The most enraging and preposterously underrated...

DWillBooz467 · Post #41 » by **DWillBooz467** » Thu Apr 3, 2008 3:24 am

Bgil wrote:
This guy is 1-2, 2-1 with CP3 career wise. Nuff said.

Rose?

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Most of the guys on your list are on it because they get great stats but do little to make their team win. I'll take a guy like Artest or Battier, who changes the complexion of a team over a guy like Martin who just puts up great solo numbers.

LMAO at Deron Williams not helping his team win. Have you ever watched the Jazz play? :rofl:

He is the reason the Jazz are winning. :nonono:

Post #42 » by **KF10** » Thu Apr 3, 2008 3:41 am

G35 wrote:This might be the only time I ever bag on Kevin Martin because he is one of my top 10 players to watch.

Buuuuttt I have him on many fantasy basketball teams and besides shooting he doesn't do much of anything and he has a lot turnovers.

In his last 3 games he's gotten 4 rebounds. He gives out 2.1 assists and 2.1 turnovers. In his last 16 games he's gotten 8 steals.

He is an extremely efficient scorer but now he needs to start rounding out his game or he's just gonna be the Michael Redd of the Western Conference......

Yeah, Martin is an extremely efficient scorer. Yeah, it is kinda true that he needs to be more well rounded. But I have seen ALL Martin's game since his rookie year. As of late (even though the #'s doesnt shows it) but he has shown promise on his passing abilities. Knowing that he is drawing defensive attention, his assist will be higher...He usually does his usual drive-and-kick to the open man and etc...Regardless, he has excellent court awareness for a SG. Even in college until now he has shown that. Even though, he has the TOTAL package on offense, he still lacks a turnaround shot in the post. If he works on these issues (Knowing that he is a gym rat and has ACTUALLY promised to do it) I wont be surprised if he has a statline of 25/5/4 by next year. While being potency efficient.

Bgil · Post #43 » by **Bgil** » Thu Apr 3, 2008 3:45 am

DWillBooz467 wrote:-= original quote snipped =-

LMAO at Deron Williams not helping his team win. Have you ever watched the Jazz play? He is the reason the Jazz are winning.

LMAO at you taking "most guys on that list" to mean Deron. IIRC there were a ton of other players on that list other than Deron. You do realize that most != all, right?

caborn · Post #44 » by **caborn** » Thu Apr 3, 2008 3:49 am

Elton Brand is very underrated. When healthy, he's a top 10 PF.

Also, Josh Smith. I remember reading the BSPN 'Top Players under 23' and Josh only had one damn vote...and it was for wildcard.

Bgil · Post #45 » by **Bgil** » Thu Apr 3, 2008 3:50 am

kingsfan10 wrote:-= original quote snipped =-

Yeah, Martin is an extremely efficient scorer. Yeah, it is kinda true that he needs to be more well rounded. But I have seen ALL Martin's game since his rookie year. As of late (even though the #'s doesnt shows it) but he has shown promise on his passing abilities. Knowing that he is drawing defensive attention, his assist will be higher...He usually does his usual drive-and-kick to the open man and etc...Regardless, he has excellent court awareness for a SG. Even in college until now he has shown that. Even though, he has the TOTAL package on offense, he still lacks a turnaround shot in the post. If he works on these issues (Knowing that he is a gym rat and has ACTUALLY promised to do it) I wont be surprised if he has a statline of 25/5/4 by next year. While being potency efficient.

Putting up 5 assists and 4-5 rebounds doesn't make you "well rounded". I don't doubt that K-Mart can get those numbers but a lot of guys in the NBA can without being well rounded. Ricky Davis put up 20/5/5 with Minnesota and his decision making ability is crap.
Some guys put up 5 assists (or less) and are fantastic passers while others put those numbers up and are average to below average.

Post #46 » by **KF10** » Thu Apr 3, 2008 4:00 am

Bgil wrote:-= original quote snipped =-

Putting up 5 assists and 4-5 rebounds doesn't make you "well rounded". I don't doubt that K-Mart can get those numbers but a lot of guys in the NBA can without being well rounded. Ricky Davis put up 20/5/5 with Minnesota and his decision making ability is crap.
Some guys put up 5 assists (or less) and are fantastic passers while others put those numbers up and are average to below average.

Umm, yeah it does. Martin is no stat paddler. He is the real deal. And using a comparison of Davis is irreverent in this discussion. He is the perfect example of a stat paddler.

