The Josh Howard secret is out! And the Kidd trade too.

[floppymoose]

JoHo rules. There are two players on the team who have to be on the court for the Mavs to be better than their opponents: Dirk is one, Howard is the other.

[JES12]

JoHo rules. There are two players on the team who have to be on the court for the Mavs to be better than their opponents: Dirk is one, Howard is the other.

If you don't have a good PG, you are not going to be better than anyone else. If you don't believe me, ask the Clippers, the Sonics (Watson is over-rated), the Heat, Knicks or the Wolves.

You could even ask the Bucks or Bulls whose PGs (MoWilliams and Hinrich) have failed them this year.

Or Indy after Tinsley went down.

Or teams like Portland and Charlotte who could be a hell of a lot better if they had a real PG (sorry mmreg, Blake, Jack and Felton suck).

Or you could ask Philly now that Miller is not bothered by trade rumors anymore.

Hell, you could even ask Washington how they are playing once that SG playing the PG position went down to injury. That guy will never win a championship as long as he is playing the starting PG role.

[daoneandonly]

^^ Id still trade Kidd for him any day of the week if the Wizards were that supid.

[Deus]

Well, Simmons is right about one thing. The outcome. The Mavs will finish 9th and all summer they will be talking about firing Avery. But that isn't exactly new.

What's he is wrong about is why the Mavs are playing so poorly. It isn't Kidd and his lack of leadership. He is a leader. It isn't Dirk and I don't think Kobe was up for a trade last July. And it isn't the backups of Juwan Howard, Eddie Jones, Jamal Magloire, etc. Every team has backups that suck. Why do you think the Lakers lost 2 games at home this week.

There are 2 reasons why the Mavs are playing poorly. One is the tough conference they're in right now. You have 7 teams who could arguably goto the NBA Finals this year. That's unprecidented. The second is, I believe, a complete loss of confidence after last year's series against the Warriors. They busted their asses to get to 67-15 and then got whipped by a team that barely made the playoffs and by a guy who used to be their head coach. I also believe that Avery lost a little of his mojo after getting beat up by Nellie last year.

Mark needs to figure out who on the team that isn't going to bust his butt next season to win. Big changes need to be made this summer and thank god we have an owner that will make those changes. I believe in Mark. He's the man who knows what needs to be done.

[mrmreg]

If you don't have a good PG, you are not going to be better than anyone else. If you don't believe me, ask the Clippers, the Sonics (Watson is over-rated), the Heat, Knicks or the Wolves.

You could even ask the Bucks or Bulls whose PGs (MoWilliams and Hinrich) have failed them this year.

Or Indy after Tinsley went down.

Or teams like Portland and Charlotte who could be a hell of a lot better if they had a real PG (sorry mmreg, Blake, Jack and Felton suck).

I'm a little foggy on your point. From what I've read from you in the past you have been always 100% opposed to the Kidd trade, right? Yet this bit above seems to make the case for the Kidd trade. Whatever the array of Harris opinions may have been, most would agree he was never a "real PG". Kidd is most certainly a "real PG", so I guess I agree with you in that this is piece you need.

As for the trade, it may be a little hard to defend it at this juncture, but I'll still give it a whirl.

When Kidd got here Howard was in a terrible funk, yet he kept jacking it up there and single handedly lost a couple games. Howard finally started getting his act together and then Dirk goes down. Aside from the obvious loss of Dirk, this team has very little depth and that's been exposed as some of the spares on the bench have had to play more.

If/when Dirk gets back, and assuming Howard keeps his wheels on, I have a feeling this team just might come together and make a little more noise than most expect.

If they don't, the axe will surely fall swiftly on Avery. Hopefully Cuban and Little Whistle will get a coach in here that fits the talents of the team a little more. Little Whistle maybe?

If they do land in the lottery, I'd love to see my man Eric Gordon slide a little due to his late season funk and land firmly in the SG position here for the next decade. Really love to see Derrick Rose land here if that ping-pong ball were to take a lucky bounce. Let that dude play with Kidd a couple years and you'll likely have one monster PG. He shoots well enough for them to play together.

Haven't given up on this year though.

[studcrackers]

i watched a ton of IU games since im a fan and i wouldnt want gordon, he's a small 2 guard which is the last type of player i want. plus he needs to improve his shot selection, he'd help his career staying another year IMO though he'll still be a top 10 pick.

[JES12]

I'm a little foggy on your point. From what I've read from you in the past you have been always 100% opposed to the Kidd trade, right? Yet this bit above seems to make the case for the Kidd trade. Whatever the array of Harris opinions may have been, most would agree he was never a "real PG". Kidd is most certainly a "real PG", so I guess I agree with you in that this is piece you need.

