bucks fired Stotts. If we still have Stotts as head coach majority of this board would talk about how Bogut sucks and how Mo and Redd kick asses. Stotts was making our guards look solid while Bogut looked bad. At least now majority of this board support Bogut and want to trade guards. That's improvement in my book although that improvement would hapen with any real coach as well. So, good decision to fire Stotts but bad decision to hire Larry K.
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Post#46 » by El Duderino » Thu Mar 27, 2008 9:28 pm

xTitan wrote:-= original quote snipped =-


I know people in Dallas, I will say no thank you to Avery Johnson, he managed to totally burn out his team last year and this season he is clueless if he can't coach that way....Avery Johnson will end up coaching college if he has the guts for recruiting. Dallas is probably the biggest underachiever this year and that falls on Johnson


And Cuban..He get all nervous because LA got Gasol and the Suns Shaq, so he went and made a mistake trading Harris for Kidd along with two first round picks.

Odds are Dallas wouldn't have won the West either way, but they aren't better now with Kidd than Harris and it hurts their future also.
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Post#47 » by xTitan » Thu Mar 27, 2008 9:31 pm

El Duderino wrote:-= original quote snipped =-



And Cuban..He get all nervous because LA got Gasol and the Suns Shaq, so he went and made a mistake trading Harris for Kidd along with two first round picks.

Odds are Dallas wouldn't have won the West either way, but they aren't better now with Kidd than Harris and it hurts their future also.


The problem with this is that Johnson hated Devin Harris, thought he had a low basketball IQ, and pushed hard for Kidd.
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Post#48 » by El Duderino » Thu Mar 27, 2008 9:40 pm

xTitan wrote:-= original quote snipped =-



The problem with this is that Johnson hated Devin Harris, thought he had a low basketball IQ, and pushed hard for Kidd.


If that's true and is why Cuban made the trade, it's yet another example of why i want no part of Herb hiring a coach and letting the guy be the GM also.
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Post#49 » by GrandAdmiralDan » Fri Mar 28, 2008 1:17 am

msiris wrote:You guys are funny. Make your minds up already. You get pissed when Redd chucks up bad shots and tries to take control of the 4th quarter. :D Its called T A N K I N G. With the Bucks luck they will be the 1st team to fall
from the 7th to 15th in the lotto. Stern is the :devil:.


I'm assuming you are joking here, but for people who don't realize, it is only possible for a team to move back 3 spots in the lottery.

That would mean 3 teams below you all moved up into the top 3, and the odds of that happening are EXTREMELY low. However, that is exactly what happened last season to Memphis, Boston, and Milwaukee. So it could happen. If that happens again though, PP25 is going to go into full Kevin Costner in JFK mode ;)

MFScho wrote:-= original quote snipped =-


It's what to be expected from this organization in every move they make, at least that's how it's been and I expected nothing less from the LK hire. The length of the deal was the most puzzling part about the situation for me. The most entertaining? Obviously having a MWC university dictate how we run our business. It would be nice to be proactive for a change and not be entirely reactive. I'm pretty sure once Kohl got the object of his obsession (LK) back in his life, there was no way he was going to give it up after such a short tenure.


Why was the length of the deal the most puzzling part?
It was a four year contract, but the last two years were each team options, so only the first two years were guaranteed, for somewhere between $1.5 mil and $1.8 mil each of the first two seasons. If he turned out to be a good coach, we would have him at a bargain for those final two years of that 4 year contract.

What was so puzzling about the length? Did you expect them to just give him a contract with just the first year guaranteed? I can't think of a team that does that. That would carry the perception of the coach immediately being a "lame duck" in his first season.

I kind of detest the whole anti-lame-duck practice of always making sure a coach or GM has more than one year remaining on his contract (i.e. what the Packers did with Sherman and what the Brewers did with Yost) when they are on the hot seat already. Everyone knew that Sherman might get fired after that season anyway, so the extension just meant that the Packers would have to eat that year if they did fire him. Same thing currently with Yost.

BUT. A new hire like LK is a different story. You don't just give them only one-year guaranteed right out of the gate.

EastSideBucksFan wrote:How long is LK's contract?

Isn't it three years?

So he's going to get paid for the next two while not working?

Or do the Bucks get out of the contract if he gets another job?


LK should've been fired, but since Kohl is already paying two coaches this year (Stotts and LK) he probably refused to be paying three head coaches.