If you dont think Martin has the ability to put those numbers. You should see more Kings games. 25 points is easy for Martin (He is averaging ~28 points when he is #1 option) Martin is averaging close to 5 boards anyways. 4 assists (He is averaging 2 assists w/ current passing abilities) even though, his role his scoring...currently...

tmorgan · Post #47 » by **tmorgan** » Thu Apr 3, 2008 4:09 am

LOL at "stat paddler". That brings up all kinds of weird images of Amare's mother.

Cruel_Ruin · Post #48 » by **Cruel_Ruin** » Thu Apr 3, 2008 4:10 am

What I want to know is where this myth of Martin being a stat-padder came from. There's plenty of flaws in his game to knock (No all-around game, looking for contact too much, not trying on defense), but being a chucker is not one of them :-?

Duiz · Post #49 » by **Duiz** » Thu Apr 3, 2008 6:29 am

Cruel_Ruin wrote:What I want to know is where this myth of Martin being a stat-padder came from. There's plenty of flaws in his game to knock (No all-around game, looking for contact too much, not trying on defense), but being a chucker is not one of them

See this is exactly what I am talking about. All throughout this thread people keep bringing down Kevin Martin, Deron Williams, and to an extent others. And people say they get a lot of love and media attention. Bull$%&#!

And no guys, Kevin Martin isn't a stat paddler. Watch 15+ games, and then you get the right to say anything to discredit him. These aren't his career highs like Carmelo Anthony, these are his averages.

Bgil · Post #50 » by **Bgil** » Thu Apr 3, 2008 7:00 am

kingsfan10 wrote:-= original quote snipped =-
If you dont think Martin has the ability to put those numbers. You should see more Kings games. 25 points is easy for Martin (He is averaging ~28 points when he is #1 option) Martin is averaging close to 5 boards anyways. 4 assists (He is averaging 2 assists w/ current passing abilities) even though, his role his scoring...currently...

You need to work on your reading comphrension. You quoted me as saying, "I don't doubt that K-Mart can get those numbers...".

Umm, yeah it does. Martin is no stat paddler. He is the real deal. And using a comparison of Davis is irreverent in this discussion. He is the perfect example of a stat paddler.

Davis didn't stat pad with Minnesota. He may not be great but I think he played as well as he possibly could and gave it 100%. Besides, Earl Watson averages nearly 7 assists and he's REALLY not THAT good. Jaric averages more than 4 assists in 30 minutes at the two spot.
In many cases, 5 assists doesn't mean much. In some cases, it means a lot (Vince for example).

Post #51 » by **SOUL** » Thu Apr 3, 2008 7:05 am

playjredz wrote:Kevin Martin scores without taking shots because he flops all the time and goes to the foul line. I hate watching him play.

lol WHAT!?

Duiz · Post #52 » by **Duiz** » Thu Apr 3, 2008 7:12 am

The only player who I underrated by not having him on the list of Underrated players is David West.

But I am still kinda surprised by how many people resist Kevin Martin. The guy is probably gonna lead the league in scoring one day once the rotation settles down for the kings.

Post #53 » by **SOUL** » Thu Apr 3, 2008 7:15 am

He was in the allstar game though, can't really be underrated there. By fans yes but only a few players are actually marketable to every kind of fan out there.

Jemini80 · Post #54 » by **Jemini80** » Thu Apr 3, 2008 7:31 am

doesn't he score 25 ppg on like 14 shots? How is that stat padding, especially considering that is the only stat he contributes in. His contract is very bad btw, it only looks good because of the moronic contracts Ray Allen, Redd, and Allan Houston have gotten in the past.

Ming Kong! · Post #55 » by **Ming Kong!** » Thu Apr 3, 2008 10:35 am

Good thread. I'd like to throw out another that's hugely underrated: Mike Dunleavy Jr.

He has been tagged bust from day one, but not he's finally lost that.

18.6ppg 5.2rpg 3.4apg 1.0spg. He also shoots great all around: .477 .415 .842.

His splits are even more impressive:

March (15 games): 21.6ppg 4.5rpg 3.8apg 1spg .6bpg, while shooting .493 .554 .852

He might play for a bad team, but he's right behind Granger who has 18.9. He'll probably average around similar numbers to Hedo next year, and hopefully a new management can turn things around in Indiana, especially with a great upcomming draft pick for them (imagine with a little luck them slipping into a top 5 pick, though their projected 10th wont be bad either.