You are foggy on my stance because you and I totally disagree and see things totally different; you can't see it the way I do. I still remember you makeing the absurd comment, Blake >>> Harris and the truth is Harris >>> Blake. Portland fans can't stand Blake and for good reason too...he just all out sucks!

Harris could, can and does have the ability to run the team the way a PG should. Because I classify people like Tony Parker, Kevin Johnson and Devin Harris as PGs and you (along with DDansby) don't is where we see differently. Do you have to avg 8-12 ast a game to be a PG? Hell no, but some see it that way. Should you be able to create for the other 4, hell yes! Devin did that by penetration to the hole, penetration for a kickout, the ability to shoot a jumper and dump off passes inside after penetrations(to Diop and Damp). He also force other teams to double him because he could always get past the first defender (something Kidd struggles at). Players like Kidd prefer to penetrate the ball only with precise passes while they still stand by the 3 pt line. Harris was an under-rated passer by most Mav fans and he is proving it in NJ away from Avery Johnson, though he still does not gamle with passes through tight traffic to where he expects players to be like Kidd does (the reason why Kidd is called a good passer and the same reason why his turnovers are high).

I may have been opposed to the Kidd trade because Harris is better that Kidd with the players we have and is younger that Kidd, but Kidd is still hands down better than any of the PGs listed on any of the teams on that post.

Maybe that clarifies it a little. If not, I don't know if we could ever understannd each other.

[JES12]

If/when Dirk gets back, and assuming Howard keeps his wheels on, I have a feeling this team just might come together and make a little more noise than most expect.

I was one of them who also predicted Dirk's injury being a blessing in disguise. This team relied on Dirk & Kidd carrying this team on their back after the trade was done. Now this team (coach included) is forced to find other players to step up and be an integral part of this team or we would be in the lotto. I think Howard has defiantly stepped up. Terry, Damp and Bass are still rotating games, but if we could have the big 3 of Dirk, Howard & Kidd with a rotating 4th guy, this team could be a darkhorse title contender. That is still, however, assuming Howard doesn't step back down after Dirk comes back.

[mrmreg]

You are foggy on my stance because you and I totally disagree and see things totally different; you can't see it the way I do. I still remember you makeing the absurd comment, Blake >>> Harris and the truth is Harris >>> Blake. Portland fans can't stand Blake and for good reason too...he just all out sucks!

I think I said Blake was a more pure PG and would have been a better fit for the Mavs than Harris. Not sure I said he was flat out better than Harris, but who knows, I was always pretty down on that Harris kid.

Harris could, can and does have the ability to run the team the way a PG should. Because I classify people like Tony Parker, Kevin Johnson and Devin Harris as PGs and you (along with DDansby) don't is where we see differently. Do you have to avg 8-12 ast a game to be a PG? Hell no, but some see it that way. Should you be able to create for the other 4, hell yes!

And I would say the single best way to quantify a PGs ability to create shots for the other 4 is the assist stat.

I read where Tom Crean kept a stat called a "Marquette assist" where the player makes a pass that leads to a good shot, whether the shot is made or not. It would be good to see a stat like that for comparison.

Devin did that by penetration to the hole, penetration for a kickout, the ability to shoot a jumper and dump off passes inside after penetrations(to Diop and Damp). He also force other teams to double him because he could always get past the first defender (something Kidd struggles at). Players like Kidd prefer to penetrate the ball only with precise passes while they still stand by the 3 pt line. Harris was an under-rated passer by most Mav fans and he is proving it in NJ away from Avery Johnson, though he still does not gamle with passes through tight traffic to where he expects players to be like Kidd does (the reason why Kidd is called a good passer and the same reason why his turnovers are high).

Devin's had a few nice games assist-wise, and there may be a little something to the Avery holding him back thing, but his turnover numbers are up as well. I do think Kidd penetrates a lot more than you give him credit. No question that Kidd is a daredevil with his passes, and he's going to turn it over. With all the positve things he does, that's fine.

One myth that's really been blown out of the water is that Harris was so much better a defender than Kidd. I'd say that been shown to be dramatically the reverse.

I may have been opposed to the Kidd trade because Harris is better that Kidd with the players we have and is younger that Kidd, but Kidd is still hands down better than any of the PGs listed on any of the teams on that post.

Harris is younger

Maybe that clarifies it a little. If not, I don't know if we could ever understannd each other.

I doubt we'll ever reach agreement on Harris.

[your_dallas_mavericks]

Let's move on from Harris gentlemen, he's no longer with the team...