He would be paying three head coaches if he had fired LK during the 07-08 season and brought in an additional coach not already on the staff.
But this is Stotts last season on the payroll, so if LK is fired, for the 08-09 season we will be paying two head coaches.

I wonder if Kohl realizes that the going "cheap" route doesn't save as much money as he thought it would.

He had to pay both Porter and Stotts for the 05-06 season, both Stotts and LK for the 07-08 season, and presumably both LK and the new coach for the 08-09 season. That's roughly $5 mil of waste from all that doubling up (there was doubling up in 03-04 and 04-05 due to George Karl, but that separation was unavoidable at that point.)

El Duderino wrote:-= original quote snipped =-



If that's true and is why Cuban made the trade, it's yet another example of why i want no part of Herb hiring a coach and letting the guy be the GM also.


It is true.
I actually reported this here after the 05-06 season right after Dallas was in the Finals.
Avery Johnson didn't like either Devin Harris or Marquis Daniels because he thought they weren't intelligent basketball players and wanted them both gone.

Most people at the time chose not to believe me and said I was crazy.
Then they did trade Marquis Daniels, but Cuban decided that they needed to keep Devin Harris. Finally Avery Johnson was able to convince Cuban to move out Devin Harris in the Kidd trade this season after the other significant Western Conference trades.
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Post#50 » by Chuck Diesel » Fri Mar 28, 2008 1:34 am

The strained relationship goes back to before those 05-06 playoffs. After Johnson replaced Nelson during 04-05 season he immediately rubbed Devin the wrong way, and Nelson didn't like Devin's pg game from the get go. Devin was not pleased with Avery Johnson during the summer after his rookie year.
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Post#51 » by paulpressey25 » Fri Mar 28, 2008 2:28 am

GrandAdmiralDan wrote:-=If that happens again though, PP25 is going to go into full Kevin Costner in JFK mode
.


I did see Clay Shaw meeting with Kohl and Walter a few months back.....and I knew there had to be a connection with David Ferrie and CV both having Alopecia...... ;)
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Post#52 » by Wise1 » Fri Mar 28, 2008 10:08 am

El Duderino wrote:-= original quote snipped =-



And Cuban..He get all nervous because LA got Gasol and the Suns Shaq, so he went and made a mistake trading Harris for Kidd along with two first round picks.

Odds are Dallas wouldn't have won the West either way, but they aren't better now with Kidd than Harris and it hurts their future also.


High comedy if the Nets make the playoffs and the Mavericks finish 9th in the west.
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Post#53 » by coolhandluke121 » Sat Mar 29, 2008 8:19 pm

Chuck Diesel wrote:The strained relationship goes back to before those 05-06 playoffs. After Johnson replaced Nelson during 04-05 season he immediately rubbed Devin the wrong way, and Nelson didn't like Devin's pg game from the get go. Devin was not pleased with Avery Johnson during the summer after his rookie year.


Count me as another huge Devin Detractor. Hate to say it but he's not a pg and he can't shoot, so he's fatally flawed as far as starting guards go. Good one-on-one defender though.
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Post#54 » by El Duderino » Sat Mar 29, 2008 8:31 pm

coolhandluke121 wrote:-= original quote snipped =-



Count me as another huge Devin Detractor. Hate to say it but he's not a pg and he can't shoot, so he's fatally flawed as far as starting guards go. Good one-on-one defender though.


I've never been a huge Devin fan, but the prior two seasons he shot 48/49 percent from the field It's true Kidd is a much better passer and natural PG than Harris is, but Kidd is a truly terrible shooter except on wide open threes and just doesn't score in general very well which is hurting Dallas. Plus, Harris is the better defender.
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Post#55 » by Chuck Diesel » Sat Mar 29, 2008 8:36 pm

I said "Nelson didn't like Devin's point guard game from the get go". Meant to say Johnson, not Nelson.
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Post#56 » by heynow » Sun Mar 30, 2008 1:42 am

Here is something that I think needs to be factored in.

Basketball involves more then scoring and making shots. A guy can score a lot of points and still be a liability to his team.
Clearly, LK preferred what other players provided during crunch time.
Maybe Redd's game is not what LK is looking for. Maybe he thinks he would rather have different types of players in his backcourt.
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Post#57 » by bcks fan » Sun Mar 30, 2008 2:44 am

showtimesam wrote:Haha, I just brought him up out of nowhere because you brought Bogut up out of nowhere.

So now you can see the error of your ways.


oh save us realgm message board messiah!!

loser.

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